Learning How to Reload

[LaHunter]

I shot factory Federal Premium ammo for years before I started reloading. Every single one of these factory ammo primers were always flattened after being fired in my M700 7mm mag. Fired primer inspection is something that I always do with my loads, but I think it is more of a relative parameter as long as you aren't getting some type of more dramatic deformation. The primers in my spent cases of my hand loads look identical to the spent primers from the factory ammo I shot in the past; flattened. I use federal primers and always have, so I am not sure how other brands of primers would look. You also need to pay close attention to any changes in how the bolt handle lifts after firing (hard to lift) as well as inspect your fired brass closely.

Hope this helps

 

[TheJuice]

It does. I will go ahead and load some at 56.0 as I have had no sign of a stiff bolt lift.
What do you guys think of the H414 I've been using. Should I try a faster powder for the 150's. I recently read that slower powders are for heavier bullets.

 

[Jason Snyder]

It does. I will go ahead and load some at 56.0 as I have had no sign of a stiff bolt lift.
What do you guys think of the H414 I've been using. Should I try a faster powder for the 150's. I recently read that slower powders are for heavier bullets.

My Barnes load data for the 150 TSX shows a maximum charge of 60 grains with the H414. Not knowing how flat the primers are, the automatic disclaimer to be careful applies. However, I've found all of the Barnes bullets seem to like hot loads. I would certainly be happy with the grouping you're getting, but increase a bit and see what happens. Maybe go up in 1/2 grain increments and see how they respond.

 

[TheJuice]

Yeah Jason. I'm really happy with some of these groups. I'm I'm process of loading more of the same and mess with a little hotter loads and seating depth.

 

[JP100]

Yeah Jason. I'm really happy with some of these groups. I'm I'm process of loading more of the same and mess with a little hotter loads and seating depth.

Looks like you are on the right track and have things working well. Just a tip it is best to sort your seating depth before your powder weights. If you are at a max powder and you change your seating depth this will change the pressure. so what may be a safe maximum at a short length may be too much pressure as the projectile approaches the lands.
An easy cheap way to find cartridge OAL is by using a cleaning rod. All you do is on a empty chamber with the bolt closed is run a cleaning rod down the muzzle until it touches the bolt face and mark this on the rod with a pen.
Then remove the bolt and carefully drop a projectile into the chamber so it is on the lands, then run the cleaning rod down the muzzle again until it just touches the projectile and mark it again with a pen. remove the cleaning rod and measure the distance between the two marks. this is your Max OAL and just work your way back until you find the sweet spot. A dummy round liek you have made works fine aswell. but if you are trying different projectiles you have to make up alot of dummy rounds. hope that makes sense.

 

[JP100]

I would also try and find a reloading manual not made by a company that makes reloading gear. A man called Nick Harvey(an Australian) makes great reloading manuals and they are not based around one gear brand(un biased)

 

[TheJuice]

Thanks JP100. That makes sense.
In my case my cartridge OAL is limited by the magazine. Which have kept all the bullets I've tried so far, out if the lands. I will be experimenting with setting the bullets deeper.

 

[TheJuice]

So in pursuit to learn more about chasing accuracy, I noticed when I have the action screws loosened up, the action was able to move back and forth on the recoil lug, ever so slightly. I inspected the recoil lug and noticed the the impression mark from recoil I have read so much about.
So I ended up buying a steel lug and pillar kit and some Devcon 10110 and proceeded to bed the factory wood stock. The bedding may not have been necessary as the lug alone fit great and tightened things up real well.
But since I have a "need" to tinker, I decided to bed anyway. I'm pretty pleased with the results and anxious to get back out to the range.

 

[Justin Crossley]

Nice work. It looks really good.

 

[MRidge]

It's already been covered a bit, but just food for thought especially on a "hunting" rifle.
As mentioned each barrel / combo will like a particular seating depth. I've never "crimped" a round either, but have seen bullets vibrate out of the case when being carried for long periods on an atv. Secondly I'd never seat a bullet into the lands on my hunting rig. You'll lodge a bullet in the barrel at the absolute worst time in the field when removing a live round from the chamber.

 

[TheJuice]

Thanks Justin.
MRidge. I agree. Fortunately, with this rifle, the magazine length limits my OAL in a manner, with the bullets I have loaded thus far, that if it fits in the mag, they won't reach the lands.

 

[MRidge]

Jon -
I have a fairly large stable of Remington 700's
Almost every one of them is a single shot due to that exact issue -

 

[TheJuice]

So, I'm looking into concentricity gauges to check my reloads.
Which ones do you guys use?

 

[AZ Vince]

So, I'm looking into concentricity gauges to check my reloads.
Which ones do you guys use?

I use the Hornady Concentricity Gauge.

 

[ST52v]

Maybe AZVince could verify what my brother(hot rod) found with his Hornady gauge. Try seating your bullet a little at a time and rotating the case 1/4-1/3 each time. When my brother did this he found run out to be very minimal. I would spend the $100 on something else. Do you have the comparator set of gauges? Magneto speed will release their v1 in a few months for around $200. Maybe my brother will give you a good deal on his. Just my opinion, it's a neat tool to play with if you have everything else that is important!!

 

[TheJuice]

Hopefully someone can explain what just happened here.

Went out to the range yesterday to shoot some new loads at 200yds. Had a completely clean barrel, so I loaded up a known load to get the barrel warm and slightly carbon fouled before shooting new loads for data. I had one flyer, that was the first cold bore fouler, and the next four shot incredibly well. BT 150 over 57.5g of IMR 4350.

I'm thinking. This going to be a great day. The next groups are on the white targets I use to record data, and I'll be danged if they are the worst groups I have shot in my life!! I've never had factory ammo, let alone any of my reloads shoot so terrible, you could hardly tell were I was aiming. AB 165 over 57.5g, 58.0g, 58.5g IMR 4350.

Now the loads were all loaded at the same time. I neck sized the cases and seated all bullets .020 of the lands. The BT 150's were in FC cases. The AB 165 were in Winchester cases. I did notice when loading that the Winchester's had very little neck tension compared to the FC.
I came back to the house and realized I could unseat some of the AB's with, considerable effort, my bare hands!!! So I measured the neck wall thickness of the fired brass and found the FC to be .013 and the Winchester to be .013-.012.

Could this have caused these crazy results or did my scope happen to fail between strings? What else should I consider?

View attachment 25573

 

[GKPrice]

sometimes vertical stringing is from stock contact and upward pressure on the barrel - shooting form is important as well, get used to "style" and stay with it, Tikkas being pretty lightweight often shoot better from the bench being held at the from of the fore end (NOT the barrel) rather than allowing the rifle to free recoil - I am curious why you've not given 180 grain bullets a try ? if elk is on the menu you'd be cheating yourself but then one cannot argue with a rifle's preferences either - I'd have to say that, and there is no criticism whatsoever intended here, you are attacking this zealously, and I've done exactly the same myself, but if you make more than one change at a time in load development then you have no way of knowing what worked and what wasn't needed, slow down just a little and enjoy the process for what it is, a great hobby

Finally, as far as bedding the stock goes, Tikka has a pretty unique system which I have found to be very well engineered - a company in MT, Mountain Tactical, has gotten very specific on their Tikka performance enhancement products, they sell a "kit" that has SS pillars for pillar bedding Tikka stocks,a SS recoil lug and after market action screws that's not too much money - I will still agree with Justin that it's probably not needed but I have a feeling that you will be doing something to the stock anyway and this is as clean and simple a way as there is to remove the doubt although free floating that barrel channel would be the first quick and easy step I take in chasing that "vertical stringing"

 

[GKPrice]

I forgot to mention that Sierra has, or at least used to sell, a tutorial by David Tubb in video form that covers everything one will ever need to practice for precision loading, outlining what he thinks works and what really isn't needed

 

[TheJuice]

Thanks for the input GK,

I have done every one of the mods to the stock as you have suggested, see post #28 of this thread. I have shot both with the for end down against the front rest and was letting the gun 'free recoil' on this session. Yes the gun jumps a little but settles back down and I can retain a good sight picture. Also the first 5 shot group was shoot exactly like the others.

The reason for the 5-150 grain loads was simply to warm up with a proven load and foul the barrel before shooting test loads.

I'm just wondering if the loose neck tension would have such a wild spraying effect. I have shot other very similar loads with good sub-moa results, granted these previous loads were shot a 100yds.

What gets me is this rifle has been consistently sub-moa with all but a few loads, even then they are rarely larger than 1.5 at 100yds.

I have had some good 180 grain loads that have been in the .50-.75 range. But for what ever reason this gun has always liked the 150's over 180's

I understand this is really good accuracy for a stock blue collar rifle and I'm not complaining, just curious as to the uncharacteristic behavior of the last 9 shots.

I may just reload these same loads, but full size the case and make sure the neck tension is tighter. We'll see.

I think I may have read some of David Tubbs stuff before. If memory serves me, he breaks it down to the basics pretty well.