Laying a small area in pavers or flagstone question

[MuleyFever]

OK, one for the landscapers or DIYers.

I want to make a small area into a sitting area in my back yard. This is a small spot just big enough for 2 chairs with a spot for the dog in between. I want to use large pavers or flagstone. Given the size, do I really need to dig out 8" and lay gravel and sand and all that? This will be a very low traffic area, again, just used for a couple of chairs to sit and have a drink/watch the sunset. Everything you read about laying pavers or stone goes into the whole proper way. Given the small size and low traffic is it really necessary?

 

[Floater00]

Remove any sod or loose material, then spread and tamp a couple inches of manufactured sand/paver sand/stone dust (different names in different areas). Set your pavers/stones in the sand you'll be fine. Use a polymeric bonding sand between to joints to help lock the pavers/stones in and to help keep out weeds.

 

[CorbLand]

Probably not necessary but I will say, I would weigh it out. It’s significantly easier to do it the first time. There is nothing worse than uneven pavers.

 

[jayhawk]

Remove any sod or loose material, then spread and tamp a couple inches of manufactured sand/paver sand/stone dust (different names in different areas). Set your pavers/stones in the sand you'll be fine. Use a polymeric bonding sand between to joints to help lock the pavers/stones in and to help keep out weeds.

This ^^

 

[TSAMP]

Agreed. If it's undisturbed soil and has decent drainage you'll be fine. Don't go overboard.

 

[Customweld]

Getting down into free draining soil is important to help shed rain/storm water. Laying them on a few inches of pea gravel makes leveling and setting them much easier. If you don’t have a good base, you’ll fight the buggers until you’re sick of dealing with them.

 

[EastHumboldt]

You know what they say. If you don’t have the time to do it right, where are you going to find the time to do it over.

 

[JDowning]

You know what they say. If you don’t have the time to do it right, where are you going to find the time to do it over.

If you're near Fort Collins I'd be happy to take a look and give you my $.02

Flagstone is a lot more forgiving. You can lay it a little uneven and call it rustic, or cottage style, if you are ok with that end product. However I wouldn't recommend this if anyone who is unstable on their feet will be walking in this area. You can spend more time cutting for fit and leveling the stone if you want a nicer finished product.

Pavers on the other hand don't look good unless they are done right. They need to be laid down perfectly before you compact them, or any unevenness, mistakes, etc will telegraph through and be evident.

We remove all organic matter to a depth of at least 7" below the top surface of the paver patio. Then compact the dirt with a plate compactor, and continue with the instructions it seems you have already read/watched.

A fancy, curvy paver patio will cost $50/ sq ft. A really nice flagstone patio will cost less than half that.

 

[camping1601]

Dig it out and put stone in. Drainage is the number one cause of pavers moving.

 

[9.1]

When you're looking at drainage, consider how much upslope area is contributing runoff. If it's in an elevated spot you'll have fewer potential issues and you can get away with not digging out much subgrade. If it's in a low area that gets some water from a hillside , downspouts, etc. then you might want to dig it out.

 

[Rich M]

Up north, we used to use this rock product they called crushed run or crush & run. Basically like a crushed slate. It was easy to put down and compacted easy, stayed level, etc. We used it for driveways and walk/sitting areas. You could frame the spot w PT 2x4 or 2x6 and put some crushed or small rock in there.

We do a lot of mulch down here - wife likes it, and if you change yer mind, wait a year or two and it is grass again.

Or maybe do a 4-inch concrete slab? You can die the concrete, and you can trace a pattern into it - i.e. make it look like pavers.

If you are stuck on pavers - take the time to do everything right or they shift and get all uneven rather quickly. Framing the area w PT wood will also reduce the drainage issues.

And you thought it was an easy question! Enjoy your sitting area, nothing like a campfire or watching the sun go down.

 

[MuleyFever]

If you're near Fort Collins I'd be happy to take a look and give you my $.02

Flagstone is a lot more forgiving. You can lay it a little uneven and call it rustic, or cottage style, if you are ok with that end product. However I wouldn't recommend this if anyone who is unstable on their feet will be walking in this area. You can spend more time cutting for fit and leveling the stone if you want a nicer finished product.

Pavers on the other hand don't look good unless they are done right. They need to be laid down perfectly before you compact them, or any unevenness, mistakes, etc will telegraph through and be evident.

We remove all organic matter to a depth of at least 7" below the top surface of the paver patio. Then compact the dirt with a plate compactor, and continue with the instructions it seems you have already read/watched.

A fancy, curvy paver patio will cost $50/ sq ft. A really nice flagstone patio will cost less than half that.

I am in UT and I thought about flagstone because I thought it may be more forgiving.

 

[MuleyFever]

When you're looking at drainage, consider how much upslope area is contributing runoff. If it's in an elevated spot you'll have fewer potential issues and you can get away with not digging out much subgrade. If it's in a low area that gets some water from a hillside , downspouts, etc. then you might want to dig it out.

It is an elevated spot with a slight slope. It has a 6' wall directly behind it and a tree on one one side so it is actually shielded from the rain a bit. Not that we get much rain here in UT.

I will post a pic when I get home tonight.

 

[Alloy]

"polymeric bonding sand"...
Never knew this existed. But is be willing to give it a try for the same kind of project.

 

[*zap*]

2x4 treated frame and dig out for clean gravel with sand on top of that. Compact the gravel. If it is a small area or big area..... just do it right. Notch the end of a 2x4 screed to get the sand smooth and the right depth. Shortcuts come back to bit you in the butt later.

 

[MuleyFever]

This is the area. It slopes down pretty much right in front of the chairs. The ground is very rocky as well. I can barely dig a hole. One reason I don't want to dig it out.

 

[*zap*]

I would rake the river rock back, thrown in a rectangular 2x4 form and pour a small concrete pad from bag mix....ymmv.

 

[MuleyFever]

I would rake the river rock back, thrown in a rectangular 2x4 form and pour a small concrete pad from bag mix....ymmv.

How deep would I want the pad to be? Would I need to go 4"?

 

[*zap*]

2x4 is 3.5" that would be fine.

 

[Rich M]

It seems like the easiest route. Pad will last a long time.