Layering for the hike up

[Erussell01]

I like the Black Diamond Alpine Start- good breathability and pretty good water resistance (light precip). It's about double the weight (7-ish ounces) of the very ultralight wind shirts, but the fabric is more durable and more suitable to hunting vs the 4 oz ones. If you can find one (getting rare these days) Patagonia made one for the military that is in the same ballpark of performance of the Alpine Start- eBay is the only place I've seen them.

I will absolutely be on the lookout, thanks! I have a Marmot precip, do you feel like that is similar?

 

[mfllood3800]

No not when on top.
I don't like hiking with bottom base layers though.

My 2 puffies are not thick at all.
I need the 2 base layers for the added warmth.
But mostly so I can shed either the long or short Sleeve depending on type of weather it turns out to be.
Usually keep the long and pack the short.
None of my tops are bulky at all.
I hate carrying bulky excess tops in my pack all day.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

 

[mtwarden]

I will absolutely be on the lookout, thanks! I have a Marmot precip, do you feel like that is similar?

Precip is a lightweight hardshell (rain jacket), the Alpine Start is a completely different animal- many times more breathable, but still cuts the wind- but not a substitute for a rain jacket if it's raining hard.

 

[Wyobohunter]

This year I'm going in for 3 or 4 days and I want to save myself the extra miles in and out. Last year we truck camped and we did so many more miles than we needed to just going back and forth. Unbeknownst to me my buddy was afraid to sleep out there and he wanted to be off the mountain before dark every night. This year, I'm going in and staying in.

Now that we know what you are doing (3-4 days backpacking) and when (September) it’d be helpful to know roughly where you are going. What state/part of the state and elevation do you intend to camp? So far I’d stick with the minimum and maybe add that mid layer at most. I’ll take another look at your list and look up the stuff that I don’t know about. Then I’ll make a separate post with a list of what I would/wouldn’t bring and why.

 

[mtwarden]

We've been mainly talking upper layers, but a really nice bottom option is the Peloton 97 zip off bottoms

I purchased a pair after being very impressed with the 97 hoody (5 oz); the zip off part I thought was basically a gimmick. One especially cold morning (on top of the Chinese Wall in the Bob Marshall) I didn't want to take the bottoms off, so started hiking in them. Of course eventually it warmed up and needed to shed them. Thinking crap- shoes off, gaiters off, pants off and then all back on. I remembered the zip off feature, again thinking it wasn't going to work. Pants down, unzip each side, off they come- voila! They actually work and work well.

All for 4.5 oz; I think for a September trip in the mountains there's a better than fair chance they'd see some use and when they aren't needed any longer, zip them off!

 

[Wyobohunter]

Ok. I looked at your stuff. Here’s what I’d do. Wear the base layer and pants for the hike up. If you don’t get warm enough after a mile or so stop and throw on the mid layer. As I said, here’s what I’d bring and not bring if I had the options you listed. Bring it all but leave the “don’t bring backpacking” stuff in the truck. Then if needed you could change it.

Bring Backpacking

• Kuiu 125 if it is long sleeve because you can push long sleeves up if needed. This would be your base top.
• Sitka core light bottoms. Unless you buy some nice performance boxers. I think long underwear are a little warm for September but these would work.
• Sitka core light hoodie. At only about 7 ounces this would make a great mid layer. And it has a hood. I wish my mid layer had a hood.
• Sitka heavyweight hoodie is advertised at 15 ounces. That’s not bad if it’s pretty warm. Bring this or your puffy jacket for your stationary insulation. Whichever weighs less.
• Kuiu attack pants. DWR pants are the best all around choice for the Rockies IMO. No need for separate rain pants. This is you lower shell and always worn.
• Marmot precip rain jacket. Looks like a great upper shell and is pretty lightweight at an advertised 10 ounces.

Don’t Bring Backpacking

• 100% polyester short sleeve t. Because you can’t pull short sleeves down. No bug, Sun or chill protection.
• Light weight 100% scent blocker polyester zip t. Same as above. And scent blocker stuff is of very little use for elk IMO. Hunt the wind.
• Kuiu ultra merino 145 hoodie. Because it’s on the heavy side for a September mid layer at over 9 ounces. But doesn’t seem quite warm enough for your insulation. It’d probably be a great mid layer for mid-late October.
• Columbia 100 wt fleece quarter zip. Regular old fleece can soak up a lot of water and wet out. I don’t feel it’s worthy of taking backpacking if you have better options. That being said, I used fleece a lot when I had less money and never really had a bad experience.
• Soft shell vest (simms). Soft shell uppers are kind of waterproof for a little while but they are heavy.
• Simms soft shell jacket. Same as above. I wouldn’t fiddle with soft shell stuff backpacking. This would be very nice in basecamp along with your fleece.

 

[Erussell01]

Precip is a lightweight hardshell (rain jacket), the Alpine Start is a completely different animal- many times more breathable, but still cuts the wind- but not a substitute for a rain jacket if it's raining hard.

Gotcha, looks like I have some digging to do! I sweat hard in that precip. Doesn't breath well enough for me to run up hill in it haha

 

[Erussell01]

Now that we know what you are doing (3-4 days backpacking) and when (September) it’d be helpful to know roughly where you are going. What state/part of the state and elevation do you intend to camp? So far I’d stick with the minimum and maybe add that mid layer at most. I’ll take another look at your list and look up the stuff that I don’t know about. Then I’ll make a separate post with a list of what I would/wouldn’t bring and why.

Ah man that would be really helpful!

My first trip of the year is archery elkthe first week of September to Idaho, specifically the beaverhead zone on the border of Montana. It's south of Salmon near the town of Leadore. Cool country. I'll be there for 8 days, so thinking two 3-4 day hunts unless there are no elk where they were last year, then I will day hunt .

Then I'm off to SD for archery muledeer (or whitetails) the end of September and the 3rd weekend of October. This will be a power run of long weekends.

If we draw again, my wife and I will be back in Wyoming antelope hunting the 3rd week of October (and then pheasant hunting our way home again if we are lucky)
Would be cool to run one system for all of it including the pheasant hunting.

 

[Erussell01]

We've been mainly talking upper layers, but a really nice bottom option is the Peloton 97 zip off bottoms

I purchased a pair after being very impressed with the 97 hoody (5 oz); the zip off part I thought was basically a gimmick. One especially cold morning (on top of the Chinese Wall in the Bob Marshall) I didn't want to take the bottoms off, so started hiking in them. Of course eventually it warmed up and needed to shed them. Thinking crap- shoes off, gaiters off, pants off and then all back on. I remembered the zip off feature, again thinking it wasn't going to work. Pants down, unzip each side, off they come- voila! They actually work and work well.

All for 4.5 oz; I think for a September trip in the mountains there's a better than fair chance they'd see some use and when they aren't needed any longer, zip them off!

Nonkidding... how often do you run the. In the earlier seasons? That sounds incredibly useful for when it starts cold and gets hot! I will absolutely look into them

 

[fngTony]

Nonkidding... how often do you run the. In the earlier seasons? That sounds incredibly useful for when it starts cold and gets hot! I will absolutely look into them

Those 97 zip offs are probably the most versatile thing I have. I can wear them while my pants dry and not have to bring rain pants, sleep in them, where them for a few hours in the morning. Here’s a trick, leave the leg zips down enough so that your hip vents line up, that way you can still dump heat and prolong taking them off

 

[mtwarden]

the 97 zipoffs for 4.5 oz are really useful- can put them on at night if it's chilly (including in your bag); if your going to be doing some glassing for awhile- very nice; taking off on a cold morning knowing they can be taken off in about 60 seconds

to me they're really good insurance even on a September hunt- it can get very cold even in September

 

[woods89]

I do most of my elk hunting late these days, but I have backpack hunted in September. It would have to be quite cold for me to leave my tent in more than a light baselayer top, windshirt, and a pair of Kuiu Attacks. I do overheat pretty easy. I would wear my puffy right up to walking away.
Starting cold is one of the biggest lessons I've learned down the line of being comfortable in the backcountry. It will feel pretty brutal for about 150 yds, and then all of a sudden you'll be comfortable.
I will say, my limited recent experience with Polartec Alpha Direct has me thinking it would get a lot of use on that type of hunt, but I still wouldn't wear it while hiking hard or up significant vertical, unless it's really cold.

 

[Newtosavage]

I start the day with my Smartwool long sleeve layer and a down puffy vest and I usually shed that puffy by mile 1. Then it's just the Smartwool layer. I run hot and have worn just that one layer while hiking in down to 15 degrees.

 

[5MilesBack]

That sounds incredibly useful for when it starts cold and gets hot!

Maybe others are different, but if I started with those.......I'd have to remove them within 100 yards into my hiking. That's why I start lean and then add when I stop if needed. The only time I get cold, is when I'm not on the move. Which is probably why I'm always on the move......I hate being cold.

The other thing.......my philosophy is that "if I didn't bring something I really needed", then worst case scenario I just hike out and get it at camp or the truck and then go back in.

 

[Erussell01]

I would definitely recommend a vest if you’re apprehensive about being cold. It can keep your core warm but your extremities cool.There’s nothing worse than packing a jacket that you only wear for 15 minutes and never put on again.

I think a vest might be my answer...

 

[Wyobohunter]

I think a vest might be my answer...

I have one vest that rarely gets brought along. If it were me I’d bring the lightest vest you can find. Something less than 8 ounces would probably add just the right amount of extra warmth but wouldn’t be a whole lot of extra weight in the pack. In my opinion a lightweight mid-layer is more useful. This is what I use for my mid-layer. Size XL weighs 8 ounces. It’s advertised as a base layer but it works great as a mid layer.

 

[mtwarden]

I've got a few different vests, but they are typically relegated to be used in addition to my mid-layer in colder weather, not a replacement of in early Fall.

A mid-layer for September weather shouldn't be more than 10-12 oz tops. I always bring one, but there are trips where it isn't used. On the trips I did use it, I'm damn glad I had it

Mid-layer in early season (or spring trips for that matter) are my "insurance policy"

 

[mfllood3800]

I bought a vest and never use it. Too bulky with bino harness and pack for me. I originally the vest was a great idea, but for me it is an item that is still NIB.

 

[Chuckybmd]

I bought a vest and never use it. Too bulky with bino harness and pack for me. I originally the vest was a great idea, but for me it is an item that is still NIB.

I’m the opposite. I run way to warm. I didn’t used a vest until this fall. I almost never wear a full jacket since I make the switch. I keep a rain jacket stowed and that’s about it.

 

[Wyobohunter]

I bought a vest and never use it. Too bulky with bino harness and pack for me. I originally the vest was a great idea, but for me it is an item that is still NIB.

Maybe @Erussell01 would be interested in buying it from you. If the size and style work for him.