is there still demand for SLC 10x42? are they still relevant?

[kaku3428]

I hesitate to respond, but can't bite my tongue on this. I hunt NM, and use SLC's for hours each day hunting (usually). In theory bino's can be readjusted so the animal is in the center of FOV, but in practice...when glassing big country, that's not how it works. This applies whether using them handheld or on a tripod.

For example, say you're watching an area (a bull bedded in the area and you're trying to find antlers), you have no idea where or when his antlers will glint the sun. A bigger FOV is a distinct advantage! When scanning giant mountain sides, you have to stop and look under trees, boulders, etc. Keep scanning and you'll miss animals as you can't pick out the motion of the animal from the motion of scanning. If they are bedded and barely visible, you'll skip right over them. I can't tell you how many times I'm watching a hill side and all of a sudden critters start moving that were not visible 10 seconds ago. They are feeding in and out of trees, ravines, etc. Bears, elk and deer are perfect examples...they move nearly constantly unless they are bedded. All of these cases are where the biggest FOV (and optical quality) is very advantageous. It may not apply to deer hunting in PA. As WRO pointed out, you may need to experience it before you can appreciate it.

With all this said, I'm very happy with my SLC's (as is my son and GF with theirs) and have no desire for NL Pure's simply due to cost. I know many hunters in NM that use $3k+ bino's...they do make a difference. There is a thread about what the most important piece of hunting gear is, and many (most?) of the replies was good glass.

very good points. i have not hunted the west side yet but i watch a lot of hunting shows on TV. Jim shockey etc still use $500 binos and scopes.

 

[JLane330]

very good points. i have not hunted the west side yet but i watch a lot of hunting shows on TV. Jim shockey etc still use $500 binos and scopes.

I don't watch many hunting shows, I just go do it myself and spend a lot of time in the woods as a DIY hunter. Not sure about Jim Shocked, but can say that if I had a guide on every hunt, I could probably get away with no bino's
I'm not saying you have to have expensive glass to hunt, not at all. Leupold BX4's are awesome and can be had for under $500. Scopes, I've used a $300 Leupold to kill multiple elk (20+ yr old VariX II). Sure, dialing my VX5HD's are nice.
I've noticed a couple different groups of people on this forum. Some are all about the gear. That's cool! Some are all about the hunt. That's cool too! Some are about the experience of the hunt. Also cool! Whatever the reason, we're here to have fun.

 

[WRO]

Field of view is important. Nobody is arguing about that. But we are discussing is that whether that makes traditional or old school binoculars irrelevant? And how many hunters actually use $3k binoculars? And how many who don’t use such $3k binoculars feel the need for them?

Make up your mind, you said it wasn't really relevant a few posts prior. A lot of people use 3000.00 binoculars and wear 1500.00 camo matching outfits. A lot of people want them as well. I've never heard anyone say they need shittier glass than what they have.

The SLC and EL's are great binoculars and definitely still relevant. You'll still be able to get SLC's under the Kahles brand going forward European market.

very good points. i have not hunted the west side yet but i watch a lot of hunting shows on TV. Jim shockey etc still use $500 binos and scopes.

He also has a professional guide on 95% of his TV hunts. Most of them are running good stuff. If leupold wanted to pay me what they pay Jim, I'd run them on tv as well.

 

[kaku3428]

I don't watch many hunting shows, I just go do it myself and spend a lot of time in the woods as a DIY hunter. Not sure about Jim Shocked, but can say that if I had a guide on every hunt, I could probably get away with no bino's
I'm not saying you have to have expensive glass to hunt, not at all. Leupold BX4's are awesome and can be had for under $500. Scopes, I've used a $300 Leupold to kill multiple elk (20+ yr old VariX II). Sure, dialing my VX5HD's are nice.
I've noticed a couple different groups of people on this forum. Some are all about the gear. That's cool! Some are all about the hunt. That's cool too! Some are about the experience of the hunt. Also cool! Whatever the reason, we're here to have fun.

yes i am with you. i dont buy into hype that easily. i learned a lesson 3 years ago when i could spot a deer 100 yards away with meotar 8x32 in the last minutes of the day and could not find the same deer in swarovski z6i 1.7-10x42 scope.

 

[Spiral Horn]

Kind of at a loss for why some folks are feeling compelled to make a buy or sell decision on the SLC simply because they’ve been discontinued. Unless of course someone was already in the process of saving up to buy one.

If someone has an SLC and is happy with it, I don’t see any reason to hurry up and dump them in order to rush into an upgrade/replacement. New Alphas like the NL and SF aren’t going anywhere and will continue to inch down in price over time. Also, many manufacturers will now be targeting the void left by the SLCs, and competition is continually generating better optics. Just compare today’s $500 binos to those of 10 years ago and it will be obvious.

I’ve owned a lot of Alphas and Near-Alphas over the years and enjoyed most of them. For a very long time my “reach-for” “go-to” glass was the Zeiss Dialyt 10x40 B/G T*, even long after they were discontinued. Some of my other binos might have been hair-splitting better at an aspect of optics, but the Dialyts were just the right combination of resolution, brightness, immersive view, and ergonomics/handling (IMHO - vitally important and often ignored). Much like many who love the SLCs, they stayed my “go-to” until I found something that was clearly an overall better binocular in all of the characteristics important to me and how I use them.

 

[Spiral Horn]

The SLC and EL's are great binoculars and definitely still relevant. You'll still be able to get SLC's under the Kahles brand going forward European market.

Think folks often misread what is being said about relevance. Certainly the SLCs are a high quality hunting binocular. Now that they’ve been discontinued there will be a lot of loyal fanfare from folks who’ve owned and loved them, and the used market will be hot for a while, but in the end there will be a new glass that supplants them. I could have recently bought a brand new set at a discount but passed as I’ve chosen to wait and see what new binoculars come out in the near future. After all, while the SLC and ELs are quality binoculars, neither is a recent design.

On another note, there are a lot of folks here and all over the internet claiming the new Kahles Helia S will be the exact same binocular as the SLC with only light cosmetic changes. But that is yet to be determined. The SLC has a number of manufacturing processes, coatings, components, etc that are patented and specifically Brand-Trademarked to Swarovski. Will the new Kahles use the same high-fluoride glass? Will the Helia S use the Kahles Brand-Trademarked AMV lens coatings to replace Swarodur/Swarotop? How with that impact the optics? What other components will be replaced? Fact is, until it is actually produced, brought to market and reviewed, we just don‘t know if it will be an SLC clone or just a body double.

Also, would caution folks posting here about buying a Helia S from an international dealer and having it shipped to the USA — before buying it would be wise to first ensure directly with Kahles or Swarovski that this is authorized. Otherwise it might be considered a “gray market” purchase with questionable warranty coverage. Not saying it would be, but it is certainly something that should be confirmed with the manufacturer who will be providing warranty service before laying down that kind of money.

 

[WRO]

Think folks often misread what is being said about relevance. Certainly the SLCs are a high quality hunting binocular. Now that they’ve been discontinued there will be a lot of loyal fanfare from folks who’ve owned and loved them, and the used market will be hot for a while, but in the end there will be a new glass that supplants them. I could have recently bought a brand new set at a discount but passed as I’ve chosen to wait and see what new binoculars come out in the near future. After all, while the SLC and ELs are quality binoculars, neither is a recent design.

On another note, there are a lot of folks here and all over the internet claiming the new Kahles Helia S will be the exact same binocular as the SLC with only light cosmetic changes. But that is yet to be determined. The SLC has a number of manufacturing processes, coatings, components, etc that are patented and specifically Brand-Trademarked to Swarovski. Will the new Kahles use the same high-fluoride glass? Will the Helia S use the Kahles Brand-Trademarked AMV lens coatings to replace Swarodur/Swarotop? How with that impact the optics? What other components will be replaced? Fact is, until it is actually produced, brought to market and reviewed, we just don‘t know if it will be an SLC clone or just a body double.

Also, would caution folks I’ve seen posting here about buying a Helia S from an international dealer and having it shipped to the USA — before buying from an international dealer and having it shipped to North America it would be wise to first ensure directly with Kahles or Swarovski that this is authorized. Otherwise it might be considered a “gray market” purchase with questionable warranty coverage. Not saying it would be, but it is certainly something that should be confirmed with the manufacturer who will be providing warranty service before laying down that kind of money.

There has been some glass sharing between Swarovski and Kahles already, My first Kahles was a 6x24 and I didn't love the glass. My 525 and 318 I do, in speaking with the local rep, the 525 and 318 both run Swarovski glass. I wouldn't be surprised if they're very similar in the Binoculars going forward. It would get Kahles out of the Japanese glass they were running earlier.

You are correct though on the bringing european models over and having warranty issues.

 

[Spiral Horn]

There has been some glass sharing between Swarovski and Kahles already, My first Kahles was a 6x24 and I didn't love the glass. My 525 and 318 I do, in speaking with the local rep, the 525 and 318 both run Swarovski glass. I wouldn't be surprised if they're very similar in the Binoculars going forward. It would get Kahles out of the Japanese glass they were running earlier.

You are correct though on the bringing european models over and having warranty issues.

They may very well end up being a Kahles-produced SLC clone. But it isn’t at all rare for rebranding to involve other brand-specific changes, or for the production model to not quite live up to pre-production specs. Although many are already thinking it is carved on stone tablets we’ll just have to wait and see.

It’s actually a very good marketing move by Swarovski to increase the panache of the Kahles Brand of binoculars. Pretty certain they’ve done their own internal marketing forecasts. Also, who knows what Swarovski is already planning for their own line of binoculars below their new flagship NL Pures?

Who uses exactly what brand & type of glass in each optical product these days is an often heated debate, and sometimes changes over the manufacturing life of a particular optic. You’re correct that German glass is still considered top of the class. But the Japanese glass used in today’s high-end Nikon and Kowa Flourite Crystal is often something beautiful to behold.

 

[xFREDx]

Think folks often misread what is being said about relevance. Certainly the SLCs are a high quality hunting binocular. Now that they’ve been discontinued there will be a lot of loyal fanfare from folks who’ve owned and loved them, and the used market will be hot for a while, but in the end there will be a new glass that supplants them. I could have recently bought a brand new set at a discount but passed as I’ve chosen to wait and see what new binoculars come out in the near future. After all, while the SLC and ELs are quality binoculars, neither is a recent design.

On another note, there are a lot of folks here and all over the internet claiming the new Kahles Helia S will be the exact same binocular as the SLC with only light cosmetic changes. But that is yet to be determined. The SLC has a number of manufacturing processes, coatings, components, etc that are patented and specifically Brand-Trademarked to Swarovski. Will the new Kahles use the same high-fluoride glass? Will the Helia S use the Kahles Brand-Trademarked AMV lens coatings to replace Swarodur/Swarotop? How with that impact the optics? What other components will be replaced? Fact is, until it is actually produced, brought to market and reviewed, we just don‘t know if it will be an SLC clone or just a body double.

Also, would caution folks posting here about buying a Helia S from an international dealer and having it shipped to the USA — before buying it would be wise to first ensure directly with Kahles or Swarovski that this is authorized. Otherwise it might be considered a “gray market” purchase with questionable warranty coverage. Not saying it would be, but it is certainly something that should be confirmed with the manufacturer who will be providing warranty service before laying down that kind of money.

Again it is speculation since we don't know for sure but the Kahles is supposed to be an AK prism, however not sure how being the dims of them are the exact same as the SLC's. Could they make it work? who knows but we will see. Optics trade told me they could ship it to the US no problem and warranty work, you would have to ship it back to them so they could get it worked on for you, as Kahles USA is only into more tactical optics for the US market. Not sure why, i have seen some of their hunting scopes and they are quite spectacular. I am sure Swaro has a say in what they can and cannot import being the parent company of them.

 

[Spiral Horn]

Again it is speculation since we don't know for sure but the Kahles is supposed to be an AK prism, however not sure how being the dims of them are the exact same as the SLC's. Could they make it work? who knows but we will see. Optics trade told me they could ship it to the US no problem and warranty work, you would have to ship it back to them so they could get it worked on for you, as Kahles USA is only into more tactical optics for the US market. Not sure why, i have seen some of their hunting scopes and they are quite spectacular. I am sure Swaro has a say in what they can and cannot import being the parent company of them.

Wow, that’s news about the use of AK prisms in the new Kahles - where did you hear that (not challenging, just curious)? If memory serves, the SLCs used AKs only in the huge 56mm model and SPs in the 42mm. That would require a fairly extensive optical system redesign in the Helia S 10x42, and have no idea how they would accomplish building an AK prisms based system into the fairly compact SLC housing dimensions.

Kahles warranty through Optics Trade - that sounds like quite an odd arrangement. So, in other words they are confirming that Kahles is NOT going to accept a Helia S Binocular warranty repair order from a USA customer; USA customers only have access to Kahles warranty through the international dealer’s arrangements with the manufacturer? This sounds very odd and quite fishy (like a gray market purchase). So, why would anyone put themselves in this situation when there are so many other fine binocular choices available? If it sounds like there is something not quite right, that feeling is usually correct.

 

[xFREDx]

Wow, that’s news about the use of AK prisms in the new Kahles - where did you hear that (not challenging, just curious)? If memory serves, the SLCs used AKs only in the huge 56mm model and SPs in the 42mm. That would require a fairly extensive optical system redesign in the Helia S 10x42, and have no idea how they would accomplish building an AK prisms based system into the fairly compact SLC housing dimensions.

Kahles warranty through Optics Trade - that sounds like quite an odd arrangement. So, in other words they are confirming that Kahles is NOT going to accept a Helia S Binocular warranty repair order from a USA customer; USA customers only have access to Kahles warranty through the international dealer’s arrangements with the manufacturer? This sounds very odd and quite fishy (like a gray market purchase). So, why would anyone put themselves in this situation when there are so many other fine binocular choices available? If it sounds like there is something not quite right, that feeling is usually correct.

Yeah i am not sure about both things. The warranty part and the prisms. I trust Optics trade as i have used them many times before for purchases and they have alwasy been helpful with any questions. The prisms are listed down below. again i have asked them about this and they said this is what they are hearing but Kahles hasn't given a confirmed answer. It seems spec wise it is the exact same size everything as the SLC 8x42 & 10x42 so i don't see how they will make the AK work in such a small platform. If it is, then that could be something big.

 

[kaku3428]

Yeah i am not sure about both things. The warranty part and the prisms. I trust Optics trade as i have used them many times before for purchases and they have alwasy been helpful with any questions. The prisms are listed down below. again i have asked them about this and they said this is what they are hearing but Kahles hasn't given a confirmed answer. It seems spec wise it is the exact same size everything as the SLC 8x42 & 10x42 so i don't see how they will make the AK work in such a small platform. If it is, then that could be something big.

View attachment 279257

Thats incorrect prism type listed. From Kahles website all other specs are exact match with SLC. I have seen a lot of errors in specs on optics trade webite.

 

[xFREDx]

Thats incorrect prism type listed. From Kahles website all other specs are exact match with SLC. I have seen a lot of errors in specs on optics trade webite.

I agree with you but i asked them about this and they said that is what they were told but couldn't confirm it. And once they have all the information they would update it. They are supposed to do a video on it the first week they get them in stock.

 

[Spiral Horn]

We can spitball about the Helia S but won’t know anything for certain until it is professionally reviewed.

Have seen the AK prisms claim in several threads but since the SLC used SPs in their 42mm models, would be shocked if the Helia S uses AKs as that would require a significant optics system redesign and really boost the production startup costs. My guess is they’ll pretty closely match the SLCs but may face limitations due to brand-specific optics elements, processes and coatings.

 

[xFREDx]

We can spitball about the Helia S but won’t know anything for certain until it is professionally reviewed.

Have seen the AK prisms claim in several threads but since the SLC used SPs in their 42mm models, would be shocked if the Helia S uses AKs as that would require a significant optics system redesign and really boost the production startup costs. My guess is they’ll pretty closely match the SLCs but may face limitations due to brand-specific optics elements, processes and coatings.

I have faith in Kahles. I have seen some of. Their hunting scopes and their tactical scopes. Easily on pair with the S&B glass and Zeiss Glass. They will probabaly have the tradition prism but I think they can make it just as good or better than Swarovski.

 

[Kingmancustoms]

I don’t think they are as superior as they used to be. Lots of great options now, I’m very happy with my bx4’s I got for 1/4 the price.

 

[Newtosavage]

I picked up a pair of SLC 10x42 from cabelas recently. I was surprised by the optics and low light performance. I already have EL8.5x42, EL12x50 and SLC15x56. Should i keep them or get rid of them ? will they appreciate in value or lose value as they are discontinued?
if you suggest i should get rid of them, will $1500 be a good price ?

1500 is about what they are bringing these days. Yes they are still relevant (not everyone wants open bridge bins) and IMO they will become even more valuable in the next few years.

 

[Newtosavage]

I don’t think they are as superior as they used to be. Lots of great options now, I’m very happy with my bx4’s I got for 1/4 the price.

BX-4's are remarkably good for the price.

 

[Spiral Horn]

Received a pair of Kahles Helia S 8X42 today.

Congrats! Enjoy - hope it brings a lifetime of viewing pleasure.

 

[HuntingProf]

Wow, that’s news about the use of AK prisms in the new Kahles - where did you hear that (not challenging, just curious)? If memory serves, the SLCs used AKs only in the huge 56mm model and SPs in the 42mm. That would require a fairly extensive optical system redesign in the Helia S 10x42, and have no idea how they would accomplish building an AK prisms based system into the fairly compact SLC housing dimensions.

Kahles warranty through Optics Trade - that sounds like quite an odd arrangement. So, in other words they are confirming that Kahles is NOT going to accept a Helia S Binocular warranty repair order from a USA customer; USA customers only have access to Kahles warranty through the international dealer’s arrangements with the manufacturer? This sounds very odd and quite fishy (like a gray market purchase). So, why would anyone put themselves in this situation when there are so many other fine binocular choices available? If it sounds like there is something not quite right, that feeling is usually correct.

I’ve posted on other threads about this, but want to clear the air so none are in doubt. I purchased multiple pairs of Kahles Helia S binoculars from overseas (Optics Trade). I had to send one pair in for warranty service (sticky focuser). I contacted SONA, and they registered the pair, noting the serial number and the retailer who sold them to me.

They had me ship the pair to them - then they shipped the binos to Austria for repair. Austria shipped them to SONA, then SONA shipped them to me. Took about 6 weeks total, and I was only expected to pay shipping fees to SONA.

Conclusion: Swarovski still warrants Kahles Helia S binoculars to owners in the United States, and made no mention of “grey market” issues. Kahles optics are sent to Austria for repair, then sent back to US consumers. This only seems fair, as one could easily buy optics from legitimate overseas dealers or individuals, yet still need service.