I'm an Idiot - Hoyt Bow Tuning

[Whisky]

I'm an idiot for F'n with shit this close to season. I'm also an idiot becuase I can read something 100 times (twist this, untwist that, that does this, this does that, etc) and until I get some hands on experince with somebody who knows, I apparently can't grasp the concept. I should have stuck with solocams!!

I have re-strung and set up 3 bows in the past, 1 being a Hoyt. It was easy, I must have got lucky. But trying to get my Spyder 34 set up has been difficult. I got some new strings from Bluff Country and finally got around to putting them on. I've twisted and untwisted shit so much and now I don't know if I'm coming or going. Trying to get cam sync set. When I first put the string and calbes on the BOTTOM cam was hitting well ahead of the top, like 1.5-2 fricken inches. I've been tweaking the control to try to get the top cam advanced but don't seem to be making much progress there. Now currently the bottom is only ahead approx 3/4".

My cam lean and DW is also out of whack. I've twisted the non yoke side of the buss a few times, why I don't know. I have not messed with the yoke legs yet (which I know will correct the lean), nor have i thouched the string. My cables looks like shit (look untwisted) and I'm looking for advice on how to proceed. If I take the buss and control off and twist back to spec lengths would that help any?

I came across a chart put together by some fella on AT that had good descriptions on the affects of twisting and untwisting everything for Hoyts. That would be helpful right now, as I have seemed to lost it. I've read Nuts and Bolts, Javi's Cam Timing and Sync on AT, many times....Doesn't seem to help this dummy, and I don't know how you can dumb it down anymore.

Also, when you twist stuff, say the control cable for example, you just twist from one end? Or are you twisting both ends, opposite directions? Or just twist from the end of the cam you are trying to advance??? Preference for CW or CCW twisting for right hand shooters? I realize going forward that a guy should write down every twist and direction he makes.

Appreciate any help!!

 

[c5mrr270]

Best thing to do would be to find the spec cable lengths and twist your cables back to spec. Measuring the cable lengths needs to be done under tension. I use a ratchet strap. After the cables are back to spec you should be close and can go from there.

 

[Brandon Pattison]

Best thing to do would be to find the spec cable lengths and twist your cables back to spec. Measuring the cable lengths needs to be done under tension. I use a ratchet strap. After the cables are back to spec you should be close and can go from there.

Same thing I was thinking. Hoyt has some information on this in their PDF manuals. Check your axle to axle length specs on there as well. It sounds like you have a solid understanding of it. Give yourself more credit than you are. Slow down and throw in a dip and take it slow, like sippin' on whiskey. Do what you said too. I have a pretty good idea of what to do on stuff and it seems like the logic I put behind it is bass ackwards upon checking my changes. You might not be doing it wrong as cam lean affects timing and vice versa. Trial and error might be what is needed and you will learn more. Do NOT go back to a Slowcam, lol.

 

[Blackcow]

Probably can't add anything to what you've read already, but yeah,remeasure your cables and string. Giod starting point. Do it under tension, usually 100 lbs. I use a digital bow scale, a turn buckle and a ratchet strap. If you can't do that I'd pull them as tight as you can and twist or untwist them about an 1/8 short.
On the yoke cable I make sure the sides are even, with an even amount of twists per side.1/2 -1 twist per in of yoke.Then I measure the y cable and add or remove twists to the other end to setthe y cable length.
Put the cables and string back on.Make sure the cables are in the rollers right, and the rollers are installed right, obviously. Then take enough twists out of string so all limb preload is on the yoke cable for cetain. Count the twists, you'll add them back. Check your ATA .Doesn't have to be spec, just close.If it is, put the twists back in the string and check your draw weight, draw length and stops. Not sure if you know what the weight was when you bought it, but since its a hoyt I'd say it was at least 1-2 lbs heavy. If its not, and the stops are close, add a twist or two to boboth cables, until you hit at least the max listed weight.
If the d length is within 1/4", and the weight is list or higher, I take care of it by adding twists to the string. If its over that, twists to the cables to get within that 1/4" then the string.
If the weight and length are on and the stops are close, I get the top stop to hit first, barely, with the c cable. Then add half twists to the yoke legs till the bottom is a touch ahead. Sounds like youhave cam lean figured out. Clear as mud? About the same as you've read I'm sure. Don't bother trying to get the ATA and brace exact, along with timing, weight and d length.If you try to nail all of them you may throw it in the trash. If they all work out, great. GOOD Luck.

 

[Whisky]

I've been twisting my control cable to shorten it to spec for a awhile now. I will attach a picture of how twisted it is at rest currently, measuring 38" under approx 92 lbs tension".. Spec is 37.75

 

[Whisky]

 

[Whisky]

Under tension

 

[ckleeves]

Something weird is going on that looks way to twisted up. The bottom cam being that far ahead is weird also. I don't have a ton of experience putting new strings on Hoyts maybe a dozen sets but all have been way closer than that. IMO something is wrong with the lengths. Do you have a #2 cam? Those might be for a #3?

 

[Rent Outdoor Gear]

Whisky,

1.) Make sure your draw stop position and modules match
2.) Definitely WAY too many twists in that cable (should be max of 1 twist for every 5/8")
3.) If you're hitting first on bottom cable add twists to the buss cable. I don't like subtracting twists because you gain less the more you un-twist and obviously you can only go so far. Also untwisted cables are less durable because they're built with twists in them. Servings will tend to loosen when you untwist.

Email me your # if you are stuck... [email protected]

 

[Rent Outdoor Gear]

You can twist either end of the cables, but on the buss it's usually best to twist the non yoked end so you don't end up swapping the yoke and jacking up the cam lean.

 

[Scottiem]

I just put a new set of Bluff Country strings on my Hoyt Vector 32. Everything went easy, so here is what I did:
1. I put everything on right out of the package and set my ATA to spec. I did this by twisting the control cable & the yoke where they attach on the bottom cam. Twist or untwist them evenly till the ATA is at spec.
2. Measure out where you want your D loop and tie it on.
3. Next I put in some cam lean. Run an arrow along the left side of the top cam and the arrow should cross the string at the D loop. This was a good starting point for me at least. Twist/Untwist the left and right yokes till it is there. Twist/Untwist evenly. (ex. 1 full twist left/1 full Untwist right).
4. Sync the cams. If the top cam touches before the bottom cam, shorten the control cable by adding twists. If the bottom cam touches before the top cam, shorten the yoked buss cable by adding twists. Again do this where they attach on the bottom cam. Its ok if the top cam touches before the bottom cam, as long as the gap at the bottom is only roughly 1/16".
5. After that I set my center shot right at 13/16".
6. Paper Tune. If you tear way nock left/right make the initial adjustments with the yoke. Remember if you add 1 twist, remove the other. If you keep it even the cam sync shouldn't change.
7. Next I checked the poundage. When maxed out my bow was off by a little over a pound. I just added a couple twist on the control cable and buss cable at the bottom cam and that brought it to spec.
8. Last I checked to make sure the cams where still in sync. They were.

Doing all of this worked perfect for me. I'm shooting bullet holes through paper with the rest still at 13/16". I'm no pro so I may not have done everything perfectly or in the right order, but it worked. All I had to do was serve in my peep and sight in. Hope this helps a little.

 

[Whisky]

Well I think my issue was mainly cable length. As it was pointed out I got a few extra twists in it and she is still a quarter inch long.

I put the factory set back on and things were a lot more responsive to twisting. I got my top cam hitting a hair before the bottom, cam lean is dead parallel with string, ATA is 33.75, BH 6& 5/8, DW is 72#.

 

[Whisky]

Now I'm looking for your advice on how to proceed from here. First of all, I have done no yoke adjustments since getting cam clean set. Secondly I have done no rest adjustments since modified French tuning. This was my first time trying that, and the results were I moved my rest out 1/16 inch and splitting strings. Center shot is now 13/16



Got a rough sight in and shot a bareshaft and FP at 20 yds. Results were not good.



Next for giggles I went to 60 and shot broadheads. BH group lower left obviously. Low arrow is Exodus top is Stinger...again not good



Now in my olden days I would have just fought moving the rest and hope to get my BH and FP to tighten up, not even shooting bare shafts. But I'd hate to screw up my supposedly good center shot by doing that.

So, yoke tuning, what adjustments would you make based off my picture? Also, obviously bare shaft isn't flying for crap, what's up there? I'm new to bare shaft and yoke tuning.
Thanks for the help thus far guys!!!

 

[ontarget7]

How much pre lean is in your top cam now ? Take a pic with a shaft up against the left side, projected down to your nocking point. Post a pic when you have that.
What is your nock height set at right now ?
Where are your cams currently synched at ? Top advanced ? At the same time ? Etc.

 

[Whisky]

How much pre lean is in your top cam now ? Take a pic with a shaft up against the left side, projected down to your nocking point. Post a pic when you have that.
What is your nock height set at right now ?
Where are your cams currently synched at ? Top advanced ? At the same time ? Etc.

No pre lean. Arrow runs down string parallel with very little gap, like the picture you posted a few days ago in another thread.

Nock height 1/8"

Top cam is slightly ahead of bottom. This is my first time setting sync up like that. Feels mushy. Generally I have them set equally.

 

[ontarget7]

No pre lean. Arrow runs down string parallel with very little gap, like the picture you posted a few days ago in another thread.

Nock height 1/8"

Top cam is slightly ahead of bottom. This is my first time setting sync up like that. Feels mushy. Generally I have them set equally.

Not sure how you have it set for synch because the wall is not mushy at all with the top cam slightly advanced.

Now if your prelean is running parallel and you are still hitting left with your broadheads you might have a couple issues.

What arrows are you shooting and what are their specs ? What cam # and draw length ?

You have to be careful when adjusting for bareshafts because you have to first make sure your grip is right.

 

[Rent Outdoor Gear]

Top cam sould be VERY slightly ahead, like one twist max.

I would shoot it through paper, then I can tell you what to do... As soon as you tweak your yoke you're going to alter your supposedly good center shot so I'm not sure I'm a believer in the method you used... If centershot IS good and your spine is right, then you should be hitting in line with your FP. My guess is you need to either move the rest in or twist the left yoke, then raise rest or move nock point down.

I use a different process altogether... Eyeball center-shot so the string is in line with the arrow. Set nock height roughly level to 1/8" high.
Shoot bare shaft and fletched shaft through paper to ensure vanes aren't contacting (or use foot powder spray on vanes and rest to show if there's any contact). Start at 6 feet and work back to 18-20 feet as you fine tune it. If you can pinhole a bare shaft at 20 feet through paper, your broadheads are gonna shoot lights out.

Tune center shot with yoke (re-time if necessary). Left tear = twist up left side yoke, right tear = twist right side yoke.
Change rest height or loop height to correct up & down. Easiest tuning rest I have found is the AAE Pro Drop or Freakshow. TT limb driven rests work well too.

Then go check broadheads to FP... I very, very rarely have any difference between BH & FP using this method.

BTW, I know the cam & 1/2 pretty good (~12 years)... and this works every time for me.

 

[dreamingbig]

Great advice Darin. I just printed that out for the next cable/string swap!

 

[ontarget7]

I would have to differ in the advise on twisting the left yoke. When broadheads impact is already left this would make it worse.

Still would like to no the arrow specs ?

 

[Rent Outdoor Gear]

You're right... My bad, twist right side would be my guess, but I'd still go back to square 1.

DC