Hunting in grizzly country.

[dotman]

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57770_757767_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

here is the bad mama jama I was talking about. only 25 oz and it is a bigger model
so you can hold on to the Magnum power. Sportsmans has if for $999 vs the $1159 suggested retail.

Checkout gallery of guns, best deals I found and super easy purchase. Ok done hijacking

Taurus 28oz http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/...type=Revolver&cal=44M&fin=&sit=&zipcode=66215

here is the S&W 26oz http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/...type=Revolver&cal=44M&fin=&sit=&zipcode=66215

Fyi, when you put your zip in it will give you a quote to whatever ffl you want to ship it to, always cheaper.

 

[2rocky]

Carry a pistol (as bear defense) if you can group as well with it as you can with your bow at 20 yards. The rest of us will carry spray.

 

[Ryan Avery]

I always laugh when someone says that cal would never kill a grizz. I'll tell you what won't. A big hand canon that kicks like mule that you only shot 6 times because your half scared of it. Get a handgun that YOU can shoot well and go out and get proficient with it.

I've had one run in with a bear(black bear). It stuck it head under my tarp! If I would of had to take action, bear spray would of been a disaster. I will stick with my 10mm that I have shot over 5000 rounds through for black bear, grizz or Bigfoot.

 

[weaver]

I can manage a 4" group at 20 if i take my time. If i draw and shoot as fast as i can its around a 6" group at 15yds with 7 shots. But with a. 45 im not sure that will do much. Wish could afford one of the ultralight .44s you guys are talking about.

 

[MT_Nate]

Fortunately my elk hunting in MT is in an area where the Griz is very limited, but on the other side of the Clark Fork where I do my muley hunting I have seen their tracks in the snow and it definately makes your hair stand on end. I would error on the side of conservatism if there is a fair population of these guys hanging around and have a partner to protect your back if possible.

I drive 2 hours to hunt the same range where Ross hits it...for this very reason. It's a place where the USFWS keeps trying to get Grizzlies to live, but it just isn't sticking. I've had enough hair-raising griz encounters (when I DIDN'T have blood all over me and a carcass nearby) to make me think twice sneaking around blowing distressed calf sounds in the thick timber. One encounter tends to ruin your confidence for awhile...

...but never say never. In last minute desperation last year, I hunted a griz-infested hole close to my house that I knew held elk. I arrowed a bull hunting solo, with quarters on my back into the late evening and no water to clean myself up and get the smell of blood off of me. Needless to say, my neck was like a freakin' turret from the moment he went down until I had the last bit of meat in the truck.

 

[Mike7]

Good stuff Ryan and Nate. Very funny and couldn't agree more.

 

[jmez]

I can manage a 4" group at 20 if i take my time. If i draw and shoot as fast as i can its around a 6" group at 15yds with 7 shots. But with a. 45 im not sure that will do much. Wish could afford one of the ultralight .44s you guys are talking about.

Add a charging griz to that mix intent on doing you bodily harm.

 

[broncoformudv]

You have gotten some great advice on here and the only things I can add are the following.
1. move your meat away from the gut pile
2. hang the meat in a tree that is close to a clearing that way you can see it as you approach so you will know if something is on it
3. if you carry a sidearm for protection practice practice practice, very few people that carry in grizzly country shoot much and very few people can hit what they shoot at
4. use some common sense, keep your eyes open and listen

Good luck hunting!

 

[sanchomaes]

I have a S&W 329 PD with a the 4 inch barrel. The recoil is manageable. It is very comfortable to handle and easy enough for me to shoot. I have a video of Aron shooting it earlier in the year when he was down to one arm. I was laughing so hard at Aron cussing the recoil and noise. I should post that...

 

[ohhiitznik]

I carry spray, and a .44 magnum. The spray is the real defense. The pistol is for peace of mind.

 

[Nick Muche]

I can manage a 4" group at 20 if i take my time.

Well, I don't think you will be able to take your time, if you need to use it.

 

[dotman]

I always laugh when someone says that cal would never kill a grizz. I'll tell you what won't. A big hand canon that kicks like mule that you only shot 6 times because your half scared of it. Get a handgun that YOU can shoot well and go out and get proficient with it.

I've had one run in with a bear(black bear). It stuck it head under my tarp! If I would of had to take action, bear spray would of been a disaster. I will stick with my 10mm that I have shot over 5000 rounds through for black bear, grizz or Bigfoot.

Haha, yes I agree if you are scared of the proper cal only use bear spray. There are plenty of studies and a .44 is considered the min cal. I don't think I'll be the one testing out a .40 or .45

 

[broncoformudv]

dotman you are spot on about the .40 and .45, they are specifically designed to kill people which are way easier to kill than bears are. The one exception in calibers I have seen of that works well is the 10mm, a lot of people like to throw it in there with the .40 and .45 but it really shines in penetration which is what you are after when shooting bears.

Another big mistake I see people make with handguns is using ammo designed for people for bear defense. This does not and will not work do to the fact it is not designed to penetrate it is designed to expand and transmit all of the bullets energy to the subject it hits. Good bear bullets are designed to penetrate the vitals or CNS which is way deeper and better protected than that of a human.

 

[dotman]

I have a S&W 329 PD with a the 4 inch barrel. The recoil is manageable. It is very comfortable to handle and easy enough for me to shoot. I have a video of Aron shooting it earlier in the year when he was down to one arm. I was laughing so hard at Aron cussing the recoil and noise. I should post that...

I agree, it really isn't that bad, my dads .454 kills the wrist more so. Neither are something i'll just put 100 rounds through in one sitting. Post up the vid

 

[dotman]

Here is a good test, next elk you shoot take the skull with you and see if your cal will penetrate the elk skull, I know a .357 will not and a bears skull is much thicker. We did a test on a cow elk probably 16 years ago wiyh our .357 and were pretty shocked. Now there is better ammo out today then there was when we did it but I wouldn't put my life or anyone with me in further danger by wounding a bear. Yes some of the smaller cals can kill a bear but how quickly? Doesn't count if it still has time to finish you off first and 15rds of jhp will just get someone in trouble, hard cast is the only way to go.

A 10mm might worrk on a black bear but I wouldn't try it on a griz or atleast I wouldn't want to be the test subject.

 

[broncoformudv]

Now hang that elk skull from a clothesline hanging about 3-4 feet above the ground and tie a string to it then have your buddy pull it along at about 20 mph heading straight at you and see if you can hit it with your hand cannon.

Hitting a bobbing bear head as it is charging is a lot of fun and gets your attention real quick.

 

[Matt Cashell]

This topic seems to come up a lot. It is interesting to hear the responses.

Dotman,

I am really interested in the minimum caliber studies you reference. I would like to read them and go through the methodology, etc., as it seems like it would be hard to study.

I know that Tom Smith of BYU did a historical review that showed bear spray was effective in 92 percent of bear spray deployments, while firearms deployments were effective in 67 percent of cases. His standard for "effective" was the human left the encounter uninjured.

I am kind of a gun nut, and like to carry a pistol in the backcountry, but I always have bear spray (UDAP is the good stuff, IMO). I have the FHF Gear holster, which is awesome.

As far as .45 not being enough, or .40, or 9mm, or whatever. I think bullet construction and shot placement is much more critical. A hardcast .40 or 9mm in the right spot is going to shut down the nervous system right away. I agree with Ryan that shooting under stress goes a lot better with a gun you are more comfortable with.

I don't agree with Ryan saying bear spray being useless on a bear coming in your tent. I actually think it would work well. the downside is it would work pretty well on yourself, too.

My personal experience with grizzly bears is that they usually turn tail and run. I did have one aggressive situation with a young male near Hebgen Lake, but it turned out fine.

 

[dotman]

Here you go, it was done by the USFS www.fs.fed.us/pnw/pubs/gtr152

 

[dotman]

Now hang that elk skull from a clothesline hanging about 3-4 feet above the ground and tie a string to it then have your buddy pull it along at about 20 mph heading straight at you and see if you can hit it with your hand cannon.

Hitting a bobbing bear head as it is charging is a lot of fun and gets your attention real quick.

Yup I agree, I swear someone here posted up a test with a 50gal drum doing a similar test and out of a few shots it was only hit once. I carry bear spray and the 44mag is fun to shoot but ido carry it for peace of mind also but that is the last resort item.

 

[Kevin Root]

Here's my take for what it's worth. It doesn't matter if you're shooting a .41, 44, 464, 500, or a 12 gauge shotgun. Two important things must happen for you to defend yourself from a bear that's charging you. First, you must react instantly. That means retrieving a gun or bear spray from a holster or whatever in a few seconds. Next, you must be able to shoot the bear in the spine, brain or other vital to render it helpless. This means immediately helpless. If you wound it, you will anger it even more, and and your chances of survival are slim to none. Reacting and shooting occur when your brain is mush, and in panic mode, as a very pissed off bear, especially a momma with cubs, is rushing you.

I've read and heard of more than a few folks that were victims of Grizzly bear attacks. Many of these victims were burly outfitters, guides, or hunters who were savvy to hunting and guns. Bottom line, never be over confident if you're carrying a superduper magnum or bear spray. In the case of the latter, know how to quickly jerk off the locking mechanism so you can use it quickly.