How far does stealth REALLY matter?

[Dioni A]

@RockAndSage Not necessarily move but become more alert and may shift to different cover. I think it takes a lot more than most people claim to get a buck to actually leave an area.

 

[RockAndSage]

@RockAndSage Not necessarily move but become more alert and may shift to different cover. I think it takes a lot more than most people claim to get a buck to actually leave an area.

I used to say something similar, when people would claim that a bumped old buck will just be "gone for the rest of the season", but learned otherwise a long, long time ago. They seem to be back within a couple of days, most of the time, right where they were.

With what you're saying here, I've got both conflicting and agreeing evidence. Especially where some 3-4yo sets up his home bed where there's vehicle traffic nearby, they'll stay put for stuff a more remote, older buck just doesn't seem to put up with at all. But the further out they are around here, and the bigger and older they are, the fewer mistakes they'll let you make.

One big question mark for me I haven't quite figured out on this, is the role of the heat and the sun. I've suspected mid-day sun and super high temps will cause them to be more averse to bolting if they don't have to, but still not quite sure if I'm actually seeing that or just reading more into it than is actually there.

 

[Dioni A]

I used to say something similar, when people would claim that a bumped old buck will just be "gone for the rest of the season", but learned otherwise a long, long time ago. They seem to be back within a couple of days, most of the time, right where they were.

With what you're saying here, I've got both conflicting and agreeing evidence. Especially where some 3-4yo sets up his home bed where there's vehicle traffic nearby, they'll stay put for stuff a more remote, older buck just doesn't seem to put up with at all. But the further out they are around here, and the bigger and older they are, the fewer mistakes they'll let you make.

One big question mark for me I haven't quite figured out on this, is the role of the heat and the sun. I've suspected mid-day sun and super high temps will cause them to be more averse to bolting if they don't have to, but still not quite sure if I'm actually seeing that or just reading more into it than is actually there.

This buck got shot at opening day by another hunter. I bumped him the next day at 50 yards maybe half mile away from where he got shot at. Had to go home for the next day and watch kids. 4th day of season I killed him 400 yards away from where I bumped him 2 days earlier.

Lab aged 8 year old buck

 

[Dioni A]

@RockAndSage
I hunted this buck opening day 2 years ago. 3 hunters walked along the ridge he was standing on right at first light 200 yd away from him. He took off. I decided to wait a week later into season and go in the middle of the week. There was 13 trucks at the trailhead within a mile of where this buck was living. People were everywhere.
Went back in on the 17th of October and killed him 300 yards from where I saw him opening morning. Lab aged 9 year-old deer.

 

[ckleeves]

I don't disagree with you at all. Almost all my experience has been in the high desert Great Basin, and we just don't have what you're describing for the vast majority of the region. Closest thing is maybe a couple of the Toiyabe areas. Other than that, the only habituation I've seen with older, bigger deer are a couple of places where ranch or gravel trucks go by regularly on dirt. Everywhere else it just doesn't have those kinds of hikers, at least north of Clark County (Vegas) and East of Washoe (Reno area). That said, since Covid there have been a lot more ATV types going further and further out. That might change things a bit. But really remote Nevada? It's still pretty rare to see hikers.

For sure it’s area dependent. Individual bucks are different on what they will put up with also. They all have a little different personality and it doesn’t always run hand in hand with age or antler size. Seen some crazy clever big bucks and some that were dumb as a box of rocks. Unfortunately when I find a big dumb one It’s usually where I don’t have a tag for or I’m hunting something else lol.

 

[Dioni A]

This was my very first big buck. I missed a shot on him October 20 and killed him half a mile away the next day on the same hillside.

 

[Dioni A]

I hit this buck opening day of season but the bullet drifted and barely clipped the front of his brisket. I killed him the next day a couple hundred yards away in thick timber.


If deer will tolerate getting shot at, bumped at close range and multiple hunters crossing the same hillside but still stay in their core area I think your pretty safe walking 700-800 yards away.
Hide when you can and use cover as much as possible but if you do cross an opening and can't find them odds are good that they're very close and you didn't see them change beds.

 

[Dioni A]

Almost forgot about this one.
Spotted him at 900 yards and the only move was to cross a big opening straight above him on the same finger ridge. He spotted me somewhere between 700 and 570 yards. It took me half an hour to find him hiding behind brush staring directly at me. He only moved 30 yards.
It would have been very easy to not continue looking and assume that he left.

 

[RockAndSage]

I hit this buck opening day of season but the bullet drifted and barely clipped the front of his brisket. I killed him the next day a couple hundred yards away in thick timber.
View attachment 722128

If deer will tolerate getting shot at, bumped at close range and multiple hunters crossing the same hillside but still stay in their core area I think your pretty safe walking 700-800 yards away.
Hide when you can and use cover as much as possible but if you do cross an opening and can't find them odds are good that they're very close and you didn't see them change beds.

Man, those are some gorgeous bucks. And great insights. Thanks for sharing.

One thing I do need to ask, is if you’ve had any of these experiences like this in the high desert. What you’re sharing makes sense, and kinda matches with some deer and some circumstances I’ve experienced, but with several of the biggest I’ve seen it also doesn’t - I’m trying to figure out why. Keep in mind, this is watching these bucks escape, not that they just disappeared. Pressure, habituation, and habitat variables are what’s coming to mind. There’s no arguing with your experience here, just trying to figure out what the differences might be.

 

[Dioni A]

Man, those are some gorgeous bucks. And great insights. Thanks for sharing.

One thing I do need to ask, is if you’ve had any of these experiences like this in the high desert. What you’re sharing makes sense, and kinda matches with some deer and some circumstances I’ve experienced, but with several of the biggest I’ve seen it also doesn’t - I’m trying to figure out why. Keep in mind, this is watching these bucks escape, not that they just disappeared. Pressure, habituation, and habitat variables are what’s coming to mind. There’s no arguing with your experience here, just trying to figure out what the differences might be.

From what I understand that can be a very different situation. In some of these desert areas it sounds like a bucks core area might be many miles large. Mountain bucks will typically have a core area that's less than 1 mi. More often it seems like it's half mile by 1 mi rectangular. In that case where a bucks area is so large it may seem like he's completely gone but he might be using a home that's multiple miles away but still familiar to him. Jason Carter has spoken about this multiple times on the epic outdoors podcast. I would think he's the foremost expert in that scenario.

 

[Walthers]

Way to get it done Dioni, awesome backs for sure! This thread has been great, after striking out on all my elk tags I still have hope for my Wyoming deer tag, the info hear has really got me thinking of scenarios and their behavior. Thanks all.

 

[RockAndSage]

From what I understand that can be a very different situation. In some of these desert areas it sounds like a bucks core area might be many miles large. Mountain bucks will typically have a core area that's less than 1 mi. More often it seems like it's half mile by 1 mi rectangular. In that case where a bucks area is so large it may seem like he's completely gone but he might be using a home that's multiple miles away but still familiar to him. Jason Carter has spoken about this multiple times on the epic outdoors podcast. I would think he's the foremost expert in that scenario.

This is extremely good info, and it's genuinely appreciated. Will look up some of those podcasts too. This kind of master-level nuance in ranges you're sharing is pretty eye-opening. I hope the OP gets as much out of this thread as I did.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

From what I understand that can be a very different situation. In some of these desert areas it sounds like a bucks core area might be many miles large. Mountain bucks will typically have a core area that's less than 1 mi. More often it seems like it's half mile by 1 mi rectangular. In that case where a bucks area is so large it may seem like he's completely gone but he might be using a home that's multiple miles away but still familiar to him. Jason Carter has spoken about this multiple times on the epic outdoors podcast. I would think he's the foremost expert in that scenario.

What’s really interesting in the desert areas that I hunt, that have both coues deer and mule deer, is that the Coues deer bucks; if they have enough cover and food, can live their entire life within a half mile circle (sometimes just squeaking out of the circle to breed in the winter.) In that same mountainside/canyon whatever, mule deer bucks will cover miles everyday. Usually moving up steep slopes and canyons out of mesquite/cactus flats in the morning to find shade and cover, only to move back down slopes into the flats feeding and watering on the way down to night bedding areas.

It’s amazing that such similar critters that share the same terrain can behave so differently.

 

[butcherboy]

I think a lot depends on that particular buck. However, I have seen more big bucks lay flat out and get as low as possible waiting for the danger to pass. Timberline bucks will usually bed with a steep slope or cliff right behind them and tuck into the cliff as tight as possible. I’ve watched high desert/desert bucks lay down in the middle of a sage flat and lay their chin on the ground. Hunters have walked by them at 30 yds and the bucks never moved. They are sneaky boogers and get big for a reason.

Also, mule deer will usually circle back from where they came from. May be only a few hundred yards or a few miles but they circle back at some point.