Hiking safely in big game country

[ElPollo]

One thought, do you all not have moose where you’re at? Everyone is talking about bears. I’m pretty experienced back country, my father was a wildlife biologist for 30+ years and taught me a whole lot he learned from that. Both of us consider moose by far the greater threat. Not even close. They are enormous, cranky, ornery, unpredictable. Stupid, which is good, but absolutely huge and will charge because they ate something sour earlier and are mad at you about it.

Grizzly are scary to be sure, but they don’t escalate as easily outside mama situations. Obv don’t get complacent around fat fuzzy black bears no matter how many times you’ve seen them, but moose are what gets my heart rate high every damn time.

Last winter we were out with the dogs and found some giant still steaming turds. No gun. I tell you, it was both arms up, coat over arms, leash the dogs, and get the heck outta there as loudly as possible while still listening for crashing towards us.

I used to teach bear and mtn lion safety every year and had a good friend nearly killed by a momma moose. Leashed dogs is a must in bear/moose country. Lots of people have gotten messed up or killed when their dogs run back to them for help with a bear or cow moose on their tail.

The advice on arms and coat up is also good. Make sure they know you’re there and that you look big. Bear spray is good when it works, but you get a good spray, maybe a second that’s less good, and you’re out. I recommend carrying it and a gun (if it’s legal where you are) if your in big bear and moose country.

 

[ElPollo]

And a gun you will carry and can shoot well is way better than one that’s too heavy, or bulky, and hard to shoot accurately.

 

[SageBear]

I used to teach bear and mtn lion safety every year and had a good friend nearly killed by a momma moose. Leashed dogs is a must in bear/moose country. Lots of people have gotten messed up or killed when their dogs run back to them for help with a bear or cow moose on their tail.

The advice on arms and coat up is also good. Make sure they know you’re there and that you look big. Bear spray is good when it works, but you get a good spray, maybe a second that’s less good, and you’re out. I recommend carrying it and a gun (if it’s legal where you are) if your in big bear and moose country.

I avoid bear spray, tbh. When I was a kid we had a faulty can leak in the basement, I was the closest and woke the family up by loudly choking. The fire dept had to clear the house because in the middle of the night it didn’t occur to anyone what was happening.

Also, I worry about wind blowing that back into me. Might be a silly concern, I dunno as I’ve never used it. But I want my vision and faculties at 100%, and also don’t want to take a chance that a particularly cranky and determined critter is going to blow thru the cloud.

Leashing the dogs is a pain, but once I see fresh sign it happens. My boy is a high drive, high energy, intelligent, accident (I was volunteering at the shelter and he was alone and no foster could be found, I couldn’t leave him by himself at 7 weeks overnight in a shelter so I brought him home FOR ONE NIGHT ). So off leash bush walks are a literal godsend. Since I’m aware it’s a huge risk, I also want an appropriate gun. His bonehead puppy self would 100% bring an angry something back to mama to protect him lol

 

[ElPollo]

I avoid bear spray, tbh. When I was a kid we had a faulty can leak in the basement, I was the closest and woke the family up by loudly choking. The fire dept had to clear the house because in the middle of the night it didn’t occur to anyone what was happening.

Also, I worry about wind blowing that back into me. Might be a silly concern, I dunno as I’ve never used it. But I want my vision and faculties at 100%, and also don’t want to take a chance that a particularly cranky and determined critter is going to blow thru the cloud.

Leashing the dogs is a pain, but once I see fresh sign it happens. My boy is a high drive, high energy, intelligent, accident (I was volunteering at the shelter and he was alone and no foster could be found, I couldn’t leave him by himself at 7 weeks overnight in a shelter so I brought him home FOR ONE NIGHT ). So off leash bush walks are a literal godsend. Since I’m aware it’s a huge risk, I also want an appropriate gun. His bonehead puppy self would 100% bring an angry something back to mama to protect him lol

I don’t disagree with anything you said, and I am a dog person who has bird dogs who need to be off the leash to run.

What I’ll say about bear spray is that if the conditions are right, using it likely keeps you from having to shoot a bear that might have cubs or a momma moose. There have been some cases like the couple in Alberta earlier this year who used their bear spray and still got killed. They were in a tent at night with a dog when the bear attacked them. It’s not perfect, but it’s non-lethal. I wouldn’t depend on bear spray alone in high probability bear areas, but having it as an option is not a bad idea.

The other thing to be aware of is that if you do have a defense of life situation while hiking with a dog off-leash, it’s really the game officer’s decision on whether or not to hold you legally responsible for your actions. Not saying you shouldn’t let your dog run. Just do it as intelligently as you can. Try to avoid places where you don’t have some visibility around you where you might surprise a momma bear (like dense willows along creeks). Consider putting a bell on your dog and yourself. And generally try to be aware of your surroundings. There have been multiple cases of predation events on people who were jogging with earbuds in.

Your dad was a biologist. I’m sure he taught you this stuff. But I felt like I aught to say it anyway because this is the internet, and who knows who else might read it.

 

[Bowfinn]

My wife and I have both use bear spray to stop charging moose and it was very effective in both of our scenarios. In both instances the moose immediately turned after deploying the spray at about 6-7 yards. Both of the scenarios were quick point and spray and I THINK it worked quicker/more effective than trying to shoot the moose. I’m not saying to not carry a firearm as I carry both personally, but don’t discount spray as an effective counter measure. I try explain to guests (usually live in lower 48) to watch out for moose are they are more likely to cause harm than bears but I mostly get the impression that they don’t believe me. I guess teeth and claws are scarier than hooves.

 

[flathead#2]

Shotgun / Slugs.

 

[Formidilosus]

Hi! I’m a very timid remote northern BC hiker, I jump at the sound of a squirrel. I feel better when someone has a large caliber gun. My father and husband both have health issues that mean it’s time for me to get my PAL and get my own gun.

Anyone have time to share some thoughts and recommendations?

I’ve shot mostly .22 rifles at a range, but up to a 30-30 and a .308 and some .22 handguns. I’m not into hunting (if you are, cool beans, no hate obv), I’m only planning on shooting in a self defense situation. Most likely culprit will be moose or grizzly (proooooooobably moose. Ornery jerks). So my heart rate and breathing will be off and it’ll be a fast situation. My large off leash dog will be a draw and also will probably get in the way. So accuracy will be key. If people have thoughts about whether he should leashed (I have a bungee waist leash) I’m accepting opinions. He is a giant puppy still (barely 2 years) and current training goals have been reactivity based. I have neglected recall, and I’m realizing I need to rectify that. I’ve built in trigger words to get his attention, but reliability is untested with wildlife.

I have MS and my hands are less functional than I’d like. So an oversized bolt would be great, and overall weight is an BIG factor (I’m still safe with a gun, I don’t have spasms, it’s just slightly numb hands and general weakness).

I’ll be spending a lot of time at the range with whatever I end up with. Again, accuracy. I want as good a chance at a one shot kill as possible while avoiding shooting my over-excited puppy.

Specifically I’d love info on:

Sights/scope preferences. I love good old iron sights but I feel like that’s not the best in the situations I’m anticipating.

Caliber: I lean towards a 338 win mag, but that’s not a very informed opinion. I want stopping power. Kick is not a major concern, unless someone thinks that’s naive. I’m a bigger girl, and an experienced shooter. My bruised shoulder days were over thankfully long ago. Even in a quick situation, I feel like I’ll automatically seat it pretty well.

Action: I love me a bolt action. Thoughts?

The magazine (term?): I read a few reviews of a savage where after the first round it habitually jammed. I don’t know what I’m asking specifically, other than I’d like shell ejection to be smooth and functional so I’m not unalived if the first shot is wild.

I’m leaning towards centrefire because I’ve heard power and accuracy is better. Not interested in reloading but my father loves collecting brass for that so it’s another reason.

Make: I have zero brand loyalty as all I’ve ever shot are my father’s guns. He tells me what they are and the scope details and all that.. and he’s put a fair amount of money into his setups.. but I’m not really gun inclined so it goes in and then out the other ear.

Thank you!! I know I’m asking a lot, any info is helpful. While I’ve spent many many hours at the range with my Dad, I’ve always relied on my more experienced family to make choices while I just showed up, and now I need to Big Girl Up and look after this stuff myself

Bonus points for a recommendation for a light .22 bolt action without a scope, targets at the range is my jam and I like a quiet *bang* outside of life-or-death situations lol

I tried to attach a picture of my bonehead dog because I love him, but I think as a newbie my permissions are restricted. He’s cute tho, just trust me

There are functional semi autos, similar but not AR15’s that are legal in CA. That is by far the best choice in rifles. Next would probably be a Henry Long Ranger in 223 with a red dot.


Get the pistol permit, a good semi auto 9mm and learn to use it correctly.

 

[Helislacker]

There are functional semi autos, similar but not AR15’s that are legal in CA. That is by far the best choice in rifles. Next would probably be a Henry Long Ranger in 223 with a red dot.


Get the pistol permit, a good semi auto 9mm and learn to use it correctly.

Hi Form, given the original question is from a Canadian…..do you have any thoughts on these currently non-restricted 5.56 AR esque rifles for this guys use case and for Canadians with similar requirements?

CZ Bren 2
B&T APC .223
Raven Lockhart .223 - https://www.lockharttactical.com/products/product/LTAC-RAV556-SILVER

These are all non restricted, meaning they aren’t registered and can be used for whatever you want - hunting, sport shooting or recreation. We can get others, but they’re mostly bullpups, restricted (ie. can only use for competition) , or unreliable. These seem to be the best reliable non-bullpups of those currently available. I’m curious as to which of these you’d lean towards.

 

[Formidilosus]

Hi Form, given the original question is from a Canadian…..do you have any thoughts on these currently non-restricted 5.56 AR esque rifles for this guys use case and for Canadians with similar requirements?

CZ Bren 2
B&T APC .223

Both of those are good, and either will work. I generally prefer the B&T APC 223 as it is less bulky.

Raven Lockhart .223 - https://www.lockharttactical.com/products/product/LTAC-RAV556-SILVER

Have not used or seen one of these, but provided it is reliable- sure.

 

[Clint E.]

What about a S&W M&P FCP with a redot for Canada? It is not restricted, light weight, fold in half and could dump a lot of rounds into a bears face in a hurry.
https://www.cabelas.ca/product/168810/smith-wesson-mp-fpc-rifle

 

[yfarm]

45-70 leverguns have substantial recoil and can be hard to handle for inexperienced shooters. If you are going the lever gun route. Stick with a 30-30, 357, or 44 mag.

I shoot mine in a tshirt with 325 gr loads with no issue, recoil is no worse than 12 ga dove loads. Go up to the buffalo bore max loads may be an issue but doubt the op is wearing what I do in south Texas. I practice standing at 10-20 yds doing rapid fire drills and the recoil is a non issue. Those rounds quoted are nothing compared to the 45-70. The Beretta with high power slugs alternating with 00 buck will recoil similar to the 45-70.

 

[ElPollo]

I shoot mine in a tshirt with 325 gr loads with no issue, recoil is no worse than 12 ga dove loads. Go up to the buffalo bore max loads may be an issue but doubt the op is wearing what I do in south Texas. I practice standing at 10-20 yds doing rapid fire drills and the recoil is a non issue. Those rounds quoted are nothing compared to the 45-70. The Beretta with high power slugs alternating with 00 buck will recoil similar to the 45-70.

Nothing I said was intended to reflect on your skills. You are not the OP, but recoil is a thing that affects speed and precision.