Help with New Disc Extreme Rookie

[smg]

I was fortunate to draw unit #15 in NM and immediately began research on a muzzleloader. I've never owned an ML before so everything was new. I finally got all the pieces together I needed and went to the range to find out I'm not able to fire the primer. I was going to run a couple of primers through w/o a load as directed by Knight but I couldn't even get the primers to go off? I tried Remington Kleanbore 209 size and Winchester triple seven 209 primer and used Knight's Full Plastic Jacket with both types of primers. I have the breech that came with the Disc and I believe it is the correct breech for FPJ. It's like the firing pin isn't reaching far enough to even hit the primer. I'm glad I have four months before season because based on my start I'm going to need all of it.

 

[sabotloader]

I was fortunate to draw unit #15 in NM and immediately began research on a muzzleloader. I've never owned an ML before so everything was new. I finally got all the pieces together I needed and went to the range to find out I'm not able to fire the primer. I was going to run a couple of primers through w/o a load as directed by Knight but I couldn't even get the primers to go off? I tried Remington Kleanbore 209 size and Winchester triple seven 209 primer and used Knight's Full Plastic Jacket with both types of primers. I have the breech that came with the Disc and I believe it is the correct breech for FPJ. It's like the firing pin isn't reaching far enough to even hit the primer. I'm glad I have four months before season because based on my start I'm going to need all of it.

First thing make sure the secondary safety is turned complete out tight. If it is in it will stop the progress of the hammer... This is not a good picture for this but look closely at the secondary safety on the end of the hammer assembly. Notice after the rifle has been fired you see very little on the red line around the hammer/firing pin. But more importantly the secondary safety is not up against the cocking piece of the bolt. There is a space between the two.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v130/sabotloader/CabelasScope.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

If you look at this picture you will see the secondary safety turned back tight against the stop and in this case the bolt is in the ready to fire position...



Check these points first and we can move from there... I am assuming that when you pull the trigger you do hear the firing pin slam.

 

[smg]

Thanks for your reply. Actually your posts on multiple different ML forums convinced me to go with the DE. I appreciate your level of detail and your "student" approach to to the art of ML. I have been turning the secondary safety back as you indicate - Knight has a couple of YouTube videos that do a pretty good job of walking you through the gun. I can hear the firing pin go off but there is no evidence the pin is actually striking the primer? Thanks in advance for you help!

 

[sabotloader]

Thanks for your reply. Actually your posts on multiple different ML forums convinced me to go with the DE. I appreciate your level of detail and your "student" approach to to the art of ML. I have been turning the secondary safety back as you indicate - Knight has a couple of YouTube videos that do a pretty good job of walking you through the gun. I can hear the firing pin go off but there is no evidence the pin is actually striking the primer? Thanks in advance for you help!

Have you possibly taken the bolt apart and reassembled it by any chance?

Another thought you might be able to actually view the pin sticking out of the bolt face. With nothing in the bolt - open the bolt - close the bolt - pull the trigger and look in the opening where the red plastic jacket should be. The firing pin should be protruding from the face of the bolt maybe an 1/8". If it is sticking out it really should reach the primer in the jacket.

The last picture in this series shows the hammer out through the bolt face. You should see something resembling this...

 

[beetlespin]

I am betting the secondary safety is not screwed out all the way as well. It's gotta be all the way out. You need to see the red shaft underneath.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[smg]

Good stuff - thanks. I will have to wait until I get home but I'm pretty sure the pin/hammer isn't sticking out like your pictures shows. It's interesting that you ask about the disassembly of the bolt. I haven't taken the bolt apart but when I got the gun back from the gun smith who mounted the scope the bolt action didn't seem as smooth as I rembered it. When the gun wasn't firing the thought crossed my mind that perhaps the gun smith did something to the bolt - hard to say. I have fired the gun a dozen times unloaded and I have yet to see the firing pin/hammer.

 

[smg]

I verified tonight that the pin doesn't extend out as your picture indicates after cocking and pulling the trigger. I took the bolt out and started to play around without. The best part was when I pinched the palm of my hand with the bolt playing with the bolt action - I got my family's attention when that happened! I can actually get the pin to show itself when the bolt action is out of the ML, then turn the mechanism counter clockwise for a quarter turn (similar to motion in removing the entire pin/safety mechanism from the bolt itself) and then began backing off the secondary safety - as I do this I can feel the spring begin to load and with each turn the pin begins to show itself - does that seem correct?

 

[sabotloader]

I am not following everything that you are writing. So let's try this....Turn the secondary safety in as far as it will go... when you think it is all the way in try to tighten it a little bit more. When you have it - turn the hammer assembly into the bolt housing as far as it will go.

Position the bolt upside down like shown in this picture...



In theory surface A should turn past surface B some distance. If the distance is less than a half of a turn make the following adjustment. Turn the hammer assembly back to the point that A aligns with B or the tip of the cocking piece tip is aligned with the detent at the top of the bolt ramp. Then turn the hammer assemble one full turn counter clock wise (turning out) after the full turn to align hold the alignment and turn the secondary safety completely out. Re-insert the bolt into the receiver push - Hold the trigger back and push the bolt handle down. With this the hammer should move forward to the fired position. Check now and see if the firing pin is sticking out of the face of the bolt. It really should be!

If not... take the barreled action out of the stock... open the bolt and pull it back. Then turn the barreled action upside down and with your allen wrench remove the trigger (one screw). After the trigger is out - close the bolt again and see of the pin is sticking out of the face of the bolt.

Let me know what you might discover...

 

[smg]

I think I followed all of your steps. After taking one turn-out counter clockwise of the hammer assembly, I can actually see the firing pin come out when I fire it. Prior to this the hammer assembly was as tight as possible but then I turned-out one turn and can barely see the pin. However, it still doesn't come out as nearly as far as your picture nor far enough to strike the primer because I tried it. I took the stock off along with the trigger and when closing the bolt I can't see the pin sticking out the face of the bolt???

 

[sabotloader]

I think I followed all of your steps. After taking one turn-out counter clockwise of the hammer assembly, I can actually see the firing pin come out when I fire it. Prior to this the hammer assembly was as tight as possible but then I turned-out one turn and can barely see the pin. However, it still doesn't come out as nearly as far as your picture nor far enough to strike the primer because I tried it. I took the stock off along with the trigger and when closing the bolt I can't see the pin sticking out the face of the bolt???

Could you take a picture of your rifle like this one with the bolt closed and trigger pulled? And post it

 

[smg]

Thanks for your patience with me. I'm thinking it's probably something easy and I'm just not seeing it. I will post some pictures tonight after work.

 

[sabotloader]

Thanks for your patience with me. I'm thinking it's probably something easy and I'm just not seeing it. I will post some pictures tonight after work.

Hey not-a-problem here.. I enjoy this stuff a lot of guys have helped me along also... might also be a bit easier if we just make a phone contact I can walk you through a couple of other checks that would tell a lot in a hurry...

mike

 

[Oregonfxstc]

sabotloader I have a Knight disc extreme I ordered with a western bolt and having similar issues, wont snap the cap, tried different caps same result, but all fire on my side lock 54. i think my breach plug and nipple might be too long. it doesn't look like the one in knight's pics in my book. with nipple in overall length is 42.75 mm. ill attach pics​

 

[Oregonfxstc]

 

[Oregonfxstc]

Well funny enough I literally figured it out right after my above post.
I tried everything I could find and kept thinking the nipple was out too far, the last time i closed the bolt on the cap I noticed it split it.
I broke out my bore scope and pulled the breach plug and could see really rough threads and the last 2 didn't look engaged with the plug.
So I cleaned it again really well and spun it in and it came up tight. I ran the bore scope in from the muzzle and could see a slight space. I applied more pressure tight and it broke through a spot and then i could hand tighten it and 2.5 turn later it snugged up. I put it all back together and its fired every cap I put on it.
That spot in the threads took a bit of pressure to get past it.