Help me understand hunting with Berger bullets!

[eoperator]

Does anyone have pictures of a Berger "pencil through"?

 

[sndmn11]

I think the tip collapses inward rather than peeling. If there's enough velocity the jacket portion of the tip acts like a wedge separating the core and ultimately the jacket. I also believe they are more likely to tumble than a tipped bullet, and that isn't negative.

Nothing to prove either belief beyond having recovered some bullet bases.

I also scratch my head at the folks who open up the tips.

 

[Dave Thomas]

I've never shot an antelope but they seem to really work on whitetail. You don't have to open the tips. Use a drill bit just big enough to fit through the hollow point to make sure there's no cleaning material inside.

 

[WeiserBucks]

A tipped TSX (aka TTSX) or Accubond don't have to be manually modified at the tip or have a tip manually inserted like another not to be named bullet to function as a tipped bullet to initiate an expansion. JAT.

Way too much emphasis put on the destruction of some bullets and as time goes on they don't dispatch better or quicker than the tried and true. Read up, on this forum there are more and more mixed results just like any other bullet. It's a choice, happy hunting.

Explosive expansion and vital destruction has been touted by folks on this forum that have a lot of sway into folks believing, in my opinion, they are the hammer of Thor. More and more animals take off as more and more folks jump on the bandwagon, just like when they're hit with "mortal bullets" (bullets that don't blow up) and yet there's not a blood trail and guys complain about losing game. Hmmm...

Somewhere, someone earlier in the thread said the word "marketing". To my knowledge, Berger says their bullets are limited penetration design. Think about life in general, what is beneficial about limiting most anything when it comes to a choice you have to make?

Interesting as time goes on how all bullets seem to provide spectacular results or less than desirable. Has anyone figured out yet that most all bullets take care of the business they are supposed to? It's almost as if folks are afraid to put an expanding bullet (insert bullet type: meat destroying explosive impact expansion, controlled expansion, etc) through the vitals of an animal without confirmation and validation from the internet. There's no Silver Bullet y'all. But it's entertaining to read the consternation and concern!

What's been your personal experience with Bergers?

 

[gwh97]

Last year I killed an Aoudad, mule deer, and cow elk with the 140 EH out of my 6.5 PRC. All were one shot kills and I was very happy with the bullets performance.

The Aoudad was bedded, impact velocity was 2074 ft/sec, no bullet exit. DRT.

The mule deer wasn’t a great shot, but fatal. I jumped the buck up and the shot ended up around 180 yards, I hit him in the jugular and he did a death sprint about 80 yards. The trail was a spray of blood.

The cow took one right behind the shoulder, she took three steps and fell over. The lungs were soup, no bullet exit. Impact velocity 2588 ft/sec.

For years, the guys in my hunting group talked about the horror stories with Bergers blowing up and I avoided them, always shot nosler. But after reading through the forums, decided to give some Bergers a try, and they shot great out of my rifle, so last year was my first time using them on game and I will continue to do so with confidence.

 

[35WhelenAI]

What's been your personal experience with Bergers?

Zero personal experiences, however enough accounts that folks have posted over the years it's pretty well established how the Berrgers perform one way or the other.

 

[fracguy]

Shot this guy last year at 356 yards with 180 gr berger hybrids 300wm. Entrance was about the size of a dime, exit was a little bigger than a quarter and turned his lungs to mush. He was blowing lung chunks out both sides for the 40 yards he went with very minimal meat loss. Ribs only about 4" circle on either side was blood shot. I was impressed with them. Granted not an elk

 

[Navaluk]

Drilling out the tip of a Berger? I would say that sounds crazy but I don't want to offend any crazy people out there. Maybe just buy some other bullets. Same for those, "they pencil through" shootists. Enough of you quit using Berger 7mm 180 grain target hybrids, and they would be cheaper and easier to find for the rest of us. Go Hornady!

 

[Montucky]

Zero personal experiences, however enough accounts that folks have posted over the years it's pretty well established how the Berrgers perform one way or the other.

Fake News….. every popular bullet manufacturer is going to be blamed for hunter error on the internet.

 

[Montucky]

Does anyone have pictures of a Berger "pencil through"?

Yes….my 10yr old boy’s first deer, 430yds. 7saum 180 Hybrid. Penciled right through Bro

 

[eoperator]

Yes….my 10yr old boy’s first deer, 430yds. 7saum 180 Hybrid. Penciled right through BroView attachment 918763View attachment 918764

I thought bergers "blew up" on contact with the shoulder

 

[35WhelenAI]

Fake News….. every popular bullet manufacturer is going to be blamed for hunter error on the internet.

Fake News... Now we know the truth thanks to you. Bullets never have issues, it's hunter error. Thanks for clearing that up.

I believe I read the context of what was being said correctly. If I didn't, apologies.

 

[Redleg84]

Used my 7ss last 3 years for deer, 180gr Hybrids going around 2860fps MV.

One buck from last year I hit in the neck as it was lightly running across a cut no more than 50yrds away. Bullet impacted the spine and dropped the buck on the spot. I didn't recover any significant parts of the bullet, but it didn't exit.

Other buck last year was a frontal shot at close range, around 10 yards away. Shot went into the chest and exited behind the shoulder. Some bloodshot on the shoulder but nothing terrible. Significant damage to the lungs. Deer ran 20-30 yards.

Two years back my buck was, at most, 15 yards away, shot square in the chest. Zero meat damage, bullet went in, severed the artery above the heart and wrecked the lungs. Bullet came to rest up near the spine, deer dropped on the spot. The lead core was still in the jacket when I removed it, with a piece of jacket nearby. Here's a picture:

 

[CJ_BG]

Used my 7ss last 3 years for deer, 180gr Hybrids going around 2860fps MV.

One buck from last year I hit in the neck as it was lightly running across a cut no more than 50yrds away. Bullet impacted the spine and dropped the buck on the spot. I didn't recover any significant parts of the bullet, but it didn't exit.

Other buck last year was a frontal shot at close range, around 10 yards away. Shot went into the chest and exited behind the shoulder. Some bloodshot on the shoulder but nothing terrible. Significant damage to the lungs. Deer ran 20-30 yards.

Two years back my buck was, at most, 15 yards away, shot square in the chest. Zero meat damage, bullet went in, severed the artery above the heart and wrecked the lungs. Bullet came to rest up near the spine, deer dropped on the spot. The lead core was still in the jacket when I removed it, with a piece of jacket nearby. Here's a picture:

View attachment 922812

That bottom piece of jacket is usually what the biggest piece we recover looks like, as long as the lead makes it out

 

[Navaluk]

180 grain Berger Target Hybrid 7mm added another cow elk to the records of "miracle they work records" on Saturday. One shot quartering away at 407 yards. Maybe 20 yards of tracking?

 

[shooter7]

I've killed 3 elk with Berger bullets nonr of which were the 7mm 180 Hybrid, and I can say that I'm not a fan of how the classic hunter or HVLD bullets perform.


The first was my very first elk. It was a cow shot at 297 yards with the 168 Classic Hunter out of a 7mm Rem Mag with a muzzle velocity of 2950. She took 3 shots to the lungs before she fell over and a fourth when she tried to get up after walking over to her. After the 4 shot everything in front of the diaphragm was the consistency of strawberry jam that hasn't set up yet. It took about 15 minutes for her to die.

The second time I used bergers was when I was climbing into an awful place and decided to take my 260 Rem which was considerably lighter than my 300 wm. I shot a 5x5 bull at 65 yards with the 130 HVLD. Sent 2 into the lungs and 1 into the neck to anchor him. Muzzle velocity on that load was around 2700. The near side lung was 50% liquefied while the offside lung was damaged but still moderately intact.

The third elk was a cow that i had stalked into at about 35 yards. I was using HSM factory ammo loaded with the 150 HVLD in 270 Winchester. I put one shot into the lungs. She ran about 10 yards and stopped behind a few trees and some brush and stood there for about 5 minutes and fell over. I did the gutless method on her because she was bloating excessively by the time I got over to her. Its likely the bullet fragmented violently enough to rupture the guts.


Not a single one of those bullets exited an animal.


After seeing the aftermath of my brother shooting an antelope with the 215 hybrid out his 300 win mag I wasn't sold on those either. It appeared the first shot penetrate well either.

I am also firm believer that if a rifle doesn't shoot bergers well, then the barrel is probably juck. But after killing several elk with monos, both TTSX and CX, I've lost interest in shooting bergers for hunting applications. Just my 2 cents.