Help LS Wild design the new stock!

[Schmo]

. If y'all can successfully run a business by selling only to the people who will pay $1000 for a rough 2x4 with "proper" design, more power to ya. (I exaggerate for effect, but you get where I'm going?)

It won’t be a 2x4. I already addressed that. The last pics I posted are literally only the second rough model from the CAD guy. To this point, we have been focusing on grip, comb, and toe. We will address the forend. And it won’t be anywhere near $1,000

 

[naked wombats]

This is wood, so just tool paths not molds.

Do the inexpensive DIY-friendly market-hole-filling version first (but stop short of insulting customers with a 2x4 foreend). Then do a best-guess moderately finished SKU as a second act.

It's just software.

-J

I think @NSI has the right idea here.

A bunch of the group of folks willing to test different stocks, chamberings, barrel lengths etc are also likely not intimidated to tweak or modify an inexpensive but potentially awesome laminate stock.

If the price was right, and it came looking like a 2x4, if it performed well, out comes the grinder and flap wheel followed by an orbital until it was how I wanted it for contour and lengths.

Another subset will want something 100% ready to go with studs, swivels, rails and also looking pretty.

 

[OneGunTex]

(I exaggerate for effect, but you get where I'm going?)

It won’t be a 2x4. I already addressed that. The last pics I posted are literally only the second rough model from the CAD guy. To this point, we have been focusing on grip, comb, and toe. We will address the forend. And it won’t be anywhere near $1,000

Clearly you don't get where I'm going, but that's okay. I might buy your stock anyway. Time will tell if I see the value proposition.

 

[glock233]

Just remember as you guys get kicked around, only negative feedback matters for really helping you forward.

 

[Bluumoon]

One more thing, as someone relatively uneducated, I'm somewhat suspect of the phrase "proper" design. 150 years of rifles and for some reason 90% of them look the same and voila in your Edison-like genius you (and UM) found the One True Stock! Which is why I keep saying, convince me that this design is so good that the shape itself is worth more than any other laminate stock on the market.
I mock, don't take it the wrong way, but again I don't think I'm that unusual even for your average RS reader.

I would say the answer (as Form demonstrated w the Rokstok) is to put a camera on the scope and record view during shots to see how much reticle moves stock to stock if you want to know why one design over another is superior. Beyond that grab the stock and see how repeatable your grip/trigger pull is (and how much reticle moves during trigger pull) and are you able to get behind the rifle eyes closed and open them with a perfect view (repeatable index) from different shooting positions.

I would consider the above “measurables” after that are the refinements and adjustments to desired appearance/attachments/shooting sport come into play.

 

[TX_Mike D.]

On that, I agree completely.

There’s definitely a niche to be filled between a $2200 wooden Rokstok, an $800 Woox that is what it is, and a Boyd’s stock that isn’t well-designed. I would be shocked if you could not make a decent profit selling the “nice-to-haves” version of this stock for $600-800 and the bare essentials version for $400-500.

Remember that when you talk about increasing cost and lead time, that the customer who wants what he wants is still going to have to pay more and have it take longer to get what he wants. I factor that extra time and money into my decision to purchase something in the first place.

I generally agree with this. If possible is there a middle ground where someone could buy an “off the shelf” stock with no upgrades that will ship quickly at a lower price point and have options that can be added on for increased cost and lead time.

Those logistics could easily become overwhelming with too many customization options, but I would think (and could easily be wrong) that something like QD cups would be a pretty simple installation if some standard locations are options.

 

[bielenbm]

I’ve built a few stocks for buddies and myself in the last 6 months. While adding QD cups, rails, and studs isn’t hard it will add more time, work, protection headaches for you guys. The more options there are, the more chances of order mistakes. I’d just keep it simple. Get the stock shape how 99% would like it and send it!

 

[nm.otter]

Get the basics right and figure out how to make and sell them.

Finer points can be aftermarket initially -- consider bringing those in house once they make financial sense.

 

[JCMCUBIC]

I'm late to to the party...or fight...but my $.02:

1. Copy the forend length/size/rounded edges of the KRG Echo and inlet it for Sendero only with plenty of clearance. It's a good overall size and the Sendero inlet will keep it lighter.

2. Like already mentioned/planned, keep the level top edges of the stock like a chassis for weight reduction.

3. On the butt, keep the flat toe line even with the bottom of the grip, start the point of the comb ~1/2" below bore line, negative comb rising to ~1/2" above bore line at the heel. Hollow/skeletonize the butt like in the original pic to save the weight. This removes the need to elevate the toe line to lose weight and simplifies the stock. Having the lower toe line also gives a longer butt pad with more freedom when seating the stock in the shoulder. I "want" the recoil to be inline with the bore and my shoulder seated close to that line. However, having the option to seat it lower can be helpful. With the empty midsection of the stock, having a longer surface here doesn't carry as big of a weight penalty.

4. Grip...I'm pretty generic. Short trigger reach, close to vertical grip, and a slight swell. If it's as intricate as the MS or a simple as the Echo (rounded a bit), I'll be fine with it. If it is hand filling, look at hollowing it to reduce weight. If it's hollowed, it can also serve as a good place to epoxy in weight for anyone wanting more.

 

[JCMCUBIC]

After typing all that...

Just copy the Echo, with a flat toe line, heel raised to 1/2" above bore, negative comb, and hollow the inner section of the butt like the original pic.

 

[NDHUNTER24]

I may have missed it but do you plan on select few laminate colors? Not that its a big deal, Im just curious.

 

[Harvey_NW]

One more thing, as someone relatively uneducated, I'm somewhat suspect of the phrase "proper" design. 150 years of rifles and for some reason 90% of them look the same and voila in your Edison-like genius you (and UM) found the One True Stock! Which is why I keep saying, convince me that this design is so good that the shape itself is worth more than any other laminate stock on the market.

The geometry correlates with basic principles of physics, but since you can't seem to comprehend the concept, go actually shoot a properly designed stock and it should click.

 

[hibernation]

Has the skeletonized bit been scrapped? I'd prefer a solid buttstock, but I'm curious to hear rough weight estimates with / without.

 

[Schmo]

I may have missed it but do you plan on select few laminate colors? Not that its a big deal, Im just curious.

I think one or two, but that’s not necessarily set in stone at this point

 

[Schmo]

Something I did want to say:

Keep your feedback coming. Even if something that is said isn’t what we’re looking for, it helps us to be a little more critical of what we do.

Also, this project is not the end of the road for stocks from LS. Maybe we bring this out initially as a simple version, and then later as one where options are available. I’m not saying that’s how it will be, but it’s a possibility. If the Tikka launch goes well, we will definitely look hard at releasing it in other inlets too.

On this particular project, we didn’t set out to offer the most fully featured laminate stock on the market. We saw a gap in what is offered by someone like Boyd’s, and then custom walnut stocks. Obviously, laminate isn’t fine walnut, but there is a certain look and feel of shooting a wood stock. We wanted to make a properly designed wood stock available at a price that will be affordable by many.

 

[Sponge]

If the Tikka launch goes well, we will definitely look hard at releasing it in other inlets too

I'm particularly interested in this, especially for browning X-Bolt and Sauer 100. Both have somewhat complicated bottom metal inlets id prefer to not do myself - and both are lacking good aftermarket stocks. This is where my question above about selling flat top (non-inlet) stocks stemmed from.

As to features, I would happily pay for a stock that needs shaping, finishing, flush cups or swivels user installed, etc that costs less than a fully featured stock; but I'm also a glutton for punishment.

 

[NSI]

I'm particularly interested in this, especially for browning X-Bolt and Sauer 100. Both have somewhat complicated bottom metal inlets id prefer to not do myself - and both are lacking good aftermarket stocks. This is where my question above about selling flat top (non-inlet) stocks stemmed from.

As to features, I would happily pay for a stock that needs shaping, finishing, flush cups or swivels user installed, etc that costs less than a fully featured stock; but I'm also a glutton for punishment.

Sauer 100 is missing only one thing - a properly designed stock that fits it. The Venn diagram of people who have recently bought Sauers and people who appreciate proper stock ergonomics is essentially contained inside a single thread on this forum, and there’s plenty of them. Thanks to @EuroOptic for collecting the buyers neatly in one spot

-J

 

[Hypernatremia]

I would love a well designed stock for the Howa Mini. Negative comb, short trigger reach, flat toe. Don't even care if it's a bit heavy, Stocky's has the light weight thing covered for guys looking to UL-max.

 

[Sponge]

Sauer 100 is missing only one thing - a properly designed stock that fits it. The Venn diagram of people who have recently bought Sauers and people who appreciate proper stock ergonomics is essentially contained inside a single thread on this forum, and there’s plenty of them. Thanks to @EuroOptic for collecting the buyers neatly in one spot

-J

I had a mental sketch for a stock I was jokingly referring to as the "Field Sporter" (combo of Tikka Master Sporter and Sauer Field Shoot stocks) - the renderings of the LS stock feel like they were downloaded from that mental image. so much so I may be looking to see if I can fill and drill/inlet a tikka inlet to take a Sauer 100 action if that inlet doesn't become available for this stock (a a flat top stock). Like I said, glutton for punishment.

 

[Schmo]

In regards to the Sauer 100, that model has been discontinued by Sauer. So, the market for a stock is super small. However, if enough of you request it to make it worth while…maybe…