Heavy Arrow Bow Workups - Arrow, Insert and Broadhead Recommendations

[wildernessmaster]

Ok I started my journey in bow hunting in the heavy/slow killing projectile theology. Unfortunately, my early struggles learning to shoot, tuning bows, etc lead me away from it to light/fast - in lieu of actually getting arrows to hit targets

Now I am returning home to "what makes sense to me" as a gun bunny - heavy/slow.

Before I go on, I am not really looking to be talked out of it - so please keep comments and replies to being helpful in the wisdom and knowledge I am seeking.

Also before I go on, I have tried Grizzly Stiks (or Stixs or Stinks - sorry for you guys who love them). I did not like them. I invested the big benjamins in a whole set of their stuff and was sorely disappointed. Many of their arrows shot badly (out of the dozen I bought). Some because they were not straight (I spun them in a makeshift spinner). Some because I think their stiffness is inconsistent (I could find no other defect but some arrows just always flew badly every stinking time). Their killer Masai broadheads were barely sharp when I got them (I know any edge dulls, but I would expect a bit sharper than what I got). Finally their quality was poor, in general. Out of the first dozen 3 had the shafts break at the inserts just shooting targets.

So while I may use their broadheads once I get my arrows worked up (and I spend some quality time sharpening them) - I won't be using their arrow systems.

I am looking for some guidance for building some heavy arrows. Not stuck on absolutely 650, 700, 800 grains - I am liking the approach Ranch Fairy (shout out to you dude) takes. It is exactly what I do and know from my gun bunny world. I would like to push towards 650 gr but if I have an arrow at 575 gr that shoots dead on I will take it.

As the title says, what are your recommendations for Arrow (micro or not, brand, etc), inserts, and broadheads for heavy arrow configurations? My main bow is a Matthews VXR, but I also plan on doing this for a Diamond Deploy SB and a Mission Ballistic 2.0. The Matthews is 29.5/70 and the other two are 29.5/60

 

[yoopshoot]

I’ve used axis 260s with brass inserts and iron will collars. Finished out at 580 grains. They fly around 285fps , but I’m shooting a heavy bow. 80lb/31.5” draw. The arrows have been incredibly durable and hit very hard. I’ve used ximpacts/pierce platinums in the past. I find my current setup with the axis is a simpler approach and is more durable. I’ve been very satisfied with their performance .


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[big44a4]

Ok I started my journey in bow hunting in the heavy/slow killing projectile theology. Unfortunately, my early struggles learning to shoot, tuning bows, etc lead me away from it to light/fast - in lieu of actually getting arrows to hit targets

Now I am returning home to "what makes sense to me" as a gun bunny - heavy/slow.

Before I go on, I am not really looking to be talked out of it - so please keep comments and replies to being helpful in the wisdom and knowledge I am seeking.

Also before I go on, I have tried Grizzly Stiks (or Stixs or Stinks - sorry for you guys who love them). I did not like them. I invested the big benjamins in a whole set of their stuff and was sorely disappointed. Many of their arrows shot badly (out of the dozen I bought). Some because they were not straight (I spun them in a makeshift spinner). Some because I think their stiffness is inconsistent (I could find no other defect but some arrows just always flew badly every stinking time). Their killer Masai broadheads were barely sharp when I got them (I know any edge dulls, but I would expect a bit sharper than what I got). Finally their quality was poor, in general. Out of the first dozen 3 had the shafts break at the inserts just shooting targets.

So while I may use their broadheads once I get my arrows worked up (and I spend some quality time sharpening them) - I won't be using their arrow systems.

I am looking for some guidance for building some heavy arrows. Not stuck on absolutely 650, 700, 800 grains - I am liking the approach Ranch Fairy (shout out to you dude) takes. It is exactly what I do and know from my gun bunny world. I would like to push towards 650 gr but if I have an arrow at 575 gr that shoots dead on I will take it.

As the title says, what are your recommendations for Arrow (micro or not, brand, etc), inserts, and broadheads for heavy arrow configurations? My main bow is a Matthews VXR, but I also plan on doing this for a Diamond Deploy SB and a Mission Ballistic 2.0. The Matthews is 29.5/70 and the other two are 29.5/60

A lot of options to get there. Here’s quick list off top of my head.

Complete Day six arrow setup. Or even day six, be X impact or deep impact, and or easton axis arrow with ethics components. Only heard good things about ethics (non spinning components) and they come with a lot of options to get the weight you want.


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[Gmark]

I have been going through the same process as you (following Ranch Fairy). After my bare shaft paper tuning session I ended up going with GT Hunter XT arrows (300 spine), Ethics Archery inserts (200gr) and Magnus Stinger Buzzcut (125gr) broad heads. I really like the Ethics Archery inserts because I can customize it to the weight that I need. Once I get all the components, I will try the setup out and see how it works for me but I look forward to a nice heavy arrow setup. I am shooting 60lb / 27.5" draw.
On a side note - I put this setup together for hunting whitetail and hogs in Florida and Georgia for now.

 

[D.Rose]

Check out the Valkryie system. Def not a ranch fairy fan but the Valkryie systems would be something I would look at if I went that route.

 

[Beendare]

I'm not a heavy arrow fan simply because an average weight [500gr] arrow works so well....but I'm not here to throw cold water on your idea.

I have shot 800gr arrows for Water Buff in Australia and if you are really going that route I would recommend the arrow tubes.

You can get the arrow tubes in 3 weights. [3 rivers is one place] ...and they work with almost all brands of arrows. A cheap and easy way to add weight that doesn't mess with your spine like adding a bunch of tip weight.

Now you really need to glue the heavy tubes in as they will blow out your inserts and noks if you don't. The lighter ones not so much which means you can just take them out if you change your mind.

________

 

[TBarron]

Easton axis 260, brass hit 75g, BAR footer, 125g broadhead. 576g at 29.5in with 3 fletch blazers. Call it a day. This whole set up costs about $125 a dozen minus broadheads.


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[roursbourn]

I would suggest Black Eagle shafts. X-Impacts for a nano diameter shaft or a Spartan for a standard dia. You can achieve a very high FOC with your heavy arrow with these shafts. The spines go to 200 in both types. Get some 150gr Iron Wills and/or load up with insert weights. I’ve built arrows to about 590gr and shot great. Softball size groups at 80yds. 265 to 295 FPS is a good speed target. Slower arcs like crazy. faster you will have broadhead tuning issues.

 

[roursbourn]

Also a rule of thumb for point weight. Adding 25gr to a point is equivalent to increasing draw weight by 5lbs. The Gold Tip website has charts to 150gr. I would reference that

 

[Zac]

Why don't you just use the Ranch Fairy test pack from Sirius and do a real Ranch Fairly build.

RANCH FAIRY TEST KITS

The Ranch Fairy test kit was inspired by the WILD man himself, Troy Fowler. This kit is specifically designed for those who want to play around with variability and shaft spine identification without breaking the bank. Not all bows respond the same to mass and Front of Center (FOC) variation...

www.siriusarchery.com

 

[Zac]

Field Point Test Pack, Heavy - 200-300 gn

Heavy Field Point Test Pack - .310 (5/16) 2 each of 200, 225, 250, 275, and 300 gn field points, and 2 each 15 gn Point Weight Washers

ethicsarchery.com

 

[Muddler]

I just started doing the same thing for my CT5. It's 80# so I wanted to try 200 and 250 spine. Based off of everything that I've read it seems like outserts are destined to bend so I didn't want a microdiameter arrow. I also wanted to get the same brand in both spines to save on components.

I went with Black Eagle Spartans. You can get the Renegade/Rampage insert weights and screw them into the insert from the nock end and change your weight as you see fit. Bought 2 of each cut to length from Lancaster.

Just got the bow all set up and am hoping to start the tuning them shortly.

 

[BackstrapReaper]

Ok I started my journey in bow hunting in the heavy/slow killing projectile theology. Unfortunately, my early struggles learning to shoot, tuning bows, etc lead me away from it to light/fast - in lieu of actually getting arrows to hit targets

Now I am returning home to "what makes sense to me" as a gun bunny - heavy/slow.

Before I go on, I am not really looking to be talked out of it - so please keep comments and replies to being helpful in the wisdom and knowledge I am seeking.

Also before I go on, I have tried Grizzly Stiks (or Stixs or Stinks - sorry for you guys who love them). I did not like them. I invested the big benjamins in a whole set of their stuff and was sorely disappointed. Many of their arrows shot badly (out of the dozen I bought). Some because they were not straight (I spun them in a makeshift spinner). Some because I think their stiffness is inconsistent (I could find no other defect but some arrows just always flew badly every stinking time). Their killer Masai broadheads were barely sharp when I got them (I know any edge dulls, but I would expect a bit sharper than what I got). Finally their quality was poor, in general. Out of the first dozen 3 had the shafts break at the inserts just shooting targets.

So while I may use their broadheads once I get my arrows worked up (and I spend some quality time sharpening them) - I won't be using their arrow systems.

I am looking for some guidance for building some heavy arrows. Not stuck on absolutely 650, 700, 800 grains - I am liking the approach Ranch Fairy (shout out to you dude) takes. It is exactly what I do and know from my gun bunny world. I would like to push towards 650 gr but if I have an arrow at 575 gr that shoots dead on I will take it.

As the title says, what are your recommendations for Arrow (micro or not, brand, etc), inserts, and broadheads for heavy arrow configurations? My main bow is a Matthews VXR, but I also plan on doing this for a Diamond Deploy SB and a Mission Ballistic 2.0. The Matthews is 29.5/70 and the other two are 29.5/60

What is your intended use, i would think that would be most important bit of info? If its closer range shooting at smaller animals (deer, pigs, bear) then with your weight and draw, inside of 35 yards you won't see much difference between a 650 and 800 gn arrow as far as drop because most likely you will have at least 2 pins or a slider single pin.
if you are planning on longer range shots, say 40 to 70 yards, i would consider what you accept for trajectory limits. A 500 gn arrow will kill anything from Elk down with a fixed blade with no problem.
That being said, I've found the ethics insert/outserts a very good system for building up overall weight/duribility for your arrows.

 

[wildernessmaster]

What is your intended use, i would think that would be most important bit of info? If its closer range shooting at smaller animals (deer, pigs, bear) then with your weight and draw, inside of 35 yards you won't see much difference between a 650 and 800 gn arrow as far as drop because most likely you will have at least 2 pins or a slider single pin.
if you are planning on longer range shots, say 40 to 70 yards, i would consider what you accept for trajectory limits. A 500 gn arrow will kill anything from Elk down with a fixed blade with no problem.
That being said, I've found the ethics insert/outserts a very good system for building up overall weight/duribility for your arrows.

Thank you...

To answer your question and also clarify this a bit more...

First let me say, I am setting up 3 different bows for 3 different scenarios. One of the bows will shoot my (previously standard) 340 spine RIP TKO Elite arrows with a range of 100 grain broadheads, blunts and judo points (for small small game). Let's call this Bow 1 (it will be either my Mission Ballistic 2 or my Diamond Deploy SB - still trying out which shoots better with that arrow setup). Those arrows will be sub 500 gr overall.

Bow 2 (which will be whichever one of the Ballistic or Deploy that shoots less well with the 340 arrow set up) will be my 3 pin, fixed sight ( sub 30 yard) heavy arrow setup. I want to use it for tree stand and tree saddle hunting.

Bow 3 is my Matthews Vertix (sorry was drooling over the VXR and mistyped that in my original post). I want to set up a heavy arrow for out to 60 yards on that one. It has a Montana Black Gold Ascent adjustable on it.

Right now I am looking to do a work up for bows 2 and 3 like RF describes. Try different weights and spines. I will be buying the RF test kit (field point wise). Questions/Suggestions I am looking for:

1. Do you guys recommend the Ethics spinner inserts or do you (who shoot heavy) just shoot their non-spinning weighted inserts?
2. What are some good base arrow options (outside of the test kit options) for 250 and 300 class-ish arrows. I have been to several shops (indies and big box) and everything there are 340, 400, 500 class arrows. What are some good arrows that don't break the bank since I will probably be experimenting pretty heavy with them.
3. I have the GS Massai, any other recommendations for good heavy broadheads (single bevel and non)?

Thanks... its a journey...

 

[Beendare]

Since I've been down this rabbit hole before.....you have heard the old saying, "Beware the man with one gun" right?

Its true^


FWIW, I can tell you I've flip flopped between bows before....and my overall shooting was worse because of it.

_____

 

[big44a4]

Since I've been down this rabbit hole before.....you have heard the old saying, "Beware the man with one gun" right?

Its true^


FWIW, I can tell you I've flip flopped between bows before....and my overall shooting was worse because of it.

_____

Agreed! I shot the best when I only had 1 bow and spent all my time shooting that 1 bow. Still only have 2 (target/hunting) but overall shot the best back when I only had 1.


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[Bill V]

I'd suggest Axis 260 with Iron Will HIT, Impact Collar, and Broadhead. Choosing the 25 grain, 25 grain, and 125 grain will give you about 550 grains total. The HITs are available in 25, 50, 75, & 100 grain if you want to go higher. Substitute Black Eagle Rampage 250 to get a little higher FOC. I'm currently shooting both. Don't forget that momentum is converted to force x time at impact. Choosing a broadhead that reduces the force needed to penetrate will greatly increase penetration. Higher mass will increase penetration but trajectory is the trade off so how high you should go depends on how far you want to shoot. I recorded a Lethal Podcast (heavy arrow guys) last week talking through the physics of arrow penetration along with my discussions with Dr. Ashby. If you are wanting to go heavy, it's worth a listen.

 

[carsonkeys]

Call Rob Neilson at the Ashby Bowhunting Foundation

 

[deertrout]

Ok I started my journey in bow hunting in the heavy/slow killing projectile theology. Unfortunately, my early struggles learning to shoot, tuning bows, etc lead me away from it to light/fast - in lieu of actually getting arrows to hit targets

Now I am returning home to "what makes sense to me" as a gun bunny - heavy/slow.

Before I go on, I am not really looking to be talked out of it - so please keep comments and replies to being helpful in the wisdom and knowledge I am seeking.

Also before I go on, I have tried Grizzly Stiks (or Stixs or Stinks - sorry for you guys who love them). I did not like them. I invested the big benjamins in a whole set of their stuff and was sorely disappointed. Many of their arrows shot badly (out of the dozen I bought). Some because they were not straight (I spun them in a makeshift spinner). Some because I think their stiffness is inconsistent (I could find no other defect but some arrows just always flew badly every stinking time). Their killer Masai broadheads were barely sharp when I got them (I know any edge dulls, but I would expect a bit sharper than what I got). Finally their quality was poor, in general. Out of the first dozen 3 had the shafts break at the inserts just shooting targets.

So while I may use their broadheads once I get my arrows worked up (and I spend some quality time sharpening them) - I won't be using their arrow systems.

I am looking for some guidance for building some heavy arrows. Not stuck on absolutely 650, 700, 800 grains - I am liking the approach Ranch Fairy (shout out to you dude) takes. It is exactly what I do and know from my gun bunny world. I would like to push towards 650 gr but if I have an arrow at 575 gr that shoots dead on I will take it.

As the title says, what are your recommendations for Arrow (micro or not, brand, etc), inserts, and broadheads for heavy arrow configurations? My main bow is a Matthews VXR, but I also plan on doing this for a Diamond Deploy SB and a Mission Ballistic 2.0. The Matthews is 29.5/70 and the other two are 29.5/60

I shoot a 29-70 Matthew's Triax set at 65, very close to your setup. I went through the RF process with test kits from four manufacturers and settled on the Day Six HD 300's cut at 27.5" (bout 28.5" with the outsert) and 250gr up front including the outsert weight. Arrow weight is a smidge under 600gr. My bow also liked several points heavier with that same arrow so I could have chased higher weight and FOC but it really liked 250 so that's what I settled on. I was very tempted to go with the Day Six Evo-X broadheads but the curve on the blade and potential sharpening issues scared me away. I really liked the looks and reviews for the tuffhead but decided to go with cutthroat broadheads. We will see how they perform this fall.



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[wildernessmaster]

Since I've been down this rabbit hole before.....you have heard the old saying, "Beware the man with one gun" right?

Its true^


FWIW, I can tell you I've flip flopped between bows before....and my overall shooting was worse because of it.

_____

Thank you for the wisdom... From my background I am very familiar with that saying. The old Delta Sniper guys use to throw that one at me all the time. And for what its worth - it has some truth. That said I have learned in my 50+ years of life that I am not one of those guys. I am one of the guys who can pick up any weapon and be very effective with it. So thank you, but i have already considered it.

In truth I also have some hardship with flinging a $200 arrow at a squirrel or rabbit - not to mention a heavy arrow setup will be like shooting a 30 caliber bullet at one.

I will however keep your wisdom in the back of my head should I run into frustrations with too many things at once. I have learned that "bow" lesson a couple of times.