Goat rifle

[brockel]

Straight out of the Alaska Game and Fish website: Adult female goats weigh about 180 pounds, with males averaging about 280 pounds (in late-summer); prime-aged males often weigh more than 300 pounds, with the largest male yet weighed topping 385 pounds.

Mature billies (5 or 6+ year olds) can barely be moved by one guy. Take a look at the weight of a nanny vs mature billy listed by the AG&F.

My son has a PRC. It's shoots remarkable groups but we've been less than impressed with it's performance on antelope and deer that were shot through the vitals. That's why I am very skeptical about what it will do on mtn goats....especially with winter coats at 200+ yards.

What bullet have you been using? Wife and I have killed probably close to a dozen elk either with a 6.5-06 or 6.5 prc with 140 grain Berger vld and they have tipped over the same or faster than the ones I’ve watched a friend shoot with his 300 rum and 200 grain accubonds

 

[Stalker69]

Straight out of the Alaska Game and Fish website: Adult female goats weigh about 180 pounds, with males averaging about 280 pounds (in late-summer); prime-aged males often weigh more than 300 pounds, with the largest male yet weighed topping 385 pounds.

Mature billies (5 or 6+ year olds) can barely be moved by one guy. Take a look at the weight of a nanny vs mature billy listed by the AG&F.

My son has a PRC. It's shoots remarkable groups but we've been less than impressed with it's performance on antelope and deer that were shot through the vitals. That's why I am very skeptical about what it will do on mtn goats....especially with winter coats at 200+ yards.

I’ve shot deer, elk and antelope with a 243, ( one six point bull I shot at 375 yards with the 243) with absolutely no issues. And have seen a 6.5 creedmore used on numerous elk, and several moose, And many more moose taken with a 270 win. and they took care of them very effectively. I now have a 6.5 prc as well, but I have not killed any thing with it yet. But can’t see how it won’t do the job as well as my 243; and 6.5 creedmore. I have seen these same calibers and many larger calibers up to 338 win mag. fail miserably when a poor shot was made, even on antelope ( one guy shot two legs off an antelope with a 338, and then “ in his words a perfect shot” through the guts to kill it) and deer. But that’s why there are so many choices, shoot what you like, and can shoot well, and have faith in. It’s hard for me to believe the 6.5 prc would have any issue with any thing up to and including moose, eland size critters.

 

[gerry35]

Mountain goats are about three and a half feet tall at the shoulder, and weigh between 150 and 220 pounds, or about the same weight as a grown man.
If they require a 300 WM, they must be super heros, or darn near immortal.

Average billiy's and nanny's yes but a big mature billy around here easily gets over 300 lbs and bigger for a really big one. They are super tough though and live in country that's nasty. The outfitter I worked for when I was guiding for them had some real nightmares with archery hunters since they always head into the worst country they can find when hit.

I've gone on the record earlier in this thread seeing then shot with a 260 Rem on the small side to 9.3x62 on the big side. saw no real difference between any of them. I like the OP's choice of the 6.5 PRC on up to the faster 270's and 7mm's the best, Having a good bullet that will open up a big wound channel is the best. The 300's work too if a guy wants to use one and are nice to carry in grizzly country.

 

[carsonkeys]

I won’t get into a pissing match with anyone, but will drop this little anecdote. My wife just killed a billy at 470y with a little 6.5cm shooting 147 ELD-Ms. She was able to watch her impact and prepare for a follow up shot, which wasn’t needed. The results were exactly what I have experienced with previous animals of this combo.

Caliber-sized entrance, substantial disruption the the chest cavity with a tennis- to golf-ball sized hole exiting the chest. I typically get exits with smaller bodied animals like deer, pronghorn, and goat, but generally not with elk or larger.
I will continue to hunt exclusively with that combo.
Exit with offside shoulder on


Exit with offside shoulder removed.

 

[brockel]

I won’t get into a pissing match with anyone, but will drop this little anecdote. My wife just killed a billy at 470y with a little 6.5cm shooting 147 ELD-Ms. She was able to watch her impact and prepare for a follow up shot, which wasn’t needed. The results were exactly what I have experienced with previous animals of this combo.

Caliber-sized entrance, substantial disruption the the chest cavity with a tennis- to golf-ball sized hole exiting the chest. I typically get exits with smaller bodied animals like deer, pronghorn, and goat, but generally not with elk or larger.
I will continue to hunt exclusively with that combo. View attachment 594861
Exit with offside shoulder on

View attachment 594862
Exit with offside shoulder removed.

Any pictures of the goat? I’m heading out in the morning to head north for mine

 

[woods89]

I won’t get into a pissing match with anyone, but will drop this little anecdote. My wife just killed a billy at 470y with a little 6.5cm shooting 147 ELD-Ms. She was able to watch her impact and prepare for a follow up shot, which wasn’t needed. The results were exactly what I have experienced with previous animals of this combo.

Caliber-sized entrance, substantial disruption the the chest cavity with a tennis- to golf-ball sized hole exiting the chest. I typically get exits with smaller bodied animals like deer, pronghorn, and goat, but generally not with elk or larger.
I will continue to hunt exclusively with that combo. View attachment 594861
Exit with offside shoulder on

View attachment 594862
Exit with offside shoulder removed.

Congrats on the goat! Be great to have these posted in the 6.5 thread!

 

[carsonkeys]

Any pictures of the goat? I’m heading out in the morning to head north for mine

 

[carsonkeys]

Congrats on the goat! Be great to have these posted in the 6.5 thread!

I’ll do it.

 

[gerry35]

View attachment 594976View attachment 594977View attachment 594978View attachment 594979

Congrats to your wife and you! Bonus points for a nice LH Tikka rifle.

 

[brockel]

View attachment 594976View attachment 594977View attachment 594978View attachment 594979

Awesome. What part of the world?

 

[carsonkeys]

Awesome. What part of the world?

BC. Smoky and hot as hell here rn.

Good luck on your hunt man!

 

[Stalker69]

I won’t get into a pissing match with anyone, but will drop this little anecdote. My wife just killed a billy at 470y with a little 6.5cm shooting 147 ELD-Ms. She was able to watch her impact and prepare for a follow up shot, which wasn’t needed. The results were exactly what I have experienced with previous animals of this combo.

Caliber-sized entrance, substantial disruption the the chest cavity with a tennis- to golf-ball sized hole exiting the chest. I typically get exits with smaller bodied animals like deer, pronghorn, and goat, but generally not with elk or larger.
I will continue to hunt exclusively with that combo. View attachment 594861
Exit with offside shoulder on

View attachment 594862
Exit with offside shoulder removed.

Well I’ll be, and at over twice the distance Jimss doubted a creedmore was good for. ( and he asked to" let him know how that goes," sounds like it went great ) And to top it off, looks as though, what an 18 or 20 inch barrel I am guessing, on that” inferior “ rifle. Nice job.

 

[fatheadpr]

this will be a little long winded as i was blessed with many opinions haha.

As a handloader/ hunter I am very familiar with amunition components, terminal energy theory, sectional density, ballistic coefficients so on and so on, and the end result of changing each component, which i have observed in real time.

30-06 the greatest huning round ever created (if your over 60) the traditional bullet used was some type of soft point or round nose expanding bullet and guys were shooting reasonable ranges around 400 yards so the bullet would enter and fully expand doing a very effective job dispatching animals. the riffle and ammo are being used for their designed purpose and are very effective. shoot that same round at 1000 yards and you now dont have the energy to effectivly expand the bullet and cause enough damage to swiftly dispatch the animal and it runs off into the sunset never to be seen again.

following this thought process you need to select the round according to your hunt, if not calibre at the very least projectile.

Example: if i am going for sheep and know im going to shoot longer ranges i will select a thin jacketed bullet designed to expand at lower velocities like an eldx or some other long range hunting projectile, not a solid bullet like a barnes that wont perform as designed at lower velocities. If i am going to be at close range high velocity like a bear in the woods i am going to select a projectile that is designed to stay together at close range high energy like a barnes solid. For everything in between you have controlled expansion bullets like a partition or some similar projectile designed to expand at medium velosity and medium ranges.

the objective here is to research the area you are hunting and what the most common ranges you will be shooting and game you are targeting, then select the correct round for the job. google is an amazing asset here as most bullet manufacturers list the specs of the projectiles they manufanufacter, effective velocities being the most inportant factor when choosing factory loaded "premium" ammo, then the cartridge manufacturer will have on the box what velocities they are achieving and at what ranges with a given barrel length. to say pick a 30 caliber and that is the only choice is inaccurate as i could then select any riffle from 30-378 weatherby magnum 4666 ft/lbs muzzle energy to 300 blackout at 990 ft/lbs muzzle energy, capable of firing the same .308 projectile but are not the same thing. you dont need a semi truck to drop your kids off at school a sedan will get the job done.

At this time i shoot a tikka t3x lite in 6.5x55 swede for my goat hunts.
I handload a 143 grain eldx projectile which is effective down to 1600 fps per manufacturer.

muzzle velocity is 2700 fps and 2300 ft/lbs of energy.

800 yard velocitty is approx 1679 fps and 895 ft/lbs of energy so the projectile will work properly per the manufacturer out to 800 yards in my riffle.

conventional wisdom says 1000ft/lbs at the animal for deer sized game and 2000ft/lbs on elk sized game to reach the vitals and dipatch the animal.

lets say a goat is bullet resistant and can handle a bit more of a smack than a large deer i will say a safe energy level is approx 1300 ft/lbs that means safely my 6.5x55 is a 500 yard gun for this purpose, using the information avaiable to me. If I want to push it we could go to 1000 ft/lbs required for a deer and that would push me out to 700 yards, not out to the 800 effective yards per bullet specs. my limit for goats is actually 400 yards and under as too much can go wrong too fast up in the cliffs at longer ranges.

My final thoughts, a goat is a thin skinned animal much like a deer, elk, moose and almost all other north american game the amount of hair has little effect in reality( take a knife and stab a goat hide then a deer hide side by side and tell me if you feel a diiference. its the mass of bone, meat and skin between the hair and vitals we are worried about, and im willing to bet you could not tell me the difference between a section of goat rib and a section of whitetail rib. the issue is not that they are bullet proof its that your margin for error in the cliffs is much smaller than open fields and flat forrests, if i was to shoot a deer at 300 yards with a 300 win mag and it ran 50 yards before falling down and dying i would call that a clean kill and be proud of myself, on the flip side if i shot a goat at 300 yards with the same rifle and it ran 50 yards before it died very likely falling down to some ledge i cant recover it from in the process, that goat was hard to kill, same result but the goat is bullet proof. Almost seems like an excuse/story i would tell to make myself feel better because i lost an animal or destroyed the trophy. Choose a firearm you are comfortable/familiar with, in a reasonable "hunting" calibre and pick your shots according to its capabilities .264(6.5) to .500 makes no difference if used correctly, pick your shot placement lung and heart are effective for killing and front shoulder is great to prevent them from running so you can do forward high lung shot (my usual choice)or you could shoot the front shoulder with a follow up heart lung shot, either in my opinion being a good choice. get a rangefinder dont guess because you are most likely wrong and it makes a big difference in bullet performance. You are the hunter it is your duty to dispatch the animal as humanely as possible so be informed educate yourself on the hunt and dont be affraid to go home empty handed if the shot isnt there, i just returned from a 10 day fly in goat hunt empty handed after seeing 12 goats because i did not feel i could safely recover the animals or make a clean kill, just my 20 cents.

 

[carsonkeys]

Well I’ll be, and at over twice the distance Jimss doubted a creedmore was good for. ( and he asked to" let him know how that goes," sounds like it went great ) And to top it off, looks as though, what an 18 or 20 inch barrel I am guessing, on that” inferior “ rifle. Nice job.

Good eye. 18.5” tube.