First Bolt Action: Buy Once or Slowly Upgrade

[OctoberRain]

Good morning, all,

My experience has been largely limited to handguns and I'm looking to get into rifles so I can hopefully get into hunting. My job finally allows me time to pursue my hobbies.

I currently have a 22LR that I target shoot with. Do you all have advice on whether I should:

a. Buy a nice bolt action (Seekins, Alamo Precision Rifle, etc) so I can buy once cry once
Or
b. Start with a Tikka/Weatherby then upgrade later

I understand that I should spend more on the glass and have a separate budget of up to 1200ish for the scope. Also, Im trying not to accumulate a large armory of bolt actions, so wanted to be sure before purchasing.

Caliber will likely be .308 although I'm also considering 6.5 Creedmore. I ultimately want to hunt in AK once I get enough experience...one day.

Thanks

 

[Q_Sertorius]

What are you getting for the extra money if you buy the more expensive rifle?

There are many threads around here comparing these rifles.

I like Tikkas. There’s nothing “starter rifle” about the action, trigger, or barrel. I upgraded the stock significantly and the bottom metal for a pure aesthetic improvement. The base rifle is very good.

The same could be said of the Sauer 100 (Eurooptic has a sale on these right now).

.308 is a perfectly fine cartridge. So are 6.5 CM, .243, 7mm08, 6mm CM, etc.

Instead of focusing on the cartridge, however, start with the bullet you want to use and your maximum range. Then pick a cartridge that puts that bullet at your maximum range at or above the minimum terminal velocity to ensure good performance (e.g., 1800 FPS for an ELDM).


____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”

 

[OctoberRain]

Thanks for the reply, sir.

Honestly, I was thinking I probably would end up getting the itch to upgrade in the future and I could avoid doing that by buying it up front. The weight benefit isn't there vs a Tikka Roughtech or Superlite.

I handled a few Tikkas in store and they felt nice, especially the bolt of the Tikka.

Shot range, I'm probably practicing out to 400 yards but don't really see how I'd be shooting that far hunting in the mountains. I could be wrong as I'm starting to learn from scratch. Didn't grow up around hunters.

I'll look at bullets vs cartridge and range more.

 

[Wolfshead]

I think that what you intend to hunt is important to know.
I have a Tikka T3x, .308 Win and love it.
mine has shot softball sized groups out to 300 yards with my handloads.
This is such a personal thing and you’re going to get as many opinions as people who reply.
Personally I would get a Tikka and then if you choose to upgrade it with the various options.
Other posts may differ.

 

[OctoberRain]

I forgot to put that in there. Mostly interested in deer, Big Horn sheep, Dall sheep, and the like, maybe elk. I've been hooked after eating various wild game and am in it for the harvesting and meat, less trophies.

Appreciate your opinion.

 

[Wolfshead]

I hunt whitetails.
I’ve only ever been able to shoot out to 300 yards, as that is the extent at my home range.
That is fine with me and it is within my capabilities, so I’m good with that limit.
Where I hunt it can be as close as ten yards and as far as 300+ if on an open field.
I know my 308 is capable in my situations.
My Tikka is a compact as I hunt mostly in the thick stuff and I like a carbine length, quick to point, agile rifle for that, that I can carry all day and for miles.
I love to still hunt/track so I’m set up for that, but I can still sit a stand if I choose.
Think about how you would like to hunt, the ranges you’re comfortable with, and the game you’re planning to hunt, and where….
Anyway you go will be good I think, as long as it gets you to your final goal.

 

[OctoberRain]

Gotcha. Since I live in a state where suppressors are legal, I want to eventually get the barrel cut to 18" and threaded for suppressor. That way the total rifle length isn't very long. The roughtech is pre threaded but it's hard to find a 20inch one right handed not in ember color.

I want to hunt and track. Range will vary as my shooting gets better I guess but the closer to my transportation the less packing it out alone (eventually) will suck Also gotta learn to process etc

 

[Jhconnected]

lots of good advice so far. A lot will depend on your rifle budget as well.

Since you are very inexperienced with rifles, I recommend you get a Tikka in a cartridge something no more recoil heavy than a 6.5 PRC/270/30-06. Make sure it’s threaded so you can brake or suppress it and pony up for stainless. The reason for this is because you are new to rifles and with so little experience you don’t want to throw big money down and later realize it’s not what you wanted. If you want to upgrade the Tikka you can. But you will be able to get experience behind a rifle and learn what you like, how you handle recoil, what stock you like, scope, etc.

Then, if you’re wanting more you can upgrade.

Also, investing in range time and a shooting class may be a better use of money.

Note: despite their mythical like reputation here, they aren’t all guaranteed to shoot but they are you’re best bet outside of spending over $5000.

Here is the TLDR rant:

What you get when buying a rifle more costly than something like a Tikka isn’t always guaranteed accuracy but instead it’s better stock, cerakote, cosmetics, build quality, etc.

If you’re wanting to buy a guaranteed accuracy that’s bullet proof you will need to go all the way up to a custom rifle or something like Gunwerks. The Christiansens, Fierces and Seekins of the world have accuracy guarantees but you really need to read the fine print. Typically if one 3 shot group out of an almost infinite number of groups makes their guarantee then it passes even if all the others are well outside their guarantee.

Certain custom builders and Gunwerks are people I trust to build you a rifle with that accuracy and reasonably stand behind their guarantee. But you’re paying for it.

As I’ve gotten older, I tend to follow the “buy once cry once/you pay for what you get/pay the man” advice. But, this may not be the path for you because you are new to rifles and know what you think you want now but once you actually get into rifles that will likely change.

 

[Wolfshead]

This is so true especially starting out. You said it well, as when you really get into this, you will find out what works and what doesn’t and your thinking is going to change.
I started out with a REM 700 with a 24” barrel. It is a great rifle, but it is not a good fit for how I like to hunt.
But, I did not know that then, so now I have a rifle that i mostly use and its total length is 39”.
Great advice above!

 

[OctoberRain]

As always appreciate all the advice.

I'm pretty sold at this point on getting the threaded 20" Tikka T3X Lite.

I'll be a decent regular at the range once I get a rifle and take some lessons. That's already budgeted for.

My budget for rifle, scope, and suppressor is around 5k all in, but I'm also happy not spending all that at this point. Just because I saved it all doesn't mean I need to spend it haha. It'll be way lower than that for the Tikka set up.

Plus after becoming proficient at shooting, I still have to learn to hunt. I'll learn a lot a long the way and then can think about modifying it or upgrading later.

 

[Jhconnected]

Another thing, you can always move a scope to another rifle. So, if you spend big on it you can continue using it.

Lots to think about in the scope. MOA vs MIL, FFP vs SFP, reticle, etc.

I personally like a reticle that’s not too cluttered so it doesn’t block too much of the view when trying to see/judge an animal.

 

[OctoberRain]

That's a good point. My only experience has been a Vortex Diamondback 2 on my 22.

I'll do a deep dive into scopes now

 

[sdupontjr]

308 20" threaded Tikka, however in a CTR. not Lite. Its a little heavier that my 308 T3 Lite but you get the idea. If your into upgrading, you can take a stock Tikka, add a Limbsaver pad, a Victor Cheek Riser and a Elay Precision Trigger spring to bring the trigger down lower all for about $100. Free float the barrel and got shoot little biddy groups.




Oh and bought this one used on the site and it still hammers. This is the T3 lite in 308. Same thing, free float barrel, limbsaver and I did add a victor cheek riser on this one as well. Also trigger spring.


So you have to decide: 1) do i want / need a custom expensive rifle to hunt with or to tell everyone I have one. 2) get an out of the box accurate rifle, that with minimal upgrades will feel and shoot possibly better for minimal cost. JMO

 

[OctoberRain]

Awesome. Do you know roughly how much your total setup weighs roughly?

 

[sdupontjr]

I don't have a scale but I did a breakdown a while back when I bought it. The CTR comes in a different stock with different mag setup. For my hunting, I didnt like that long mag sticking out the bottom so I swapped it for a Tikka Roughtech stock, which you see above. The CTR stock, bottom metal and mags are a tgood bit heavier that the REG tikka stocks. I also removed the CTR rail that comes with it and installed the UM tikka rings. It definately made it lighter that in stock form. Now one thing to consider when looking at weight is the optic.

The camo T3 that I picked up used here on the site has a Schmidt Bender Polar T96 4-16x56 on it. Heavier than normal optic, but the best low light scope on the market as far as I'm comcerned. So for it's intended purpose, the setup works great. I use it for my Box blinds in hardwoods where low light it king and very needed.

The CTR with its given optic is less than 1 lb heavier that the T3 lite, even with the heavier barrel profile. Because I striped it down and placed a Trijicon Tenmile 4-24x50 on it (lighter optic than the Polar), the weight is so close that I can hardly tell the difference. The pic above shows the Trijicon Credo, but I swapped it out for the Tenmile.

Thread 'TIKKA CTR on a diet'

Aug 25, 2023

So, my CTR shoots like a dream and it's packable but still on the heavy side so it went on a diet.
I took the pic rail off along with the bottom metal and the CTR magazine.
I replaced the bottom with factory T3 plastic guard. Bought from JA Outdoors. Bought a couple 223 mags from EuroOptic and in order for all this to work, you need to install the metal magazine retention spring which the CTR does not have. Bought one from mountain tactical.
Trimmed over a pound and with a salmon river solutions arca rail, a trijicon tenmile scope, she is at 9 pounds, 1 ounce.
And it still shoots like...

• mtnwrunner
• Replies: 48
• Forum: Firearms

• 

S

Post in thread 'T3 Lite vs T3x CTR weight difference'

Oct 6, 2023

Swap the CTR bottom/mag with a stock T3/T3x setup, remove the factory 0moa rail and use direct mount rings. Shaves a bunch of weight from the CTR and makes it more carry friendly.

20" CTR as shown is exactly 9lbs scoped.



Discussed here:

TIKKA CTR on a diet

So, my CTR shoots like a dream and it's packable but still on the heavy side so it went on a diet. I took the pic rail off along with the bottom metal and the CTR magazine. I replaced the bottom with factory T3 plastic guard. Bought from JA Outdoors. Bought a couple 223 mags from EuroOptic and...

rokslide.com

• SouthPaw

• 

All I had was a small postage gram scale so I had to take the guns apart to weigh each piece, then convert to lbs, but you get the idea.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

That's a good point. My only experience has been a Vortex Diamondback 2 on my 22.

I'll do a deep dive into scopes now

There are other good brands, but SWFA and Trijicon are the only scopes I intend to purchase (except for a RokScope when it comes out).


____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Awesome. Do you know roughly how much your total setup weighs roughly?

My Tikka 6.5 CM weighs eight pounds without the bipod and suppressor. The bipod is another pound (one reason I took it off) and the OG suppressor is 12 ounces (with its cover). I was a bit shocked to learn that adding a beautiful leather sling is almost another pound. I like a relatively heavy rifle. Nine to eleven pounds is about right for a long action rifle in my opinion.

____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”

 

[Jhconnected]

There is a long history of robust scope testing on this site from a guy named Form. This testing may be outside of your requirements.

Depending on your price range the Mavens are good, the Nightforce NX8 line may be the gold standard and the Revic Acura RS25i has been highly reviewed including durability by other sites.

SWFA gets a lot of love on here.

 

[mtnbound]

Good morning, all,

My experience has been largely limited to handguns and I'm looking to get into rifles so I can hopefully get into hunting. My job finally allows me time to pursue my hobbies.

I currently have a 22LR that I target shoot with. Do you all have advice on whether I should:

a. Buy a nice bolt action (Seekins, Alamo Precision Rifle, etc) so I can buy once cry once
Or
b. Start with a Tikka/Weatherby then upgrade later

I understand that I should spend more on the glass and have a separate budget of up to 1200ish for the scope. Also, Im trying not to accumulate a large armory of bolt actions, so wanted to be sure before purchasing.

Caliber will likely be .308 although I'm also considering 6.5 Creedmore. I ultimately want to hunt in AK once I get enough experience...one day.

Thanks

Tikka is a great affordable and reliable platform that has a lot of aftermarket support. You cannot go wrong with Tikka. For caliber I would recommend 6.5PRC cut the factory barrel down and thread it. Go buy factory Hornady ammo and a Maven or SWFA scope and a Rokstock and you have a great do it all system.

 

[OctoberRain]

Hey guys, I never expected all the detailed replies. Thanks I'll slowly look through all the information and start a shopping list. This is awesome