Fire

[Pony Soldier]

Lightning started a fire north of me. I rode in yesterday cutting out the winter downfall on one of my trails. The fire was at 11 acres.

Met one of the FS voyeurs watching the fire burn. Nice guy but upper management said to let it burn so they were documenting the growth.

A cold front is coming through with 40 mph gusts. It's now at 80 acres and has spread to the next drainage. The FS reported 22 people on the fire. I only observed 2.

They did this a couple years ago and observed a fire for a couple months then it took off and burned 26,000 acres and almost got the county seat.

We are paying these idiots to "observe" fires. I don't see any improvement. I've seen a couple spots burn 3 times in 5 years. They don't plant trees, maintain trails and rarely even grade their roads. I think it is time to flush the toilet and start over. There isn't anything left to save at the Forest Service.

 

[Geewhiz]

I couldn't agree more

Either let it burn or put it out but don't pay a crew of 165 guys and 3 dozers to sit on stand by while eating catered prime rib every night on the taxpayers dime.

 

[Customweld]

Man, don't even get me going! Watched the Lava fire here in SW Idaho blow up 40k acres in one day. They were "monitoring" it for 5 days . There were 3 different logging contractors within 15 miles of it. Sawyers, Water trucks, dozers and feller bunchers were all right there and no call to them for help.

 

[IDVortex]

Well. I bet the FS gets decent amount of money to fight fires. So instead of doing managed burns or thinning. It's better to allow everything burn due to more money. Because, at the end of the day. Green is only thing that matters.

I don't understand how some of the primary FS gravel roads aren't graded and sprayed with magnesium chloride to help lock the road surface together and for dust control.

 

[AZ8]

Cerro Grande Fire- New Mexico, May 2000--------'Hold my beer!

 

[mt terry d]

Check out the Derby Fire, Montana 2006

Guys were putting it out when the FS threatened to have them arrested and chased them off.

220,000 acres eventually burned. Assholes.

I can't count the number of fires that the FS "monitored" until they were too large to
be put out by man before they threw a ton of men and our $$$$$$$ at them

They even did a "prescribed burn" up Bridger Creek on labor Day weekend a few years ago; the hottest driest time of year and opener of bow season.

Did I mention "assholes"?

Get me a campfire and a beer and I'll express my true feelings on this topic.

 

[Beendare]

Thats the mentality of these jokers....it pisses me off too.

Wait until you get a couple of those bulldozer or water truck guys that charge $2,000/day sitting around with no fires for awhile...and they go out and start one like the guy they caught up above Redding,Ca a few years ago.

 

[.204smokechaser]

Well it’s an interesting time currently. 750 million in the hole and lots of people are being laid off next week. Land of paper weights in the useless offices and nobody to do ground work anymore. Almost everyone I know that’s a temp fire crew person is done next week….

 

[OMF]

You never see this type of information (assuming factual) in the general media. Although I'm not sure it would push the right buttons with most people anyway.

 

[Silveroddo]

Well. I bet the FS gets decent amount of money to fight fires. So instead of doing managed burns or thinning. It's better to allow everything burn due to more money. Because, at the end of the day. Green is only thing that matters.

I don't understand how some of the primary FS gravel roads aren't graded and sprayed with magnesium chloride to help lock the road surface together and for dust control.

I'll give them a pass on chloride because the cost has gotten so out of hand, but their road maintenance program drives me nuts.

 

[Pony Soldier]

The FS did well with a full time ranger and a part time secretary. The didn't even have roads. My Dad and uncle worked summers on lookouts and trail maintenance.

I worked on trails and on lookouts in the 70s as well as district smoke chasers and habitat typeing.

By the 80s, I spent much of my professional life assisting citizens in conflicts with FS management. They have rules that citizens have to follow but they don't and won't.

There are some very good professionals within the agency but they are outnumbered by egos and idiots in upper management.

I would be happy if they went back to planting trees and putting out fires. It's obvious they couldn't manage toilet paper in a diarea ward.

 

[cnelk]

Forest Circus

 

[JFK]

Eh…the guys on the ground doing work are good, hardworking and horribly underpaid. The higher ups…not so much

 

[JohnB]

Man, this is exactly the time to let it burn. Lower temperatures, higher relative humidity & shorter days all work together to reduce the burn intensity. Or just put it out and watch it burn 5 years down the line.

 

[Beendare]

Eh…the guys on the ground doing work are good, hardworking and horribly underpaid. The higher ups…not so much

Nailed it....

 

[Axlrod]

It's been burning for 5 days, and is at 81 acres. It "grew" one acre in the last 24 hours. The fire will clean up the beatle killed timber, most of which is blown over. Everybody thinks they are an expert, in things they have zero knowledge in. It's the end of the fire season, we have had plenty of rain lately, and fire CAN be really good.

 

[Pony Soldier]

The 1910 fire in northwest mt sterilized the ground for 100 years. The FS napalm sterilized the ground at the fire near my house it won't grow another tree till long after I am gone by at least 50 years. Trying to clean up beattle kill with fire is a gamble I 'm not willing to play.

 

[NCTrees]

Failed policies, failed agency. Sure, a lot of good hard working folks at the FS, who make differences here and there, it’s not enough. In a lot of ways I think we’d be better off if they curtailed the whole agency. With their let burn/ back burn policy I’m confident we’d be better off them just staying off fires. Let rain do the job, eventually. At least they won’t double or triple the fire size with a failed back burn. Pony Soldier, keep your fingers crossed they don’t “big box” your back yard into tens of thousands of more acres burned to a crisp. And no, “managed” fire during fire season is not a good idea. It’ll likely fail. It won’t be salvaged, it won’t be replanted, it’ll be a snag patch that’ll burn again eventually sterilizing the soil making it really only capable of growing brush. It’s disgusting.

 

[IDVortex]

The 1910 fire in northwest mt sterilized the ground for 100 years. The FS napalm sterilized the ground at the fire near my house it won't grow another tree till long after I am gone by at least 50 years. Trying to clean up beattle kill with fire is a gamble I 'm not willing to play.

I think goverment agency and people in general forget about major fires like the 1910, or evening the Tillamook fire in OR. Just how damaging those are. If we allowed smaller fires, that's one thing. But we also can't allow a fire to get so big it turns into a mega fire, they're more devastating due to the heat, and the chemicals put on them to try to take them out.

 

[TaperPin]

Everyone bitched about Yellowstone burning, now it’s not even brought up since the regrowth looks like a forest. Fire is going to burn - 100 years of putting out too many fires has taught us to let a lot of fires burn when possible, or large fires are the natural result.

In the towns I’ve lived in the FS does a great job and the career employees could easily make more money doing something else. What pisses me off the most is how budgets have been cut so trails aren’t maintained and roads look like hell. The ones bitching the most are the ones wanting budgets cut every year - you can’t have everything for nothing - no rocket science.

I’ll be glad when this political bs fades and we start managing natural resources instead of crying about mismanagement and cutting budgets so nothing can be done. The explosion of private fire fighters is a direct result of cutting fire budgets for government firefighters - and yes it costs twice as much. Makes no sense to anyone who actually has experience with firefighting budgets, and the politics of cutting budgets in idiotic ways and forcing the use of private crews has screwed us.