Don’t need no rear bag - S2H University

Randonee

Lil-Rokslider
Shoot2HuntU
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
149
Location
WA
I thought I pass this along. It pains me to ponder the amount of time I’ve spent researching and money spent buying rear bags. And then figuring out how to carry and deploy them in the field. Last week at the Shoot2hunt University I was shown that was basically a complete waste of time! I’m now firmly in the bino harness camp, and if that isn’t available I’ll use a stick, stone, bone, candy bar, shoe insole, hat, or whatever happens to be handy. I’ll even use my pocket knife if that’s all I have, and not really worry about it except for obviously being level 10 careful with it.

@Formidilosus demoed using the following and shot a group with each:
Wind checker, hammer, hiking poles, empty red bull can, ammo box, chair, water bottle, mag, sit pad, and I think a few others I’m missing. See his 1.5” target.

We (the students) then used the same or various other options rather than rear bags, and I didn’t see a change in group size over repeated and repeated and repeated…groups. I’ll likely keep a rear bag in my range kit just for convenience, but I can’t see myself carrying one in the field going forward.
 

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Nice! I love hearing about all the practical tips out of S2H. It’s like a back to the basics course focused on what is actually needed to shoot.

I will still carry an ultralight bag because of its use with a tripod and kneeling on it. I rarely shoot prone, and the last thing I want to grab in the desert where I while I am laying down prone is a rock or stick and turn over a scorpion…
 
I would love to see or have someone better explain how to use your Bino harness as a rear bag.


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Picture tilting it up and down under the stock with your hand/fist under the front of it or grabbing the stock and harness and pulling both towards the rear.

That’s how I have done it. If you are brave, lol you can get the stock between the barrels of the binos.
 
Offhand fist? I practice a lot with that.

Will use binoculars harness if time allows. Setup with a nice shaped rock last year while waiting for a moose to browse his way into my shooting lane.
 
Yeah, that was an eye-opening demo. For me, coming in with no experience, it was really valuable to see the different options. One thing that I really valued about @Formidilosus, was his (and the other instructors') focus on the principle behind the actions being taken. In understanding the foundational principle, we're better able to adapt in the moment when faced with whatever circumstances we might be facing.
 
My wife's very first ever shot on a game animal was at 300 yards using a 300PRC using a bipod and her bino harness as a rear rest. She had only practiced shooting a few times prior to the hunt, but I had luckily shown her that trick the day before she had to make the shot. She smoked that 178" mule deer.

Practice how you play. If you aren't going to carry a separate shooting bag, use whatever you've got to practice. My favorite shooting bag options are either my game bags stuffed into a smaller bag or my puffer jacket that stuffs into its own pocket.
 
Nice! I love hearing about all the practical tips out of S2H. It’s like a back to the basics course focused on what is actually needed to shoot.

I will still carry an ultralight bag because of its use with a tripod and kneeling on it. I rarely shoot prone, and the last thing I want to grab in the desert where I while I am laying down prone is a rock or stick and turn over a scorpion…
I agree with this. It might be possible to use all this other stuff but an ultralight bag that sits at the top outside of my pack attached through the buckle for deployment in a second that I practice with every time I shoot beats any makeshift solution. I know how the bag fits in my hand and I know exactly how tall it is when held in different directions.

IMHO, working with all of these other things sounds like a waste of time when bags that weigh a couple of ounces are available, cheap, and you know exactly where they sit on the outside of your pack but I guess there's novelty in it.
 
I agree with this. It might be possible to use all this other stuff but an ultralight bag that sits at the top outside of my pack attached through the buckle for deployment in a second that I practice with every time I shoot beats any makeshift solution. I know how the bag fits in my hand and I know exactly how tall it is when held in different directions.

IMHO, working with all of these other things sounds like a waste of time when bags that weigh a couple of ounces are available, cheap, and you know exactly where they sit on the outside of your pack but I guess there's novelty in it.
I love me a low filled bag and use them just about every day.

In saying that, you’re adding an extra step to the shot process by not using your bino harness as your rear rest.

It’s already on you and in the perfect position to lay down and use to fill the void between off hand and the ground. A lightweight rear bag is slower when timed versus using the bino harness. Ask me how I know haha, I fought it for months.
 
I love me a low filled bag and use them just about every day.

In saying that, you’re adding an extra step to the shot process by not using your bino harness as your rear rest.

It’s already on you and in the perfect position to lay down and use to fill the void between off hand and the ground. A lightweight rear bag is slower when timed versus using the bino harness. Ask me how I know haha, I fought it for months.
Maybe by a second or two. Which is meaningless. And it's certainly not as consistent. What about shots where you never remove the harness? Tripod? From atop a pile of rocks or a boulder sitting leaning forward?

Do I remove my binos from the harness in case I need them? Shoot with them in? More inconsistency. Nahhh. I'll use the bag I can grab in literally a second or two every single time. I'm not racing to be the first to shoot.

I also have ZERO desire to shoot off of my Swaros.
 
I agree with this. It might be possible to use all this other stuff but an ultralight bag that sits at the top outside of my pack attached through the buckle for deployment in a second that I practice with every time I shoot beats any makeshift solution. I know how the bag fits in my hand and I know exactly how tall it is when held in different directions.

IMHO, working with all of these other things sounds like a waste of time when bags that weigh a couple of ounces are available, cheap, and you know exactly where they sit on the outside of your pack but I guess there's novelty in it.

Yep, I've used my pack and bino harness, I'll keep using the rear bag. Zero downsides to it so far. As for time, it takes more time to fug around with my harness than it ever has to use the bag.
 
Yep, I've used my pack and bino harness, I'll keep using the rear bag. Zero downsides to it so far. As for time, it takes more time to fug around with my harness than it ever has to use the bag.
Exactly. I just don't get this push to rush to take shots from prone positions. That's how mistakes happen and animals get wounded. If you can't get a quality shot off in the time you have available, oh well.
 
Offhand fist? I practice a lot with that.

Will use binoculars harness if time allows. Setup with a nice shaped rock last year while waiting for a moose to browse his way into my shooting lane.
Honestly, use my fist as much as a bag, even on the bench. I don't rifle hunt a bunch, but there is always something laying around to use as a rear support.
 
I agree with this. It might be possible to use all this other stuff but an ultralight bag that sits at the top outside of my pack attached through the buckle for deployment in a second that I practice with every time I shoot beats any makeshift solution. I know how the bag fits in my hand and I know exactly how tall it is when held in different directions.

IMHO, working with all of these other things sounds like a waste of time when bags that weigh a couple of ounces are available, cheap, and you know exactly where they sit on the outside of your pack but I guess there's novelty in it.
Not sure about novelty...more being prepared if things aren't exactly right. I've seen people forget stuff too many times to rely on 1 specific piece of equipment to be there when it is needed. I've had clients forget/lose shooting sticks or bi-pods and fiddle F around trying to get steady when there was a tree, fence post, rock etc 2ft away.

Say a guy carries a light weight rear bag, buckle breaks or he forgets to reattach it after setting up for a shot opportunity that doesn't work out...never shot or practiced any other way...big buck steps out and he can't find his rear bag. Should he dig through his whole pack, walk back to the previous spot to try and find it or maybe a light bulb goes off and says "I know what I can use my binos/bino harness. Or my range finger...or medical kit."
 
I agree with this. It might be possible to use all this other stuff but an ultralight bag that sits at the top outside of my pack attached through the buckle for deployment in a second that I practice with every time I shoot beats any makeshift solution. I know how the bag fits in my hand and I know exactly how tall it is when held in different directions.

IMHO, working with all of these other things sounds like a waste of time when bags that weigh a couple of ounces are available, cheap, and you know exactly where they sit on the outside of your pack but I guess there's novelty in it.


The point wasn’t that rear bags shouldn’t be used. The point is that it really doesn’t make that much of a difference, and people shouldn’t be emotionally and mentally tied to a certain bag.

Also, lots of people think they can do lots of things, right up until they are asked to do it “right now” on demand. All of a sudden those “only a second or two” turns into 3 minutes to get a shot off.
 
Not sure about novelty...more being prepared if things aren't exactly right. I've seen people forget stuff too many times to rely on 1 specific piece of equipment to be there when it is needed. I've had clients forget/lose shooting sticks or bi-pods and fiddle F around trying to get steady when there was a tree, fence post, rock etc 2ft away.

Say a guy carries a light weight rear bag, buckle breaks or he forgets to reattach it after setting up for a shot opportunity that doesn't work out...never shot or practiced any other way...big buck steps out and he can't find his rear bag. Should he dig through his whole pack, walk back to the previous spot to try and find it or maybe a light bulb goes off and says "I know what I can use my binos/bino harness. Or my range finger...or medical kit."

Exactly.
 
Nice! I love hearing about all the practical tips out of S2H. It’s like a back to the basics course focused on what is actually needed to shoot.

I will still carry an ultralight bag because of its use with a tripod and kneeling on it. I rarely shoot prone, and the last thing I want to grab in the desert where I while I am laying down prone is a rock or stick and turn over a scorpion…
I think utilizing the S2H method, if you turn over a scorpion, you just use it as your rear bag :LOL:
 
Different strokes for different folks…

Ultimately, if I just gotta make the shot that fast, I know how to use anything and will use my bino harness. I don’t know I would ever plan on using a rock. I am OK with that if those seconds make the difference. In the end, use anything to help fill the gap and build stability.

I still won’t leave my bag behind. It’s 1.5 ounces that gets used for more than shooting. Also, my hunting style allows it.

Same with shooting from a tripod. It is seconds faster to shoot off a backpack, and I can. But if it’s more than seconds a tripod is much more steady for me. Some guys don’t use a tripod.

It makes no practical difference at short-intermediate range whether binos or bag, or pack or tripod. So it makes sense that bino support wins when speed is factored in and the bag is on the pack.

Although, if I personally loaded out for speed, I would find a way to keep my Mini Ultralight bag quick draw out of a stock sleeve or something.

That would be less mental load and faster than looking for and grabbing rock. With my luck it would be the tip of a boulder poking up or hidden cactus spine. That happens far too often to get that picture out of my head.

This thread has now got my brain designing a quick draw pouch for my mini bag. You can pry my shooting bags and rifle from my cold dead hands…

I am gonna keep resisting!
 
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