Dog passed out

[Scrappy]

This brings back terrible memories. Mine happened to Wyatt, fox red lab, best partner I ever had. He was 7 y/o and started to struggle during runs, then one day he wouldn't/couldn't get up. Other days he'd be fine. Long story short, he had a huge growth on one of his heart valves. I didn't want him to suffer, but they told me that he'd just tip over when the time came. He did, it was terrible.

It wasn't diagnoseable without a K9 cardiac specialist. One came through our town every week, she found it with xray or ultrasound or something. No cure unless (at the time, 10 years ago) you send them to Colo State Vet lab for $15,000 surgery and no guarantees.

Very sorry and hope you find out what's wrong, there are all kinds of causes.

Sorry to hear about your pup named Wyatt. I thought I was the only guy that named his pup Wyatt. My Wyatt died a couple years ago with cancer.

 

[MuleyFever]

My first thoughts when you mentioned the hacking, is heart issue.

Yeah, thats why I thought he for sure died the first time. After seeing it again though its like he has something in his throat and not a cough.

 

[spike camp]

Yeah, thats why I thought he for sure died the first time. After seeing it again though its like he has something in his throat and not a cough.

Definitely not saying it’s a heart issue, but my vizsla always hacked.
Then it got worse as he aged.
He died in my arms 2 years ago of heart failure, and hacked right before he died.

Hope all works out well with your pups health.
They sure are special.

 

[MuleyFever]

Said all that to ask is your pup having these episodes right after his meal?

We try not to exercise him after meals but I do feed him one cup when I get home to appease him and he gets the rest later. We feed once in the AM and twice in the PM.

 

[MuleyFever]

My dog is trained and old enough where I can give him freedom of the house while we’re out during the day. But sometimes I do need to crate him for a couple hours for whatever reason (he also crates at night). You may already do this but I highly recommend you have some type of water bow/dispenser in the crate. I have a small bowl that clips to the door and holds a little less than a cup of water. Sometimes it’s untouched when I let him out. Sometimes it’s been licked dry. Just my $0.02. Hope he feels better.

He doesnt sit in his crate for more than 4 hours at a time. Its usually 4 hours in the morning and 3 hours after lunch. I am going to look into a bowl for the crate though. I think its a good idea. Thanks.

 

[russellfees]

Yes we are feeding him Taste of the Wild and have considered changing him to PPP. My mom, who has worked in the vet and pet industry for ever, told me about the possibility of grain free foods causing issues from the high proportion of peas/lentils etc. I thought we were good because the first 2 ingredients are meat based but after reading more on it just now from your suggestion I see the FDA listed it as high amounts if in the first 10 ingredients so I definitely need to consider changing foods.

Edit: Just got done reading the FDA report. Taste of the wild was the 3rd most reported food in dogs with DCM in the study.

FDA Investigates Potential Link Between Diet & Heart Disease in Dogs

Latest update on the FDA’s investigation into reports of dilated cardiomyopathy (DCM) in dogs eating certain pet foods.

www.fda.gov

So the grain substitutes block the absorption of taurine which is an essential amino acid for proper heart function. There are a lot of examples of dogs whose hearts went back to normal size and function - or at least close to it - after putting them on diet with corn in it. FYI, my dogs do BETTER on food containing corn. The leading big brands grind it fine enough in their premium lines, that it CAN be easily digested and the dogs get the nutrients from it. Brands like purina have the research to prove their feeds. Have your dog tested for dcm. May not be it, but if it is your vet might suggest taurine supplements for a short while as well as exercise restrictions. And then in a year get another scan - you might be surprised to find the heart has returned to normal. Maybe not. But maybe so. Best of luck. Hope it’s nothing major!!

 

[mooretitan]

My last GSP had a similar issue. Scared the crap out of me the 1st couple times. He was a muscular dog and ran hard. No off switch. Would piss blood but never would slow down. Fell over a couple times and his whole buddy would lock up. Had to carry him back to truck a few times Chukar hunting. Talked to my grandpa about it and he suggested carry honey packets and rub into his gums during hunting. Seemed to help a lot. He had to be conditioned really well and carefully at the start of the season because of the heat
Sorry it sucks

 

[Dos Perros]

Feed once a day at sundown. Might try giving some Nutrical during exercise.

 

[ROJO23]

a friend of mine breeds pointers for running deer. One of his does it every time they hunt. vet said probably low blood sugar so he keeps a candy bar with him and just give it to the dog. it fixes him in second.
first time I saw it a few of us was riding in the back of the truck with the dogs and a couple of deer. He feel over, and I started looking him over, and I figured someone shot him. he had blood on him, but it was from the deer. My buddy gave him the candy bar, and he was back in action.

all of his dogs are built like shorter gray hounds, very thin

we had a rottweiler that died from an aorta issue. she coughed some, but panted all the time. Our current Rottweiler also pants a lot, we had a cardiac vet do an ultra sound on her aorta and heart and it was perfect.

 

[txhunter581]

First let me say that I am a veterinarian.

Doesn’t sound like EIC and have never heard of it in Weimaraners

Exercise-Induced Collapse (EIC) | Veterinary Genetics Laboratory

Exercise-induced collapse is a genetic neuromuscular disorder characterized by muscle weakness, lack of coordination, and life-threatening collapse after intense exercise in otherwise apparently healthy dogs.

vgl.ucdavis.edu

It does sound a lot like epilepsy. Epileptic seizures are very common in dogs and generally starts between 6 months and 3 years of age. That is probably the best thing it could be. If they continue or get more frequent, usually meds can stop them. I generally don’t put on meds if they have them infrequently. Cause meds are 1-2 times daily for the rest of their life. If they have 3-4 a year, I don’t see a problem with letting them have them. Very rare for an epileptic seizure to cause death. The hacking can just be one of the quirks of your dogs seizures.

Can’t rule out DCM but I think there would be other symptoms. If he has That kind of heart failure, he would generally hack/cough at times otherwise than just when he was having an episode.

I have never liked grain free diets even before they were shown to sometimes cause DCM. Unless a dog is allergic to a specific grain, WHICH IS RARE, they prob shouldn’t be on a grain free diet.

The only good test for DCM is an echocardiogram (ultrasound of the heart). Easy and noninvasive but unfortunately expensive. Ballpark $400-500. Xrays and ECGs can narrow it down but echo l is the best test.

Best to visit with your vet about these concerns and come up with a plan to diagnose his condition. Unfortunately there is no “test” for epilepsy. But very few things incapacitate a dog and theN 15 min later he is up as if nothing happened. So I think most likely he has epilepsy. But my diagnosis without seeing him is worth what you paid for it

 

[MuleyFever]

First let me say that I am a veterinarian.

Doesn’t sound like EIC and have never heard of it in Weimaraners

Exercise-Induced Collapse (EIC) | Veterinary Genetics Laboratory

Exercise-induced collapse is a genetic neuromuscular disorder characterized by muscle weakness, lack of coordination, and life-threatening collapse after intense exercise in otherwise apparently healthy dogs.

vgl.ucdavis.edu

It does sound a lot like epilepsy. Epileptic seizures are very common in dogs and generally starts between 6 months and 3 years of age. That is probably the best thing it could be. If they continue or get more frequent, usually meds can stop them. I generally don’t put on meds if they have them infrequently. Cause meds are 1-2 times daily for the rest of their life. If they have 3-4 a year, I don’t see a problem with letting them have them. Very rare for an epileptic seizure to cause death. The hacking can just be one of the quirks of your dogs seizures.

Can’t rule out DCM but I think there would be other symptoms. If he has That kind of heart failure, he would generally hack/cough at times otherwise than just when he was having an episode.

I have never liked grain free diets even before they were shown to sometimes cause DCM. Unless a dog is allergic to a specific grain, WHICH IS RARE, they prob shouldn’t be on a grain free diet.

The only good test for DCM is an echocardiogram (ultrasound of the heart). Easy and noninvasive but unfortunately expensive. Ballpark $400-500. Xrays and ECGs can narrow it down but echo l is the best test.

Best to visit with your vet about these concerns and come up with a plan to diagnose his condition. Unfortunately there is no “test” for epilepsy. But very few things incapacitate a dog and theN 15 min later he is up as if nothing happened. So I think most likely he has epilepsy. But my diagnosis without seeing him is worth what you paid for it

He otherwise appears healthy and these episodes last 1-2 min at most and he is completely out of it. Wouldn't know it happened if you turned your back for 2 min and didn't see it. So far it's been 2 times, the first was late Jan. The second was just a few days ago. So not frequent, yet.

 

[swampthing]

We had a lab that passed out a couple times when he got excited. Turned out to be an enlarged heart. Hopefully your dog hasnt got this.

 

[txhunter581]

He otherwise appears healthy and these episodes last 1-2 min at most and he is completely out of it. Wouldn't know it happened if you turned your back for 2 min and didn't see it. So far it's been 2 times, the first was late Jan. The second was just a few days ago. So not frequent, yet.

Most likely epilepsy. If a heart issue he wouldn’t have just 2 episodes in 6 months. But it also could have happened when you weren’t with him

But I do recommend changing his diet.

 

[Pontius]

Just some data points on the dehydration hypothesis. Covid has allowed a thorough study of our Weimaraner's habits, unconstrained by circumstance. Water is available to her 24/7. She gets 2-7 miles of exercise most mornings. She drinks when she gets home, and a few more sips with breakfast. Then she lays on the couch totally inert without drinking or hardly showing signs of life until dinner, when she drinks once more. When the bedtime call comes she'll get a drink on the way, perhaps half the time. Though it feels like she ought to drink more water, her urine is a reasonably light hue, her endurance is nominal. This might be helpful to know where normal is.

 

[MuleyFever]

We had a lab that passed out a couple times when he got excited. Turned out to be an enlarged heart. Hopefully your dog hasnt got this.

How was the dog long term? Did they die early?

 

[swampthing]

How was the dog long term? Did they die early?

Unfortunately he died shortly after the diagnosis.

 

[Trial153]

In twenty years of running and breeding hounds, and judging a couple hundred licencesd trials i have seen plenty of episodes similar to what you described. From my experiences I would lean towards varying degrees of eplisy. You will see seizures ranging from very mild petit mal that may present no worse than a few minutes of fear and confusion all the way up to full Tonic-clonic seizures with spasms and rigor followed by a period of being postictal.

 

[ebonnette0118]

You guys have me worried about the grain free diet.

I have a little Brussels Griffon that has had major problems with seizures. He is a great blood tracker. He has to take phenobarbital every day or it is guaranteed he will have a seizure.

He was going through spurts where he would have seizures even after I started him on the meds. I switched him to grain-free (Taste of the Wild) and, paired with the meds, he rarely has a seizure now.

His seizures were intense. They only occurred while he was sleeping. It would start with intense biting, then foaming at the mouth, then loss of bodily functions and severe leg kicking. Then he would get on his feet and just take off running and run into anything in his path. Temporary blindness I think. Then for a minute or so he would bark at me like I was a total stranger. The episodes lasted anywhere from 2 minutes to 4 or 5 minutes. Scary to see. I'm glad we have them under control now.

But still worried about the grain-free diet and DCM.

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[dr.mooseknuckles]

My Rule Out list as follows:
1.) Epilepsy
2.) Dilated Cardiomyopathy (DCM)
3.) Open???? But probably epilepsy.

The Grain Free DCM is most often seen in non-large breed dogs that are NOT genetically pre-disposed to DCM congenitally. It's been linked to a deficiency in Taurine. While the reports of the FDA are primarily in the non-congenital breeds, (think the Brussels Griffon in the post above) I would not have my large breed dog on the diet due to the possibility of it occurring.

I am a vet also.

 

[ebonnette0118]

My Rule Out list as follows:
1.) Epilepsy
2.) Dilated Cardiomyopathy (DCM)
3.) Open???? But probably epilepsy.

The Grain Free DCM is most often seen in non-large breed dogs that are NOT genetically pre-disposed to DCM congenitally. It's been linked to a deficiency in Taurine. While the reports of the FDA are primarily in the non-congenital breeds, (think the Brussels Griffon in the post above) I would not have my large breed dog on the diet due to the possibility of it occurring.

I am a vet also.

dr.moosenuckles...would you recommend my Brussels not have a grain-free diet?

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