Copper Ammo Recomendations

[Weber]

I've shot barnes for many years now, without much problem, other than none of my rifles particularly like them. Every now and then I'll grab a random box of some other copper and shoot it. Recently I tried the Hornady CX in 223 and it shot wayyy better out of one of my AR's (went from 1.5 MOA to sub MOA) and it got me thinking.

Generally speaking, I do often hunt at the edge ranges of the minimum opening velocity (MOV) for these rounds (the one downside to copper that I care about). One thing about barnes is I know these minimum velocities well for all my different calibers (.458 SOCOM, 300 Blackout, 223, 30-06, 308, etc). I also have taken 20ish animals with them without issue. The only time I've had a round perform badly was when I shot a bear with Hornady ELD-X and a Caribou with Core Lokt (nothing against these rounds, very small anecdotal sample size).

I'm looking at buying a box of all the different copper projectiles I can find in factory loads (I don't reload) and testing for accuracy but its much harder to test the efficacy. Looking for any experiences with rounds other than Barnes from people.

Some ones I've been looking at:

• Hornady CX - Their superformance line shoots very accurate from my 223 with a 30-50 fps boost over my barnes bullets. They have a slightly higher MOV
• Lehigh Defense Controlled Chaos - Supposed to be a 1500 fps MOV which is amazing, but tends to shoot much slower out of my 223 with limited testing I've done. Photos of these rounds appear impressive out of gel but I'm concerned with animal performance.
• Nosler E-Tips
• Federal Trophy Copper

If y'all have any real world experience with these, especially at longer ranges/lower than 2000fps velocity please let me know. My primary concern is the 308/223 since both can have anemic velocities out to 500/300 respectively.

 

[Ringbill27]

It my rifles the CX hasn’t shot well. But I have let testing them after cleaning the barrel back to bare metal.

I use Barnes for everything. Have to cleaned your barrel well?

 

[Weber]

It my rifles the CX hasn’t shot well. But I have let testing them after cleaning the barrel back to bare metal.

I use Barnes for everything. Have to cleaned your barrel well?

I did, shooting supressed I noticed I do have to clean them more often than I used to keep them shooting well. Some of my guns like the Barnes just fine but most I can get cheap fmj's to shoot better.

 

[WI-Carcosa]

Hornady CX has shot well in both 30:06 and 300wsm for me. When they made it, trophy copper in 300wsm also shot well for me. Both performed well on game but at close ranges.

For minimum velocities I would recommend checking out DRT as the all copper factory loads will likely be underwhelming at best below 2000fps. Non lead and frangible ammo with factory offerings in 30:06, 308, and 223. http://drtammo.com/

 

[Xbow hunter]

Try Beck Ammunition loaded with the Maker T-Rex. I have had great success with it. They also make a subsonic load with similar bullet made to expand at lower velocity if you are shooting a 308.

 

[Weber]

Hornady CX has shot well in both 30:06 and 300wsm for me. When they made it, trophy copper in 300wsm also shot well for me. Both performed well on game but at close ranges.

For minimum velocities I would recommend checking out DRT as the all copper factory loads will likely be underwhelming at best below 2000fps. Non lead and frangible ammo with factory offerings in 30:06, 308, and 223. http://drtammo.com/

Heard back from DRT. Might give it a shot, 1600-1800 is what he's saying for 223 as a minimum. But recommends a 79gr round which ain't going to move that fast to begin with. Not sure how sold I am on the powdered copper concept, sounds like a good way to end up with copper fragments peppering everything but haven't been able to do enough research yet. Thank you!

 

[mighteywhitehunter]

I have killed quite a few critters with copper using E-Tips, Barnes LRX and TTSX, Hammer Bullets and Hornady CX/GMX. I am forced to shoot them in CA but have had success all over the West with them. It makes it a little harder since you don't reload, for Factory ammo I would stay light weight for caliber and make sure your barrel has enough twist to stabilize them. For factory ammo I would use the Barnes or Hornady stuff, it has shot well in several of my rifles.

E-Tips in my opinion are too hard, they do not do as much damage compared to the other copper bullets I mentioned.

 

[z987k]

Heard back from DRT. Might give it a shot, 1600-1800 is what he's saying for 223 as a minimum. But recommends a 79gr round which ain't going to move that fast to begin with. Not sure how sold I am on the powdered copper concept, sounds like a good way to end up with copper fragments peppering everything but haven't been able to do enough research yet. Thank you!

I wouldn't buy drt factory loaded rounds. Very very slow and piss poor consistency. Couple of guys have reported squib.

I shoot drt bullets so I do like them. In tungsten not copper. But wouldn't trust them on loaded ammo.

 

[Thegman]

E-Tips in my opinion are too hard, they do not do as much damage compared to the other copper bullets I mentioned.

Although they've always worked well enough, I think I've noticed that as well, for whatever reason. Not a huge difference IME, but seems to be some anyway.

E-Tips might be okay if they happen to shoot in your rifle, but I bought a bunch of them and they've been the hardest of the monos for me to get to shoot consistently, through multiple rifles. My Tikka 30-06 at least remedied that problem with the first E-Tip load I ran through it, so I've ended up using a lot of them through that rifle.

I've taken deer, black bear, caribou, moose, grizzlies, Kudu, and other African stuff with them and they've always killed well enough. Expansion seems to have been better than the GMX (the newer CX might expand more?), but I don't think as good as the 150TTSX. I've caught quite a few of them. They'll work well enough if they shoot, but all around, I think they're a ways down the mono list in general.

If Barnes don't shoot well in your rifle, I think the Maker would be a good option to try.

Recovered E-Tips on the left, my two recovered GMXs on the right. For some reason I can't find a recovered Barnes, but I know I recovered one once after going through 4+ feet of moose.

 

[MJB]

Reload and you'll get better results.
They need to be loaded hot and back off the lands to get a better grouping

 

[Thegman]

Reload and you'll get better results.
They need to be loaded hot and back off the lands to get a better grouping

Not sure if this is in reference to the E-Tips, but all of mine were reloaded. I literally have pages of data from multiple rifles trying to find something that shot half as well as my Barnes and GMX loads. I bought a crapload of seconds thinking they would be a great deal (and a couple boxes of factory firsts). Turned out to be not such a great deal.

Fortunately the Tikka happened to like them and it's load data consists of a single load...

 

[DagOtto]

Hi,

I’ve shot all of the mono metal bullets listed through various rifles and various animals. My sample sizes however are not huge.

CX, TC, TTSX, and E-tip are all similar solid copper or copper alloy mono metal bullets. As a matter of fact- Nosler makes Trophy Coppers for Federal so it appears they are very slightly different E-tips.

I’ve found different rifles to prefer different of these “standard” mono metals. So it’s been a matter of buying a box of each and shooting 2 10-shot groups each and picking the winner.

Performance on animals has been consistent with all of these. Meaning smaller than normal lead bullet wound cavities, with deep penetration. They need to hit target at 2000 fps plus/minus to expand reliably. And even then expansion is never extreme. I appreciate the meat savings, but also aim for shoulder bones to incapacitate. And almost always put a second bullet into the animal to speed dying and pin the animal down.

Special Note- watch out for Winchester copper impact. By their own recommendation these bullets won’t open reliably below about 2200 fps.

Recently (after listening multiple times to Forms podcast on exo,) I’ve been shooting test groups with Hammer, Lehigh Defense, DRT and Cutting Edge. My 6.5 CM loves the Lehigh Defense and shoots the best groups of any rifle I’ve ever owned with their non tipped 130 grain controlled chaos. It also seems to love the 135 grain DRTs but I don’t hand load and I was one of the people who received a squib load from the factory.

In two weeks I will be shooting my first few animals with the LD CC in 6.5 and can’t wait to see terminal performance. Hoping for more expansion/ fragmentation as I am dedicated to staying lead free for personal and environmental health. (Knowing it’s a minor deal.) Will send a report.

 

[AmmoTex]

Cutting Edge!
If you look who’s winning all the ELR matches, they’re all shooting CE bullets.
Folks that I know personally that hunt with them have reported amazing results.
I’m using them this year!

 

[hiker270]

Had unimpressive results with several rifles with factory mono bullets. With reloads the story is different. Barnes LRX in both my 300 mag and 7 PRC have done really well with minimal testing. As with most if not all mono bullets the expansion is limited. I hate to waste meat but if I'm using mono bullets its gonna be a front shoulder shot to take the animal down.

 

[Dave0317]

The only time I've had a round perform badly was when I shot a bear with Hornady ELD-X and a Caribou with Core Lokt (nothing against these rounds, very small anecdotal sample size).

How did those perform badly?
Those are a couple of the rounds that usually have a pretty good reputation here, and most places.

 

[Weber]

It my rifles the CX hasn’t shot well. But I have let testing them after cleaning the barrel back to bare metal.

I use Barnes for everything. Have to cleaned your barrel well?

Did some testing on this and figured out my issue.

https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/hornady-cx-experiences.302899/post-3871582

 

[Weber]

In two weeks I will be shooting my first few animals with the LD CC in 6.5 and can’t wait to see terminal performance. Hoping for more expansion/ fragmentation as I am dedicated to staying lead free for personal and environmental health. (Knowing it’s a minor deal.) Will send a report.

How'd it go?

 

[Ringbill27]

Did some testing on this and figured out my issue.

https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/hornady-cx-experiences.302899/post-3871582

Thank you for the info. I’ve tested a couple rifles on a much much smaller scale and got similar results as you.

 

[DagOtto]

How'd it go?

Hey, I've shot one antelope buck and one whitetail with these bullets so far. The Antelope with Controlled Chaos and the Whitetail with the DRT.

Have posted photos and reports of bullet performance here:

Best Mono Bullet for Hunting/Effective Kills

I’m shooting the same velocity as the OP in my 6.5, also a 124 Hammer Hunter. No issues for me with respect to speed.

rokslide.com

 

[SDHNTR]

They all work. Shoot the one that’s most accurate.