Condensation...this floorless shelter experiment may be over

[Hunter Sargent]

Just got back from an elk hunt (buddy got a bull) where 3 of us stayed in a Seek Outside Redcliff. We had major condensation problems at night, to the point where the top of my down bag would be completely saturated by morning. We had the same problem in a Kifaru Sawtooth last year. Any suggestions? Using the stove at night didn't seem to help, and buying $300 worth of liners for an already $700 shelter is stupid.

Thanks.

 

[SneekyPee]

Need to raise at least the leeward side or if the weather isn’t bad raise the entire thing , I run 12” guy lines off of every stake out point , if the weather is bad I just button down the windward side , won’t lose a ton of heat from the stove either since most of the heat comes from the pipe

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[Felix40]

Yeah. Raise it up 5-6" off the ground and it will help. Leaving the doors open a little will help too. I spent a week on prince of wales in constant rain this year in my redcliff without condensation being an issue at all.

 

[big timber]

yeah like they said above, more ventilation.

 

[oldgoat]

I used the liner this year for the first time, it was worth the investment to me! My wife said it was definitely worth packing in too, asked her how she knew that since she didn't pack it in;-) There's not many other investments that hold resale value like high end backcountry gear, I think the stuff is worth it, what other options do you have without live stock to pack in heavier canvas shelters

 

[Kevin Dill]

I just came off a 14 day trip into central Alaska using my Sawtooth. Major condensation on the inside of the tipi shell, BUT the liners completely prevented any of it from wetting my gear. I 100% endorse and always use the liners. Improving ventilation is key but there is NO way I'm going to elevate my shelter there where hungry critters can simply walk in.

I would guess the condensation issue described above had much to do with 3 guys occupying a shelter...and contributing moisture vapor through respiration and perhaps things like evaporation, cooking and maybe damp clothes. It's just a guess. 3 guys will obviously contribute 3x the amount of moisture vapor vs 1 man.

I just bought a Seek Outside 8-Man Tipi and ordered complete liners with it. Having done floorless shelters both ways, I will never go without liners for my ways of camping/hunting.

 

[Stid2677]

I just came off a 14 day trip into central Alaska using my Sawtooth. Major condensation on the inside of the tipi shell, BUT the liners completely prevented any of it from wetting my gear. I 100% endorse and always use the liners. Improving ventilation is key but there is NO way I'm going to elevate my shelter there where hungry critters can simply walk in.

I would guess the condensation issue described above had much to do with 3 guys occupying a shelter...and contributing moisture vapor through respiration and perhaps things like evaporation, cooking and maybe damp clothes. It's just a guess. 3 guys will obviously contribute 3x the amount of moisture vapor vs 1 man.

I agree 100% with Mr Kevin,, the liner stays tied in my Sawtooth for all the above reasons.

 

[Akicita]

Just got back from an elk hunt (buddy got a bull) where 3 of us stayed in a Seek Outside Redcliff. We had major condensation problems at night, to the point where the top of my down bag would be completely saturated by morning. We had the same problem in a Kifaru Sawtooth last year. Any suggestions? Using the stove at night didn't seem to help, and buying $300 worth of liners for an already $700 shelter is stupid.

Thanks.

Regardless of the temperature and during dry weather I zip down both doors of my Redcliff from the top about 12 to 16 inches. I then place a light stick between the zipper halves to create a diamond shaped vent on each side near the top. During prolonged wet weather I run the stove in the morning and evening to dry. I will also tie a door back whenever I am not sheltering or sleeping in cold weather to allow ground condensation to dissipate during no risk of rain or snow. During warm weather months I will sleep with one or both doors open.

You can manage condensation but in most climates you can never eliminate in while sheltering in a tent.

 

[zeroforhire]

Quit breathing so much. Jk. More ventilation has always worked for me


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[LostArra]

. I spent a week on prince of wales in constant rain this year in my redcliff without condensation being an issue at all.

Wow! That is saying something! POW is the wettest place I've ever been!

 

[Felix40]

Wow! That is saying something! POW is the wettest place I've ever been!

Yes it was quite wet. 7 days with two guys and a ton of absolutely saturated gear and we never had a condensation drip. I would post up a pic but I don't know how anymore and Im too lazy to read the how to.

 

[1signguy]

You need a liner- as you learned on the hunt. That's why they offer them.

Rather than complaining about a $700 dollar shelter that requires a $300 liner think of it as a $1000 structure that allows you to take the liner out when weather permits.

A little crazy to think you can put three adults in one of these (on cold nights) and not get a bunch of condensation. Getting ready to head to Colorado and then Idaho (two of us) and the liner is going.

 

[sodaksooner]

We had two in a 6 person tipi. Only had condensation the first night. We did have the bottom raised up about 3" all around. We never did feel the need to set up the stove as the weather was warm. Don't know what we did differently as we normally have some condensation every night. It was pitched in the same spot all 3 nights we used it, so maybe the ground moisture contributed on night 1.

 

[KurtR]

what do you use for a liner in a cimaron

 

[gdog]

I'm new to the floorless deal, but just got a lightweight Borah bivey to use in my Cimarron to hopefully keep most of the condensation off my quilt/bag (in addition to stove).

 

[Daniel_M]

I'm new to the floorless deal, but just got a lightweight Borah bivey to use in my Cimarron to hopefully keep most of the condensation off my quilt/bag (in addition to stove).

x2. Highly recommend a quality bivy when floor less in a moist environment. Just keep in mind it can trap condensation from the body, the footbox of my FF bag tends to dampen but I air it out whenever possible.

 

[AK Troutbum]

A 6 oz., waterproof bottom/breathable top bivy and increasing ventilation has virtually illuminated condensation issues for me, even under some very, very damp conditions. Getting single walled, floorless shelters off the ground is essential.


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[Hunter Sargent]

Thanks everyone for the input. Sounds like I need to vent it better, and may need a liner. I'm wondering if I would be better off using a small double walled tent without a stove. Between the shelter, liners, and stove I will have $1,200 in this thing which seems ridiculous when I have never had condensation issues in my Mountainsmith Mountain Shelter LT that I bought for $80. I've even slept 2 in it which is a lot of respiration for such a small volume...and no condensation.

 

[Backpack Hunter]

^^Were the shelters set up in the same area? Same weather conditions? Same amount of airflow?
Comparing the two shelters based on the outcome without considering the circumstances is not advisable.

 

[Hunter Sargent]

^^Were the shelters set up in the same area? Same weather conditions? Same amount of airflow?
Comparing the two shelters based on the outcome without considering the circumstances is not advisable.

No, but generalities can be applied when condensation occurs 100% of nights of differing conditions in the Redcliff, and 0% of of nights of differing conditions in the Mountainsmith, right?