CO 2018 app changes?

[orionthehunter1]

Vanish your missing the point. I'm not saying I'm for only the rich can hunt cause i'm not. All I was saying is that it is foolish for people to think that this new move by CPW will not affect draw odds or point creep

 

[vanish]

I probably got a bit carried away. Its post like the following that upset me.

X2! This is a major step in the wrong direction! This just hosed all the people (res and non res) that have been putting in for years. Colorado needs to start requiring a license to apply like Arizona, Utah and Idaho. It would reduce point creep and generate more revenue.

Reducing point creep by pricing people out is a terrible long term idea.

Yes, I have points for MSG in CO, so I will be affected. I'd rather young people had hope of drawing a tag.

 

[justinspicher]

I figure I’ll just go to Alaska to hunt moose, by the time I wait ten years to hunt one here at home I can hunt every year in Alaska.

 

[orionthehunter1]

odds are you won't draw in 10 years

 

[ckleeves]

So, people with more money don't want to compete with people with less money. Same old story.

"I've got more money than you, so I should be entitled to better draw odds."

If you think this is a step in the wrong direction, and it should cost more to apply, then you'll price yourself out of hunting eventually. Then with few hunters left, the public will end hunting altogether.

So how much should it cost? Should we make all hunting licenses free? I mean 40.00 for an elk tag isn’t affordable for everyone. Not fair for those guys not to have a chance at an elk.

The biggest problem is the slap in the face for all the guys who have applied religiously for a decade or two. The only thing keeping non-res odds from being off the chart bad (they aren’t good now) was the paper app and fronting the money.

My biggest complaint is that they changed the rules halfway thru the game.


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[Glendon Mullins]

I am by far not an expert on app processes, drawing odds etc and all that as I am just beginning my western planning ect.

But I can tell you this...... as a hunter who doesn't make alot of $$$$, I have been buying points in states that just charge u for the points, for example wyoming and south dakota etc. I avoided colorado due too, the upfront cost, and the fact there are alot of OTC elk opportunities there already. But with this change, I will be buying points in Colorado now. SO I figure, if I am gonna start there are probably thousands of others that will start too. Just my 2 cents

 

[MuleyFever]

This will put me in the MSG draw. I apply in CO every year but not for MSG because I just don't want to front the money.

 

[dotman]

I am by far not an expert on app processes, drawing odds etc and all that as I am just beginning my western planning ect.

But I can tell you this...... as a hunter who doesn't make alot of $$$$, I have been buying points in states that just charge u for the points, for example wyoming and south dakota etc. I avoided colorado due too, the upfront cost, and the fact there are alot of OTC elk opportunities there already. But with this change, I will be buying points in Colorado now. SO I figure, if I am gonna start there are probably thousands of others that will start too. Just my 2 cents

Yes but buying pts isn’t the same as trying to draw.

 

[dotman]

So how much should it cost? Should we make all hunting licenses free? I mean 40.00 for an elk tag isn’t affordable for everyone. Not fair for those guys not to have a chance at an elk.

The biggest problem is the slap in the face for all the guys who have applied religiously for a decade or two. The only thing keeping non-res odds from being off the chart bad (they aren’t good now) was the paper app and fronting the money.

My biggest complaint is that they changed the rules halfway thru the game.


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It shouldn’t cost almost $10k I know that. Maybe NR should have only had to pay what residents do to enter the draw and then pay the rest once drawn.

 

[dotman]

I did. And I even answered your question you asked in the first post - "When do the updated regs and big game brochure with changes usually come out?"

You did, no where in the 2017 brochure does it say you will no longer have to front the entire license fee and now only pay $3. No one asked about the $40 if you didn’t have a license in the previous year and no one was complaining about what the license costs were just the having to front 100% of it only to get a pref pt.

So guess I’m not sure who’s questions you answered. Everything you originally posted has been common knowledge for awhile, the $3 per species app fee wasn’t.

 

[ckleeves]

I probably got a bit carried away. Its post like the following that upset me.



Reducing point creep by pricing people out is a terrible long term idea.

Yes, I have points for MSG in CO, so I will be affected. I'd rather young people had hope of drawing a tag.

Yep that’s why AZ and Utah can’t hardly get anyone to apply for their non res tags.

I’m not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination. FAR from it as a matter of fact. I apply in Idaho for sheep or moose when I can afford it. Some years I can, some years I can’t. I don’t blame Idaho for charging for a hunting license and the full cost of the tag. I should have worked harder or saved more that year. No ones fault but my own.

This move reduces young people’s chance of ever drawing so I’m not sure where your going with that.

 

[cnelk]

Maybe they should only change to this for the NR, cause so far I only really see residents against it but I bet the resident tune would change if they had the same tag prices and had to front close to $29k for three months just to get a pt for themselves and kids.

Dotman

Whats your beef?

Your quote above is complaining about residents and tag prices - hence my reply

 

[Glendon Mullins]

Yes but buying pts isn’t the same as trying to draw.

Yes, but I will eventually try to draw, whereas before, I wasn't even trying, maybe u missed that

and I am sure there will be many others like me, so I am sure, somehow that will effect draw odds?

again I could be wrong



'

 

[Alone Guy]

If you are putting in for sheep moose or goat your are trying to draw every time. For you to say putting for points and drawing are not the same doesn't make sense. People will always apply to draw because they are lottery tags... it would be dumb not to try to draw. I've seen guys with three weighted points draw when people with 20 plus haven't.

 

[dotman]

Dotman

Whats your beef?

Your quote above is complaining about residents and tag prices - hence my reply

Reread it, not complaining about resident or nonresident tag prices, complaining about having to give almost $10k to only apply for a pref pt for myself and up to $30k if I add my kids to the fold. Also I was saying maybe this should only change for the NR, then it wouldn’t effect the residents.

I get it, $10k to apply for pref pts doesn’t effect you and you think I should move to CO. Tell me what other states do you hunt in where you fork out that kind of cash just to get another pref pt, not even putting in for the draw? I only hunt elk otc and deer/bear every other year, all other species I just put in for a pref pt.

 

[dotman]

Yes, but I will eventually try to draw, whereas before, I wasn't even trying, maybe u missed that

and I am sure there will be many others like me, so I am sure, somehow that will effect draw odds?

again I could be wrong



'

Yes and someday I will try to draw as well and both of us will have more pref pts and less pref pts then others, chances we draw are slim today and in the future either way. If you look at the last page of the statistics for each species you’ll see how many only buy pref pts, many have 20+ yet don’t put in for the draw.

 

[dotman]

If you are putting in for sheep moose or goat your are trying to draw every time. For you to say putting for points and drawing are not the same doesn't make sense. People will always apply to draw because they are lottery tags... it would be dumb not to try to draw. I've seen guys with three weighted points draw when people with 20 plus haven't.

No as not every year would it be feasible for a NR to invest the time/money for one of these hunts if they just so happen to get lucky and win the lotto, many just buy pref pts for the future. This isn’t just a $650 license, @$2200+ many want to have the time to hunt these animals with as much time as they can get. The price of the license alone, if drawn will keep many NR’s from applying but not buying pref pts until they feel they can spend $2200+ which grows another 3% each year, if I ever draw one of these tags it’ll probably cost me $5k by then, this isn’t something you don’t plan for and many with young families can’t afford to pay for the tag which in itself will keep the odds similar to what they are today. But I could be wrong, how would your wife react if you drew moose, sheep and goat in one year and then told her it’s going to cost $7k plus expenses, that may keep you from entering the draw but not building points.

 

[dotman]

Now on the flip side, if I was a resident I would always put in to draw these tags, it’s cheap and easier to scout as a resident.

 

[cnelk]

Dotman
Good luck in your 2018 Colorado PP/draw.
Sorry I can’t contribute to this thread anymore as my focus is on my Wyoming elk application which starts next week.
I have scouting to do as a non resident

 

[dotman]

Dotman
Good luck in your 2018 Colorado PP/draw.
Sorry I can’t contribute to this thread anymore as my focus is on my Wyoming elk application which starts next week.
I have scouting to do as a non resident

Good luck with WY, do you buy pts in WY or try to draw with zero pts? CO I’ll just be OTC, only pts for 2018.