Calling Elk In Wolf Country!

[ElkNut1]

For those hunting elk (bulls) in country that has had wolves for years now especially us archery hunters what are some of your thoughts or concerns when calling is used?

What has been ones experience especially in states as Idaho & neighboring states?

Do you hold back from calling or is it business as usual?

ElkNut/Paul

 

[Wrench]

I had the wolves go off two or three days last year in the panhandle of Idaho. I was actively in a conversation with a bull at the time the wolves popped off at 300 yards or (best guess) the bull and cows went stealth, but the bull still made sounds, but they were more like grunts and growls than anything I can describe. I suffered paralysis by analysis and went quiet. I didn't finish my job or get a shot at a wolf.

The other days that the wolves were close the elk went quiet until the wolves were well away.

Off topic but....I did call a smoker of a Tom to 30 yards but he wasn't about to catch an arrow. He came in to intense bugles and raking. I'd guess him to be an honest 160# plus cat.

 

[Wrench]

To do a better job of answering your question, I started out aggressive as anywhere and only adjusted when the elk seemed to respond to the wolves. It's a rush like no other to be persued while in persuit.

 

[BuckSmasher]

For those hunting elk (bulls) in country that has had wolves for years now especially us archery hunters what are some of your thoughts or concerns when calling is used?

What has been ones experience especially in states as Idaho & neighboring states?

Do you hold back from calling or is it business as usual?

ElkNut/Paul

Bulls still bugle in the GYE area of Montana. I hunted there from 2014-2017 seasons every year. Grizzlies and wolves didn't make as much of a difference as heavy human hunting in my experience. I once had a spike bull come into a wallow about 20 minutes after a Grizzly had left the wallow (after my shouting and near panicking) using the same trail. I don't know how they didn't see each other. I know your post wasn't about grizz, sorry.

The area where we hunted we only saw wolves one of those four seasons. That year the wolves moved the elk from the immediate area the wolves seemed to have setup shop in but the elk didn't leave the area. Where could they go, another packs territory? They still bugled and acted like elk.

I don't hate wolves or grizzlies and I am a fan of management of both. Grizzly populations have gotten out of control in SW Montana. A lower population density and some fear of humans would be nice.

 

[madmoose]

North idaho, same as first poster. Several occasions talking back and forth, then wolves pipe up, all went quiet. Once had bull continue with low grunts. But few. All occasions though, elk didn't leave. Just all eyes and ears on deck.

 

[GregB]

Last year was the first year I archery hunted but the big lesson I learned was to be ready for a bull to come in silent at any time you are calling and don't expect to get a chance to change position and set up. I had taken a break and did some bugling and cow calling, next thing I know something was crashing down the hill towards me. The bull came to within 7ish yards of me but there was a thick stand of brush and trees between us and the wind was wrong. He gave a huff or woof and took off. I packed my stuff up and booked it around and up the backside of a spur ridge, found a good area to set up and made sure I was ready before I started calling. Called again with cow calls and locator bugles and the bull came in on a string, didn't make a peep but I could hear him walking. Because I was set up and ready I was able to seal the deal. I never really got a look at the first bull that came in, but I think it was the same one I shot. I don't think I'm a very good caller and certainly don't have a great understanding of them like Paul. I was using locator bugles some chuckling and cow calls just alternating randomly. This was in an Idaho unit with a lot of wolves.

 

[Wrench]

Last year was the first year I archery hunted but the big lesson I learned was to be ready for a bull to come in silent at any time you are calling and don't expect to get a chance to change position and set up. I had taken a break and did some bugling and cow calling, next thing I know something was crashing down the hill towards me. The bull came to within 7ish yards of me but there was a thick stand of brush and trees between us and the wind was wrong. He gave a huff or woof and took off. I packed my stuff up and booked it around and up the backside of a spur ridge, found a good area to set up and made sure I was ready before I started calling. Called again with cow calls and locator bugles and the bull came in on a string, didn't make a peep but I could hear him walking. Because I was set up and ready I was able to seal the deal. I never really got a look at the first bull that came in, but I think it was the same one I shot. I don't think I'm a very good caller and certainly don't have a great understanding of them like Paul. I was using locator bugles some chuckling and cow calls just alternating randomly. This was in an Idaho unit with a lot of wolves.

I had a bull come in and do the exact same thing! I thought for sure it was something with sharp teeth and I was in a jam. I spun around as fast as I could expecting to pull my gun on a bear or wolf.....and I had enough time to let the image of about a 280" bull vanish.

I flet like such a puss.

 

[BuckSmasher]

I had a bull come in and do the exact same thing! I thought for sure it was something with sharp teeth and I was in a jam. I spun around as fast as I could expecting to pull my gun on a bear or wolf.....and I had enough time to let the image of about a 280" bull vanish.

I flet like such a puss.

We have had Grizzlies come in to cow calling twice. Not the adrenaline rush we were going for, but adrenaline nonetheless.

 

[GregB]

I had a bull come in and do the exact same thing! I thought for sure it was something with sharp teeth and I was in a jam. I spun around as fast as I could expecting to pull my gun on a bear or wolf.....and I had enough time to let the image of about a 280" bull vanish.

I flet like such a puss.

Yeah I was 50/50 on whether it was an elk or bear. It was big, moving pretty fast and I wasn't able to see it. It eventually crossed some harder ground and I could hear the hooves so I could take my hand off my pistol.

 

[Charon]

Allowing an apex predator to flourish with literally no control is a problem. Spin it however you would like but the way wolves are managed in the lower 48 is a MAJOR problem. Just because one hasn't personally witnessed the problem doesn't make it any less of one.

 

[mulecreek]

Allowing an apex predator to flourish with literally no control is a problem.

Every state that has a manageable wolf population has a control program in place. Your statement is literally wrong.

 

[ElkNut1]

Just to avoid confusion, this thread isn't about do wolves eat elk & do they need controlling, etc. those are obvious answers. It's about Calling elk in wolf country & what have been ones experiences! There's lots of ways to successfully hunt elk but has calling come to a halt for some or is it not a big deal to some!

Like some have mentioned, I too have had elk go quiet & move off with wolves present. It's been this way for years & I'm used to it so just move on when this happens, sorta like when another hunter enters the equation & blows elk out that I may have been working, you just move on!

I hunt wolf country every year & have done so since 96, I call as much now as in years past, all in all bulls are still very callable. No matter if hunting wolf country or not it's common place for bulls to approach all sorts of calling tactics in silent mode, that's just elk hunting! In other instances you call & the bulls won't shut up, I like those best! (grin)

ElkNut/Paul

 

[elkguide]

My experience with talking to elk in wolf country is limited to a little in Idaho and a few years in Wyoming. I guided in area 60 and our base camp was 30 miles from the nearest road and on the Park (Yellowstone) boundary, in the Thoroughfare. In that area, which was near a very remote area of the Park where problem bears were released, we would encounter grizz almost daily. The elk and other wildlife all seemed aware of the grizz but had learned to work around them. We did too.

When the wolves moved in, the game changed.

We had to learn that when in the middle of a good conversation with a bull, once you heard a wolf howl, game over. Elk would go silent and you needed to head to another drainage. I one time had 4 different bulls talking and working towards my hunter and I, when a wolf started in and it turned into an immediate ghost town.

My favorite memory comes from a very bossy client that I don't know why he signed up for a guided hunt as he knew everything there was to know about elk hunting. I had a very nice 6 point worked up and closing the distance. We'd caught a couple of glimpses of him but not long enough to shoot. He was just about to break out into a clearing when several wolves opened up about 3/4 of a mile away. I picked up my pack and started to move away when my hunter told me to cow call again. I asked him if he hadn't heard the wolves and then told him that it was game over. He was adamant that I do what he knew was right since the bull was less than 50 yards away so I should call again. I told him that that wasn't a good idea as we were in some very dark timber and the wolves would be here momentarily. He wouldn't accept my "idea" so I cow called again and in about 5 minutes there were 5 wolves circling us at about 20 yards and in those days you went to jail if you shot one so as my hunter very meekly asked what to do, I smiled to myself and told him to be still and hopefully they will go away soon!


Rant time.
Wolves first took the sheep, the moose, the deer and then the elk. The area is just a shadow of what it was before the new species of wolves were introduced. We would occasionally even see a "NATIVE" wolf pass through before the new ones came and then took out the native wolves too. I will agree that it is amazing to watch a wolf, just as it is to watch a grizz or any of the awesome wildlife that are there in the wilderness but an animal that is uncontrolled like the wolves are, will totally change the bio-diversity of an area. I guess that it's a great feeling for those that live in the cities and like to feel that they've helped the wilderness be restored even though none of them will likely ever put in the effort to ride a horse 30 miles into the back country to see what it's really like but for those of us that worked/lived in the wilderness, it's not quite the way to do things.

Sorry for the rant but wildlife management should not be done in the courts nor in the court of public opinion.

 

[Beendare]

I've had bulls go quiet...or pretty quiet anyway. in Idaho and MT. On one hunt in ID we were watching a big herd of elk in a basin when a pack of wolves rolled through just cruising. Even with visual rutting activity after that...they didn't bugle.

That same area we ran into a guy with llamas and he said he saw a 6 point bull being chased by wolves. So much for the theory that wolves only eat the weak and sick. Thats a bunch of hogwash.

Wolves go for the animal that splits from the herd...whichever it may be.

I've been in other areas of MT with a lot of wolf sign...and as Paul so eloquently stated...we just move on.

..

 

[Ross]

I call just like I have since my first bow hunt in 1986 but once the wolves howl in the area things clam shut and I move on to another bull

 

[mwebs]

So elk haven't evolved with wolves for thousands of years? Maybe hunters need to evolve to hunt with wolves in the picture. The guys that have been hunting after we wiped them all out we're hunting a species de-void of their natural predators. Obviously it's easier without wolves around, but it's also a hell of a lot easier without 10s of thousands of people hunting and killing them. Sorry Paul I know this is not what you wanted for this thread to discuss, but it is where it was going to go. I get it, when wolves are around hunting sucks and I hate it, but you need to evolve your tactics. The other option is killing them all again, and if you agree with that then you can't be a true outdoorsmen. My theory hunt how you would normally hunt, when wolves are around mimick the elk by doing lower volume calls/ grunts/ sounds.

 

[87TT]

I disagree. When the elk and wolves were here before, A) they were a different kind of wolf and B0 we people hadn't move in and taken up their range and habitat. They had ore freedom to escape and spread out. We also compete with the wolves so it is not like it was. If it comes down to us or the wolves, I pick us. Not to mention the livestock.
That said I adapt and move when they show up. Also miss the more vocal elk.

 

[Beendare]

.....The other option is killing them all again, and if you agree with that then you can't be a true outdoorsmen. .....

So because I realize the negative impact Wolves have on;
Our elk and Deer herds...taking an organic protein source from human populations
The huge burden it puts on the F&G depts
The huge burdens on the state from lawsuits
The loss of livestock...and the corresponding impact due to financial compensation by the states taxpayers
Economic loss from lost hunting opportunities

Because I realize what a huge negative impact wolves are....I'm not a "True Outdoorsman"......someone is living in a fantasy world.

...

 

[mwebs]

So because I realize the negative impact Wolves have on;
Our elk and Deer herds...taking an organic protein source from human populations
The huge burden it puts on the F&G depts
The huge burdens on the state from lawsuits
The loss of livestock...and the corresponding impact due to financial compensation by the states taxpayers
Economic loss from lost hunting opportunities

Because I realize what a huge negative impact wolves are....I'm not a "True Outdoorsman"......someone is living in a fantasy world.

...

That seems pretty naive, just because we are now the apex predator does that mean the pray is simply ours, whom is the true invasive predator? You don't have to agree but it is a FACT that for 1000s of years elk lived with wolves and were just fine. Now that humans are killing them to it now becomes a problem? Just because it makes them harder to hunt doesn't mean the wolves are ruing elk hunting, I guess some people are to used to hunting dumb elk that forgot about wolves when we removed their natural predator. Obviously they are having a negative impact on elk populations and behavior, but so are all the hunters chasing them/ killing them every fall. I could care less about the ranchers cattle being killed when they pay $1.35 a head per month for a cow and calf to be on public land, plus depredation if a wolf kills their animals, to let them destroy the land and my hunt, their more subsidized then food stamp recipients. I say all this as a life long hunter, and I have stood up for our kind against the hippies and eco terrorists, but we need to be realistic and acknowledge the impact we have and that wolves are a natural predator for elk. Like I said before, getting back to the purpose of the thread, quieter elk sounds like grunts, low volume chuckles and cow calls have worked when wolves are around and I have witnessed elk do the same. Location bugles seem to go out the window.

 

[87TT]

The wolves they "re introduced" are not the natural predator. They are a larger variety. The landscape has changed since the natural (smaller) wolves were here. We have built cities and highways that have taken up and block the natural habitat. I guess we should remove these things too if we are true outdoorsmen. I remember visiting Yellowstone in the past as an adult and as a child and remember seeing moose both times. I spent a week there last year searching for a moose to photograph. There are none! I asked the rangers and they admitted that there are none and suggested maybe in the South end of the Tetons. The only moose we found was outside of the park near a town where they could find a little respite from the wolves.
Bottom line is we either quit hunting and eating meat or we have to control the wolves.
I don't accept your definition of a true outdoorsman. I buy a wolf tag every year.