Buyer beware

[Flatgo]

I posted a thread about this a few weeks ago, and had pretty much the same experience. for the price the harness was a big let down, and it was even a bigger let down when they wouldn't take it back. I agree its a poor enough product i would not to sell it someone else. I hope with these threads it will save some people some money on an inferior product.

 

[Broomd]

Yep, threads like this help everyone, and even the marketer if they heed he advice.
If they really want satisfied customers, and most do, they will appreciate the input and make the necessary changes to policy and/or product.

 

[unclericco]

Thanks for posting this. I'm shopping for a bino harness for my Leicas and have been having a hard time deciding. This will help make it easier for me

 

[Floorguy]

Says "no returns" prominently on the page in all caps.

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[realunlucky]

Edited

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[unclericco]

Yep just looked at their page. I checked out a few of their other items and the "No Returns" is not shown on the items I looked at. Still wouldn't order the harness without being able to send back if not happy. Glad this hasn't been the case on all the other things I've ordered

 

[Bubblehide]

Yep, with that policy, I'd never purchase a single thing from them. As such, I sent them the link to this thread, and gave them my opinion.

Thanks for the heads up!

 

[Idaho Sandman]

Says "no returns" prominently on the page in all caps.

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When this was brought up I went to their page and that was not there. They must have added it after all this.

 

[WV Mountaineer]

Should not be a problem if you allow someone to return it if they don't like it

Best dang post on this thread. If there was something wrong with them, by all means return them. But, to buy and expect them to just take them back because you decided against your purchase, says a whole lot about people and, their understanding of how tough it is for small business in this country. Guys, when you purchase something, you have essentially given your word that you will pay for it. Minus some defect. When you fart around and decide it's not for you and send it back, all you are doing is ensuring that the company losses profit and, the product becomes more expensive. There is little wonder hunting gear is so expensive with so many people looking to ring out these manufacturers. No harm meant with this post but, this is just the way it is. Good luck and God Bless

 

[Bubblehide]

Best dang post on this thread. If there was something wrong with them, by all means return them. But, to buy and expect them to just take them back because you decided against your purchase, says a whole lot about people and, their understanding of how tough it is for small business in this country. Guys, when you purchase something, you have essentially given your word that you will pay for it. Minus some defect. When you fart around and decide it's not for you and send it back, all you are doing is ensuring that the company losses profit and, the product becomes more expensive. There is little wonder hunting gear is so expensive with so many people looking to ring out these manufacturers. No harm meant with this post but, this is just the way it is. Good luck and God Bless

From my experience, almost every company I have dealt with will issue a refund if your return a product in original condition, if the purchaser is not satisfied with it. Most vendors here in Ca have a 30 day return policy. As far as I am concerned, any retail store that has a no refund policy is a store I will not deal with, as they are the exception, not the norm.

As a matter of fact, here is the Ca take on this: In California, retailers that won’t give a full refund or credit, allow an equal exchange, or any combination of these options, within seven days of purchase when goods are returned with a receipt, must clearly display their policy at each cash register and sales counter, at each public entrance, on tags attached to each item sold under the policy, or on the retail seller’s order forms, if any.

This requirement does not apply to perishable items (like food or plants), items that are marked as final sale, goods used or damaged after purchase, custom orders, goods not returned with their original packaging, and items that can’t be resold for health reasons.

If a store violates this law (California Civil Code section 1723) by not conspicuously displaying their limited or no return policy, the customer can return the purchased item with proof of purchase for a full refund within 30 days. You can notify the consumer protection division of your local district attorney’s office of any violations, or file a complaint online with the Attorney General’s office by visiting Consumer Complaint Against A Business/Company | State of California - Department of Justice - Office of the Attorney General.

So, depending on the state this took place in, Muley Freak may very well be violating the law.

When so many reputable companies offer a no fault/satisfaction guarantee, there is no point in doing business with companies like Muley Freak, they just don't measure up, clearly not meeting the level of customer support most people have come to expect.

Based on what IdahoSandman stated, if true, and that the OP is based in Ca (Ca law applies, despite sell location) MF clearly violated Ca law/consumer protections.

 

[d3ntalbliss]

From my experience, almost every company I have dealt with will issue a refund if your return a product in original condition, if the purchaser is not satisfied with it. Most vendors here in Ca have a 30 day return policy. As far as I am concerned, any retail store that has a no refund policy is a store I will not deal with, as they are the exception, not the norm.

As a matter of fact, here is the Ca take on this: In California, retailers that won’t give a full refund or credit, allow an equal exchange, or any combination of these options, within seven days of purchase when goods are returned with a receipt, must clearly display their policy at each cash register and sales counter, at each public entrance, on tags attached to each item sold under the policy, or on the retail seller’s order forms, if any.

This requirement does not apply to perishable items (like food or plants), items that are marked as final sale, goods used or damaged after purchase, custom orders, goods not returned with their original packaging, and items that can’t be resold for health reasons.

If a store violates this law (California Civil Code section 1723) by not conspicuously displaying their limited or no return policy, the customer can return the purchased item with proof of purchase for a full refund within 30 days. You can notify the consumer protection division of your local district attorney’s office of any violations, or file a complaint online with the Attorney General’s office by visiting Consumer Complaint Against A Business/Company | State of California - Department of Justice - Office of the Attorney General.

So, depending on the state this took place in, Muley Freak may very well be violating the law.

When so many reputable companies offer a no fault/satisfaction guarantee, there is no point in doing business with companies like Muley Freak, they just don't measure up, clearly not meeting the level of customer support most people have come to expect.

Based on what IdahoSandman stated, if true, and that the OP is based in Ca (Ca law applies, despite sell location) MF clearly violated Ca law/consumer protections.

If the manufacturer is not based in California how would they be subject to California law? I'm no lawyer, but I think your stretching there.

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[Bubblehide]

If the manufacturer is not based in California how would they be subject to California law? I'm no lawyer, but I think your stretching there.

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Because Ca has that built into their consumer protections laws, as simple as that. For a backasswards state, once in while they get some things right.

 

[HookUp]

Was getting ready to buy some Stalkers from Muley Freak, after reading this thread I went to another website and ordered. God forbid I get the wrong size shape or color I wont have any issues with the return process. Hunting gear has to be a perfect fit due to the demands we place on it. Not interested in a company who doesn't put the customer first.

All the great companies Amazon, REI, Costco, etc have amazing customer service and returns are never an issue.

 

[Diewithyourbootson]

Alaskan guide creations, that's all I have to say

 

[Bubblehide]

It looks like MF is located in Utah, for your reading enjoyment, here is the Utah Consumer protections:
If seller has a non-refund, exchange, or credit policy, the policy must be clearly indicated by a sign posted at the point of display, the point of sale, or the store entrance. If the seller fails this requirement, the customer is entitled to a return.

Appears that they were in violation of the Utah law at the time of the Op's purchase.

Here is the federal regulation: Federal return regulations provide for a "cooling of period" giving buyers three days to cancel purchases of $25 or more. Under this rule, the right to cancel for a full refund extends until midnight of the third business day after the sale. The rule applies to sales at the buyer's home or workplace, at facilities rented by the seller on a temporary basis, or at locations otherwise away from the seller's normal retail location.

 

[Floorguy]

Because Ca has that built into their consumer protections laws, as simple as that. For a backasswards state, once in while they get some things right.

I don't think that is getting it right.

I kind of look at it like this, I spend time researching to make sure I get what I want. If I can't check it out in person I make sure that I am ok eating the price if I don't like it. I have never purchased something with the thought that if I don't like it I will just return it.

If a company wants to offer a generous return policy good for them, they will probably get taken advantage of and eventually change it i.e. REI. If they don't want to accept returns because someone thought it was going to be two shades darker because their screen settings when they ordered it were off I don't begrudge them at all.

I don't work in retail however I do work construction and do designer floors. I have had jobs where money was withheld because the owner didn't like the colors when it was done despite their hand picking the color.

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[d3ntalbliss]

Because Ca has that built into their consumer protections laws, as simple as that. For a backasswards state, once in while they get some things right.

Yeah but just because California had civil code 1723 doesn't mean that code applies to other states, or that California has power to try and enforce it in other states on behalf of their residents.

I'm not arguing that consumers shouldn't have protection, just that your original statement that the manufacturer may be in violation of California civil code 1723 when jurisdictionally Californian civil law does not apply.

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[Bubblehide]

Yeah but just because California had civil code 1723 doesn't mean that code applies to other states, or that California has power to try and enforce it in other states on behalf of their residents.

I'm not arguing that consumers shouldn't have protection, just that your original statement that the manufacturer may be in violation of California civil code 1723 when jurisdictionally Californian civil law does not apply.

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.
I was not referring to 1723. The fact is that there are numerous laws that apply, including internet commerce laws. Like most legal issues/regulations, it's a tangled web.

 

[Bubblehide]

I don't think that is getting it right.

I kind of look at it like this, I spend time researching to make sure I get what I want. If I can't check it out in person I make sure that I am ok eating the price if I don't like it. I have never purchased something with the thought that if I don't like it I will just return it.

If a company wants to offer a generous return policy good for them, they will probably get taken advantage of and eventually change it i.e. REI. If they don't want to accept returns because someone thought it was going to be two shades darker because their screen settings when they ordered it were off I don't begrudge them at all.

I don't work in retail however I do work construction and do designer floors. I have had jobs where money was withheld because the owner didn't like the colors when it was done despite their hand picking the color.

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I suppose you've never put a lean against an unpaid bill for such ridiculous reasons for a customer to not pay too, which would just be bad business. Just the same as not having a reasonable refund policy is. In today's world, not having a refund policy is simply not being competitive. It's the same as shooting your business in the foot, and watching it bleed out.

 

[realunlucky]

If you don't to deal with the inconveniences of product return when people must buy your product sight unseen than prepare to not sell products

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