Bow Hand Grip Torque

[ontarget7]

That is correct. I was in a huge rip this morning and only had about 15 minutes to do all of this. The second to the last picture is wrong. I impacted with some other holes and it was hard to see what happened. The wrong picture is point blank after the last move. I don't have a picture of the tear through paper at the target while shooting from 20 yards. The arrow that has no fletching was depicted correctly in the target even though it is a bag target. Also, I had a Smackdown Pro on previously and my broadhead tune told me that I needed to have a stiffer shaft. I run a 29.5/70 Spyder Turbo and 28.5" ctc 100 grain Axis 300s.

Well from the pic, I would bet if you changed grip pressure ever so slightly from left to right you would have perfect entry with a bareshaft and your fletched at 20 yards. Try this both ways from left to right and you will clearly see what direction you need to go. Post pics of the results. Now if it doesn't change with slight pressure then you no you will need a slight yoke adjustment.

 

[vcb]

I put it on my bow. then used a laser to make sure the two lines it created are exactly in line with my front pins and my bowstring when my bow is sitting on the work bench. Once drawn when you look through your peep if the pins are not in between the lines you are torquing your bow....

Not for all but I'm a gear head

 

[ontarget7]

I put it on my bow. then used a laser to make sure the two lines it created are exactly in line with my front pins and my bowstring when my bow is sitting on the work bench. Once drawn when you look through your peep if the pins are not in between the lines you are torquing your bow....

Not for all but I'm a gear head

Torquing is a miss used term IMO. What you are really doing is finding a particular bows sweet spot since all bows are not the same. Through the wide range of bows and cam designs they are not all engineered for the pins to line up at rest. This can and will give you a false impression depending on the bow.

 

[Brandon Pattison]

I put it on my bow. then used a laser to make sure the two lines it created are exactly in line with my front pins and my bowstring when my bow is sitting on the work bench. Once drawn when you look through your peep if the pins are not in between the lines you are torquing your bow....

Not for all but I'm a gear head

How does the string not running parallel from top to bottom fit into the equation?

 

[ontarget7]

How does the string not running parallel from top to bottom fit into the equation?

That would be true as well and another reason you could be mislead

 

[Tilzbow]

Well from the pic, I would bet if you changed grip pressure ever so slightly from left to right you would have perfect entry with a bareshaft and your fletched at 20 yards. Try this both ways from left to right and you will clearly see what direction you need to go. Post pics of the results. Now if it doesn't change with slight pressure then you no you will need a slight yoke adjustment.

So assuming my bow is tuned and I shoot right handed, if I shoot a bare shaft that's nock left what grip pressure would I use to correct this?

 

[Brandon Pattison]

So assuming my bow is tuned and I shoot right handed, if I shoot a bare shaft that's nock left what grip pressure would I use to correct this?

Let's also assume he doesn't torque his grip, what yoke tuning would be needed?

 

[ontarget7]

So assuming my bow is tuned and I shoot right handed, if I shoot a bare shaft that's nock left what grip pressure would I use to correct this?

Nock left would probably mean a bareshaft impact to the right at 20 yards. You would more than likely have to have a slight counterclockwise rotation. These movements are very settle and you will see the difference in results from a counterclockwise rotation and a clockwise rotation in pressure. I can't stress it enough that they are small changes and proper grip position stays the same

 

[ontarget7]

Let's also assume he doesn't torque his grip, what yoke tuning would be needed?

Nock left would mean bareshafts impact to the right so you would put twist in the left side and take out the same amount to the right. If you are close I would do 1/2 twist at a time and you will see the change with each adjustment.

 

[Tilzbow]

Nock left would probably mean a bareshaft impact to the right at 20 yards. You would more than likely have to have a slight counterclockwise rotation. These movements are very settle and you will see the difference in results from a counterclockwise rotation and a clockwise rotation in pressure. I can't stress it enough that they are small changes and proper grip position stays the same

I might not be understanding what you mean by "proper grip position" but I think that would vary from bow model to bow model. Assuming the rest of the form is good then to induce a slight counter clockwise rotation I think I would move the bottom of the bow handle away from the base of my thumb (towards the center of the wrist, the entire process maybe changes the angle of the hand from 45 to 40 degrees) and maintain a relaxed grip vs. purposely inducing rotation using the same position as before along with muscle tension to induce the rotation. For a clockwise rotation moving closer to the thumb would be the desired direction. Both changes would be very, very small.

 

[ontarget7]

I might not be understanding what you mean by "proper grip position" but I think that would vary from bow model to bow model. Assuming the rest of the form is good then to induce a slight counter clockwise rotation I think I would move the bottom of the bow handle away from the base of my thumb (towards the center of the wrist, the entire process maybe changes the angle of the hand from 45 to 40 degrees) and maintain a relaxed grip vs. purposely inducing rotation using the same position as before along with muscle tension to induce the rotation. For a clockwise rotation moving closer to the thumb would be the desired direction. Both changes would be very, very small.

The change in angle is really changing your grip from say a medium grip to more of a lower wrist grip and not the slight pressure changes I am referring to. They are 2 separate things that make a huge difference in your overall shooting. It's the biggest reason why some shoot certain bows better than others and they never really understand why they do.

 

[Tilzbow]

The change in angle is really changing your grip from say a medium grip to more of a lower wrist grip and not the slight pressure changes I am referring to. They are 2 separate things that make a huge difference in your overall shooting. It's the biggest reason why some shoot certain bows better than others and they never really understand why they do.

I've always thought of low vs medium wrist being a change of pressure from closer to the heal of the hand for low wrist to closer to the webbing for medium wrist. This would seem to have more of an impact on high/low than the left/right we're discussing. Again it's probably just a difference in the terminology we're using....

 

[ontarget7]

I've always thought of low vs medium wrist being a change of pressure from closer to the heal of the hand for low wrist to closer to the webbing for medium wrist. This would seem to have more of an impact on high/low than the left/right we're discussing. Again it's probably just a difference in the terminology we're using....

The steeper the angle of your knuckles makes it easier to transition to a lower wrist grip. Then you will end up crossing your lifeline at the bottom of your hand. This is more of a common grip position with a 2 track system. When you are more to a 40-45* angle you will end up more to the thumb side of your lifeline and more common grip position for a hybrid or single cam design.
This is really an advanced topic and takes some time to understand it. What I have found you cannot crossover from one to the other and achieve perfect arrow flight regardless of how you try and adjust your tune to compensate.

 

[vcb]

Hey guys what aftermarket grips have you used? Shrewd, torquless, etc... My bowtech has a super narrow rounded back end...seems tough to get a consistent grip. Maybe a full wood aftermarket would allow a more consistent grip. Shane I noted you use Pro fit grips...I didnt see that they made one for bowtechs..

 

[Brandon Pattison]

The last time I had my bow on my shady draw board showed that the top cam was perfectly parallel to the bottom cam. Is this ideal?

 

[Brandon Pattison]

Is there a video or a condensed version of yoke tuning, broadhead tuning, paper tuning, walkback tuning, French tickler tuning and etc.? I understand paper and broadhead and walkback but I cannot wrap my head around the yoke tuning. It is nice to see everyone's posts but is there a reference on YouTube that a guy could just watch when he was not shooting well-placed arrows?

 

[Manosteel]

Is there a video or a condensed version of yoke tuning, broadhead tuning, paper tuning, walkback tuning, French tickler tuning and etc.? I understand paper and broadhead and walkback but I cannot wrap my head around the yoke tuning. It is nice to see everyone's posts but is there a reference on YouTube that a guy could just watch when he was not shooting well-placed arrows?

x2

I typically get my bow to spec, twisting cables/string etc... then paper tune old way ie nock/rest movement, french modified walk back tune and BH tune.

Would love to learn more about yoke tuning especially b/c it sounds like most guys with Hoyts get the bow to spec, center shot as reccomended and then yoke tune to get perfect filght be it thru paper or bare shaft tunning.

 

[vcb]

Yup, that is the benefit of split buss cables. You can leave your rest at centershot and just yoke tune your paper tune tears for a bullet hole. When you are yoke tuning your spit buss cables you are actually moving the string left or right.

 

[Tilzbow]

The steeper the angle of your knuckles makes it easier to transition to a lower wrist grip. Then you will end up crossing your lifeline at the bottom of your hand. This is more of a common grip position with a 2 track system. When you are more to a 40-45* angle you will end up more to the thumb side of your lifeline and more common grip position for a hybrid or single cam design.
This is really an advanced topic and takes some time to understand it. What I have found you cannot crossover from one to the other and achieve perfect arrow flight regardless of how you try and adjust your tune to compensate.

Okay, gotcha that makes sense and meshes with my understanding. It's hard to explain via words but fairly easy to show someone how grip affects the bow at full draw, the reaction at the shot, the rest position and so on.....

With my Hoyts I'm more in line with your description of the hybrid grip. When I switch to my longbow (which has a recurve grip) I have to tweak my grip to even more of a medium grip otherwise I get horrible arrow flight.

 

[Tilzbow]

Hey guys what aftermarket grips have you used? Shrewd, torquless, etc... My bowtech has a super narrow rounded back end...seems tough to get a consistent grip. Maybe a full wood aftermarket would allow a more consistent grip. Shane I noted you use Pro fit grips...I didnt see that they made one for bowtechs..

I use a Shrewd grip on my Hoyts. Works well for me and since I can really feel where it is on my hand I can repeat the same grip position. That said I've got pretty big hands. The Pro-Fit Shane is talking about is the stock wood grip that come with Hoyt bows this year. They deviated from these wooden grips for a couple of years with that rubber grip but went back to the wood this year.