Boot insulation?

[praharin]

Here in Pennsylvania we don't have the same challenges as western hunting. But what we do have is wetness basically all the time.

I see a lot of recommendations for boots such as the Salomon Quest 4D, and I've been eyeing those and the Arcteryx Bora/Bora2 mid as a general use boot. But I wanted to ask, given the time of year, how much difference does insulation make on a quality boots/socks combo?

Just for reference, I am prone to cold feet, but I am also interested in this from an academic perspective.

Thanks

 

[Akicita]

Before I begin let me state my reply is based on my experience, conditioning and mindset.

• First – The need for insulation in footwear is largely proportional to the aerobic or static activity of the wearer.

High aerobic activity increases heart rate and circulation to extremities.This results in the warming of tissue and muscle in those regions which can become very warm and even heated therefore insulation would only likely increase the chances of perspiration in those areas.

• Second – moisture and poor circulation are the largest contributing factors to cold feet in any environmental condition.

Water transfers heat from the body 25% faster than ambient air. Therefore any moisture from perspiration or environment trapped against the skin of your foot will result in your feet becoming colder much faster. In areas of perspiration including the feet it is imperative to allow that excess heat and moisture escape from the boot drawing moisture with it. The evaporation of moisture on skin that is exposed to air in ambient temperatures thermodynamically results in the moisture drawing heat away from the body as it evaporates. If it stays wet it in any cool environment your feet will be cold.

• Third- sock material and moisture wicking ability are paramount to warmth

Natural or synthetic - anything that wicks moisture away from the surface of your skin while maintain thermal properties of trapping air will keep your feet warm.

I do a lot of mountaineering, ice climbing, ski touring, hunting, and back country travel in very cold conditions here in Colorado and abroad so typically when I am engaged in aerobic activity I don’t wear insulated boots. More important to me is a boot that first in impermeable to environmental moisture and air. However it does need to be able to breath to allow heat and moisture out. I like a boot that has solid synthetic or leather uppers with a breathable tongue to act as a chimney. Typically I only wear insulated boots in ambient temps below 0 F during low aerobic activity or when above extreme altitudes of 18,000ft were circulation to extremities is very low during hypoxic conditions. Regardless of where you are or where you will go wet is wet and cold is cold. What I wear may not work for you but if you’re interested here is my foot wear of choice:

Boots:
Daily warm weather light load – Asolo Drifter GV (no insulation)
Daily cold weather moderate to heavy load – Scarpa Triolet GTX (no insulation)
Extreme cold weather extreme high altitude heavy load - Scarpa Phantom 8000 and La Sportiva G2 SM

Socks:
Darn Tough Cool Max Light Hiker, Mountaineering Micro Crew and Mountaineering Over the Calf

Opinion:
Arcteryx Bora Bora is a great durable boot. Saloman 4D GTX II is an average not so durable boot .

 

[praharin]

Thanks for the in depth reply. I don't really need a double boot here in Appalachia, but I wouldn't mind having one if I could find one in subdued colors, which is difficult. I understand why they are typically offered in only bright colors, but there is very little chance of me getting lost in even a lake effect snow drift.

To clarify my question, shirt if going to a pac boot or double mountaineering boot, does the 200-1000 gram insulation typically found in hunting boots really make a difference?


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[Laelkhunter]

Perfect explanation Akicita. I will add my observations to my personal experience. If your feet get wet, they will get cold regardless of the insulation. Wicking the moisture away from the skin is important. I use Kenetrek Mountain Extremes, non-insulated but I wear what I believe to be the best sock system I can buy (my opinion only). I have the Kenetrek Ultimate Liner sock which I wear next to the skin, then wear the Kenetrek Alaska socks over those. No blisters, no sweaty feet, and my feet stay warm during the entire hunt. Even if you wear thick felt lined pac-boots, your feet will eventually get cold if they get wet. I found my feet sweat really heavy in the pac-boots, and they got cold once they got wet. I went the opposite direction with the non-insulated Mountain Extremes, and they worked with the sock system I described.

 

[Akicita]

does the 200-1000 gram insulation typically found in hunting boots really make a difference?


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Yes if you are static with little or no aerobic activity. A typical day in an Eastern tree stand and I would wear an 800 -1000 gram boot after walking in with a non insulated approach shoe or boot and fresh dry socks. . . P.S: Function over fasion. . . I don't care for many of the European mountaineering colors but they design and make quality gear

@Laelkhunter - Thanks for the Kenetrek referral. . . I am going to try that combo.

 

[praharin]

I agree on function over fashion, but the function of bright colors is what I want to avoid. PA has a lot of public (state gameland, parks and a national forest near by) land, and I generally want people to leave me alone, and nit seeing me is a good place to start.


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[Akicita]

I agree on function over fashion, but the function of bright colors is what I want to avoid. PA has a lot of public (state gameland, parks and a national forest near by) land, and I generally want people to leave me alone, and nit seeing me is a good place to start.


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A little mud and some gaiters and no ones gonna notice. . .
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f1/Parks140/20161026_142102_zpsxarnzsdg.jpg

 

[praharin]

I have 22" calves. Gaiters aren't an option lol


ETA: I haven't tried the OR xxl crocodiles yet, but the XL Velcro just closes and starts to pull apart when I get my calves pumped.

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[kbob]

Over 40 years of PA hunting i've come down to 3 pair of boots to cover early archery thru gun and late archery. Early season - general synthetic/leather hiking boots. Once the temps get into the low 60s and 50s I use uninsulated leather gore tex boots, US made danners. For temps in the 30s and below i have Danner canadians. I stopped using felt pacs cause these seemed less secure than the canadians climbing up treestand ladders and also cause the greenbriars ripped up the rubber bottoms (also why i don't wear knee high rubber boots) - if you're on the ground and walking less than a mile or 2 then pacs could be OK. I am trying to get some info on the Hoffman/Kenetrek pac boots with regard to "hike-ability" but no replies yet.
I always take a pair of clean socks in a zip loc bag and change my socks at lunchtime - you're feet will feel like a hundred bucks!

PS - my Canadians are a half size bigger than normal and a wide model so i can wear heavier socks and sock liners - generally when temps get into the 20s I'm good in a tree for about 3 hrs or so with these. I can't stand sitting much longer than that in any weather tho!