BHA seems “all-in” with Biden

[brsnow]

Read the declaration of independence. Men (general term for human beings) are born with inalienable rights. These rights are then laid out in the Bill of Rights. The government only exists to protect these rights and the government shall only derive power at the consent of the governed. At any point that the government is no longer protecting these rights it is the right and the duty of the governed to remove that government from power.

Declaration of independence text:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”

Yes, but men wrote it, not God. They are just sharing their beliefs. That would make them men given rights.

 

[Rick M.]

I agree with you mostly. It was a rude way of pointing out that I believe his point was one conjured on an incorrect premise.

There is no one or the other. The land goes when the guns go, it might still be public but y’all know for damn sure we ain’t hunting it.


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I agree, there is no one or the other (for me). I'm at the point now where I think the entire Republican party rests their entire support system on being pro 2a and pro life, but they're also losing all morality and reason. The last six months has been a treasonous shit-storm. I love my guns, but I won't let it be a carrot on a stick for me that allows the Republican party to undermine democracy and decency. But I digress, my egg nog is kicking in and I'm going off topic.

 

[ChromeKype]

Yes, but men wrote it, not God. They are just sharing their beliefs.

Land? That you Land?


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[brsnow]

Land? That you Land?


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Are you implying God was speaking through the founding fathers?

 

[seldomseensmith]

I'm all ears?

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And let's be honest, $30 a year or whatever the membership cost is hardly an investment. I mean I spend more taking my wife and kids out for coffee and pastries.
A few of you guys need to get over yourselves with the term "investment". If my 30 bucks goes any length towards protecting some wilderness, that's good enough for me. I understand if you don't like their approach or align with their values. Then don't join but I'm glad theyre out there and they will get my money. You can call me names all you want but my motives are pure: protect what's left. And heck, at that price I can even afford to join RMEF. I would be a little more reserved if I wasn't talking to a bunch of guys that trade $100 pairs of used wool underwear and $800 backpacks that "were used on one trip".

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[Comerade]

Seems being pretty damn close to down the middle isn't enough anymore. Copied and pasted from BHA member survey (all found on the website):

• Political diversity: 28 percent of respondents are Independents, 23 percent are Republicans, 18 percent are Democrats, 6 percent are Libertarians and 1 percent are Green. (Twenty-three percent identify as “none of the above” or declined to answer the question.)

This concurs with what our chapter has provided me. It is driven here by serious hunters that want to have a say in landbase issues. When I can I will get more involved, this is from a card carrying Conservative. I know the Lefties are around also...This doesn't worry me at all.

 

[ChromeKype]

Are you implying God was speaking through the founding fathers?

Bro we can get down and dirty in an epistemological throw down. But not tonight.

That’s not what anyone is saying anyways.


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[brsnow]

Bro we can get down and dirty in an epistemological throw down. But not tonight.

That’s not what anyone is saying anyways.


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I just always hear God given right and the 2A and can’t find anything to support it. Clearly not going to find it tonight either.

 

[Headwatermike]

Are you implying God was speaking through the founding fathers?

Are you implying that God can only exist if men wrote about Him? Yours is a reductionist argument and you seem to have missed the point. I thought you were asking a sincere question or I wouldn't have bothered. Read up on the theories of rights and you might understand where the founding fathers are coming from, or re-read what def90 wrote. He was quite articulate.

 

[Comerade]

The way I look at it you should keep your friends close and your enemies even closer. If you are suspicious, join BHA and do your surveillance from within- you might be surprised. There will always be crooks and charlatans in everything.
This is the NRA's problem, membership let someone else worry about it
Instead of complaining, get involved

 

[brsnow]

Are you implying that God can only exist if men wrote about Him? Yours is a reductionist argument and you seem to have missed the point. I thought you were asking a sincere question or I wouldn't have bothered. Read up on the theories of rights and you might understand where the founding fathers are coming from, or re-read what def90 wrote. He was quite articulate.

God used Moses to write down his words. It is explicit. I am well versed and a believe. I don’t see the founding fathers in the same light. You can believe and support the constitution without thinking of it as God given. It works as a foundation to our country.

 

[greywacke]

I'll bite. The founding fathers recognized these rights (that all men are free to pursue life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness) as given by God and recognized them as such. Any rules or laws passed to limit these rights were not to be abided by Americans. As such, the 2nd Amendment was created to help free Americans overthrow a government's laws that took away our God-given freedoms. The founding fathers believed that your rights came from God and they did not want to encumber Americans with a gov't that could limit us in unnatural ways. "We find these truths to be self-evident..."

I would submit, good sir, that you conflate betwixt the Constitution and our Declaration of Independence from Great Britain and Her tyrannical Monarchy. One is a legally binding document, the other is not. One would do well to distinguish that they are different documents, arrived at by differing means in differing times, and different words were penned to parchment for completely different reasons; and one would surely err in confusing one sacred text for the other, and in forgetting that one is subject to Amendment, and the other is not.

Moreover, sir, let us not forget that the entire legal basis for the US Constitution is contained in its Preamble; and that no Right is unfettered. Some contain grave responsibilities, and some imply freedom from the freedoms of others.

 

[Travis Hobbs]

I would rather light $30.00 on fire than give it to BHA.

It all boils down to predator management for me.

 

[Headwatermike]

God used Moses to write down his words. It is explicit. I am well versed and a believe. I don’t see the founding fathers in the same light. You can believe and support the constitution without thinking of it as God given. It works as a foundation to our country.

I agree. I would only say that the founding fathers would argue that they only wrote laws to help defend the rights of mankind, which they believe exist independently of governments. It is an important distinction.
I never meant to get into any argument and I am guilty of purposely "misunderstanding" your statement defensively. Sorry for that.

 

[orionthehunter1]

And let's be honest, $30 a year or whatever the membership cost is hardly an investment. I mean I spend more taking my wife and kids out for coffee and pastries.
A few of you guys need to get over yourselves with the term "investment". If my 30 bucks goes any length towards protecting some wilderness, that's good enough for me. I understand if you don't like their approach or align with their values. Then don't join but I'm glad theyre out there and they will get my money. You can call me names all you want but my motives are pure: protect what's left. And heck, at that price I can even afford to join RMEF. I would be a little more reserved if I wasn't talking to a bunch of guys that trade $100 pairs of used wool underwear and $800 backpacks that "were used on one trip".

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I didn't see anyone call you names, but i did ask you if you have ever looked at their financials

 

[iashow]

Richard Berman is behind activist facts. He’s at least as big of a shitbag as land tawney.

Name calling, nice. This has become no different than any other forum. Nor any better than a bunch of teenagers seeing who is tougher through a screen.

 

[brsnow]

I agree. I would only say that the founding fathers would argue that they only wrote laws to help defend the rights of mankind, which they believe exist independently of governments. It is an important distinction.
I never meant to get into any argument and I am guilty of purposely "misunderstanding" your statement defensively. Sorry for that.

No need to apologize, I agree. It is an interesting discussion. I was curious to hear others thoughts..

 

[seldomseensmith]

I didn't see anyone call you names, but i did ask you if you have ever looked at their financials

Sorry. I wasn't implying anyone had called me names. Poorly worded on my part. Was just predicting responses. No I've never looked at their financials. But to be honest, I've never looked at anyone's financials other than my own. Feel free to educate me.

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[satchamo]

I’m really not understanding why people are so impassioned about hating on BHA. If you don’t like it, don’t join it. Hell go start your own organization! But no one will do that.

Believe it or not it’s ok to not align with them 100% and still see the good in it.... this is just the new school version of rod snd gun clubs that don’t exist anymore. Believe it or not, it’s actually pretty ok to get together with like minded folks over a beer. From the sounds of some of the bitter folks here, you could probably afford to do it more yourselves....

 

[HoneyDew]

Sorry. I wasn't implying anyone had called me names. Poorly worded on my part. Was just predicting responses. No I've never looked at their financials. But to be honest, I've never looked at anyone's financials other than my own. Feel free to educate me.

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Just looked because this thread got me curious. So unless I’m missing something basically almost all their revenue goes towards employees and very little directly towards “mission”.

https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/backcountryhunters/pages/5229/attachments/original/1605914247/2019-12-31_990_BH_A_-_PUBLIC.pdf?1605914247