Best Bush Knife?

[PlanoDano]

I have the 162 and it is a great knife but since you are carrying a hatchet I would recommend the Puukko or the Leuku in CPM-3v. You might look at some of the bark river knives in Elmax steel. I have not owned one but I hear Bark River has a great implementation of Elmax. Both CPM3v and ELmax will stand up to the occasional prying and gouging you might have to do.

 

[Trial153]

What does carbon content have to do with being stainless or not?

Depends on the total of the alloys composition. You can have high carbon to iron ratio with more than required minimum of chromium, so technically it would be stainless, yet have poor stain resistance. A good example of that is Dozier D2 with 1.5% carbon and 13 chromium.

 

[Lawnboi]

Steels I like that ride the line between stainless and carbon. Aebl, 3V, D2.

I personally have a much harder time sharpening most of the fancy stainless steels out there such as elmax, s35vn.

Of the 3 listed above my personal preferences for a woods knife is 3v or aebl, D2 is okay but my D2 knives dull as fast as the others and take a significant amount of work to get back to very sharp.

 

[sndmn11]

Depends on the total of the alloys composition. You can have high carbon to iron ratio with more than required minimum of chromium, so technically it would be stainless, yet have poor stain resistance. A good example of that is Dozier D2 with 1.5% carbon and 13 chromium.

I disagree that carbon content has anything to do with stain resistance.
Isn't it the chromium content that determines stainless or not, and sometimes nitrogen? https://www.spyderco.com/edge-u-cation/steel-elements/

Both of the steels below have a lot of carbon, but one is stainless and the other is not due to the chromium


These steels have very low amounts of carbon, but one is stainless and the other is not due to the chromium and nitrogen.

 

[Jagger0502]

Thanks for all the input fellas.

I am leaning towards the dozier knives after spending most of the night reading up on those. Any recommendations between these three? Or others that they make thatI should add to the list?

1. KS-7 wilderness
2. Pro guide knife
3. 2nd gen bushcraft

 

[Trial153]

Thanks for all the input fellas.

I am leaning towards the dozier knives after spending most of the night reading up on those. Any recommendations between these three? Or others that they make thatI should add to the list?

1. KS-7 wilderness
2. Pro guide knife
3. 2nd gen bushcraft

I owned a KS for short time, it was too much knife for me in general, specifically if breaking meat, that isnt on a hook is also on the adgenda its really really too much for me. If your just looking at chores and bushcraft...then maybe.

My proguide has done everything, moose, deer, elk, bear, caribou and everything i needed in camp or the back country. Anyplace i cant walk out easy in a day it comes with me.

The KS36 II is on my buy list as soon as shows up on featured inventory. I have modified personal that is similar, though slightly smaller. At almost 4" inches the K36 should serve niclely however it is significantly smaller then both the other choices.
Of the three i would go with the K3.

Another to look for is K19, along the same line

 

[Trial153]

I disagree that carbon content has anything to do with stain resistance.
Isn't it the chromium content that determines stainless or not, and sometimes nitrogen? https://www.spyderco.com/edge-u-cation/steel-elements/

Both of the steels below have a lot of carbon, but one is stainless and the other is not due to the chromium
View attachment 189594

These steels have very low amounts of carbon, but one is stainless and the other is not due to the chromium and nitrogen.
View attachment 189595

Sorry, I disagree. They arent mutually exclusive. While you have to have to have minimum of 10.5% chromium to be considered stainless the total make up of the alloy has to be taken into acvount.
Take D2, high carbon 1.4-1.7 with 11-14% chromium and its not stainless although it shows some stain resistant properties.
Now take 420HC that has .5 carbon amd the same about of chromium and it will be extremely stain resistant. You have to take the whole composition of the alloy into consideration

 

[eaglemountainman]

Grohmann #4? Nothing fancy, just a good serviceable knife at a very reasonable price. Available in SS or carbon, flat or sabre grind.

 

[sndmn11]

Sorry, I disagree. They arent mutually exclusive. While you have to have to have minimum of 10.5% chromium to be considered stainless the total make up of the alloy has to be taken into acvount.
Take D2, high carbon 1.4-1.7 with 11-14% chromium and its not stainless although it shows some stain resistant properties.
Now take 420HC that has .5 carbon amd the same about of chromium and it will be extremely stain resistant. You have to take the whole composition of the alloy into consideration

How does carbon contribute to corrosion resistance? I would be interested in reading your sources about that if you can link them. I have never come across any studies or publications that relate carbon content to stain and corrosion resistance.

 

[mtwarden]

I rarely carry an axe/hatchet anymore; larger knife is lighter AND it’s a knife

I carry a good folding saw (Silky) and with the two I can process firewood all day long, construct a shelter and anything short of building a cabin.

 

[Trial153]

How does carbon contribute to corrosion resistance? I would be interested in reading your sources about that if you can link them. I have never come across any studies or publications that relate carbon content to stain and corrosion resistance.

Carbon, LIBS, and The Difference Between L+H Steels

In this article we will discuss analyzing carbon in three of the four main types of steel alloys; carbon steel, low alloy steel, stainless steel – but not in tool steel at this time. Carbon steel is an alloy of iron and carbon. Low alloy steel includes carbon and small additions of other...

www.thermofisher.com

The World Steel Association states that there are more than 3,500 different grades of steel. There are hundreds of different grades of stainless steel on the market. Each of these unique formulations of stainless steel offer some degree of corrosion resistance above and beyond that of plain carbon steel and low alloy steel.
Carbon is a key element in all these three types of steel. It is added at various levels from 0.005% to 1.2% depending upon the qualities needed for specific uses and applications. In carbon steels the element carbon is typically the only addition, while in low alloy and stainless steels other elements are added in a range of concentrations to impart various properties as needed for the intended use.
Some of the qualities that carbon imparts, depending on amount added, are: degree of weldability, hardness, corrosion resistance, tensile strength, ductility and many more physical properties depending on the combination of other elements. The lack of correct levels of carbon can result in alloy creep and stress rupture, weld decay, Intergranular corrosion and hydrogen stress cracking. Carbon acts as a hardening agent, preventing dislocations in the iron atom crystal lattice from sliding past one another. Although increasing carbon content improves hardness, it also increases brittleness and reduces weldability (above 0.25% C). When the carbon content increases, yield point and tensile strength increase, but the plasticity/ductility is reduced. High carbon content also reduces the air corrosion resistance of steel; in field environments rusting may result.

 

[Akicita]

So I am in the market for a new bush knife. Wanted to get some opinions on practical and actual uses. I will list some thoughts and go ahead and tell me if I am on the right track or in left field. This knife will be used on a drop solo survival trip where min gear is taken, it will be the only carry knife along with an ax/hatchet so little baton will be done with it. Currently I am using the benchmade saddle mountain, which is a fine knife just not as heavy duty as most bush knives. (I am partial to benchmade but open to any knives)

1. Planning to go with stainless Steel
2. 4.5-5.5 inch blade
3. Leather sheath
4. Using as a solo knife for “survival” purposes would need to be used for all tasks including breaking down game and fish
5. Will be used with a ferro rod - (planning on using SS and understand carbon is better suited, is it worth the maintenance of carbon?)
6. Will not have a knife sharpener - in this case would carbon trump SS?

Now I have looked into a few. I can get a good deal on the benchmade 162 bushcrafter which has good reviews but only in small circles. open to others if you have proven them in the field.

Let me know what you have used, likes dislikes and opinions. Figure price isn’t an issue, I want a knife of high quality as I will be relying heavily on its performance.

KA-BAR Becker BK7 or BK10 - I prefer the BK7. I have trusted my life to Becker knives for all of my backcountry hunting, mountaineering and survival since 2008, and have relied on KA-BAR knives all my life. I keep mine in a Kydex sheath and always carry a Trend Diamond credit card stone.

 

[Desk Jockey]

ESEE 4, 6 or laser strike are worth looking into. Proven bush blades. I have all three and love them. I would say stay away from the 5 though. It was designed for a military contract and too thick and heavy for my tastes.

winkler field knife is another one but $$$

 

[sndmn11]

Some of the qualities that carbon imparts, depending on amount added, are: degree of weldability, hardness, corrosion resistance, tensile strength, ductility and many more physical properties depending on the combination of other elements.

The link is talking about what carbon brings to iron, it doesn't talk about a level of carbon composition that once achieved equates to a stainless material. If that were the case, there would be a point higher content carbon alloys with lower chromium content would surpass D2 in stain resistance....there isn't.

These links will explain a lot better.

Carbon vs Stainless Steel in Knives - Knife Steel Nerds

Thanks to Matt Davidson and Barton Smith for becoming Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! I put in the order for the small impact tester for knife edges. The purchase of the impact tester was decided by Patreon voting members and purchased with money from Patreon supporters. Thanks to A.G...

knifesteelnerds.com

In fact, your belief is backwards. Earlier you mentioned D2 and 420 having similar amount of chromium, but 420 is regarded as being more stainless.

Sorry, I disagree. They arent mutually exclusive. While you have to have to have minimum of 10.5% chromium to be considered stainless the total make up of the alloy has to be taken into acvount.
Take D2, high carbon 1.4-1.7 with 11-14% chromium and its not stainless although it shows some stain resistant properties.
Now take 420HC that has .5 carbon amd the same about of chromium and it will be extremely stain resistant. You have to take the whole composition of the alloy into consideration

420 is more stainless because it has LESS carbon content. You were correct in stating a need to look at the whole alloy, bit you were backwards in your conclusion. With LESS carbon, similar amounts of chromium composition will yield more corrosion resistance because it will plate rather than form carbides with the carbon.

"Because D2 has ~11-12% chromium it is sometimes called a “semi-stainless” since it is assumed that with such a high chromium content that it must be very close to being stainless. However, because of its high carbon content (1.55%) a good portion of that chromium is tied up in carbides rather than being in solution where it can contribute to forming the passive film."

How Much More Chromium Does D2 Need to be Stainless? - Knife Steel Nerds

Thanks to Devon Craun for becoming a Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporter! Your support is funding knife steel research. Some materials like aluminum form a passive oxide layer that prevents further corrosion. Steel is not one of those materials. Instead, steel forms iron oxide, or rust, that...

knifesteelnerds.com

That link is a really good read, and that website is a fantastic place to need out. Enjoy!

 

[CCH]

Not a knife reco -- although I do like my Saddle Mountain for a lightweight hunting/EDC knife, but I quit worrying about using a knife with a ferro rod a long time ago. A chunk of old hacksaw blade weighs almost nothing and puts out more sparks than any knife spine.

 

[Jagger0502]

Not a knife reco -- although I do like my Saddle Mountain for a lightweight hunting/EDC knife, but I quit worrying about using a knife with a ferro rod a long time ago. A chunk of old hacksaw blade weighs almost nothing and puts out more sparks than any knife spine.

Yes, my saddle mountain is my primary knife when I go hunting. It is hard to beat to break down big game. Just a little light for a true bush knife IMO.

 

[mcseal2]

I have the Dozier wilderness and the pro guide. I’m really liking the Pro Guide for a hunting knife. It’s hollow ground though and not what I’d pick for possible batoning. It’s a stout knife and would probably fine, but it’s expensive enough I’m not going to beat on it unless its a survival situation

The wilderness has a thicker edge and is tougher. I have abused mine a little but I have not owned it long enough to do to much. My biggest critique for a single knife option would be the tip. Its not a great tip shape for drilling or similar tasks.

The benchmade 162 would work. Its a tough knife. I’ve been hard on mine and it takes it well. It isn’t a favorite knife for me. I have others better at any one task, but it’s a good and tough blade.

Bark River in 3V are very nice blades. The Bravo LT Hunter is similar to the 162 but feels better to me. Only downside is field sharpening of a convex blade. I’m not the best at it. That’s a primary reason my Dozier Pro Guide has replaced my Bark River classic clip point hunter for a lot of my hunts.

My pick for a single knife would be the Pathfinder Scout. Mine is a Blind Horse but it’s the same knife as a current Battle Horse model, the Scout Platoon. My older one came with a Kydex sheath. It’s a bigger knife capable of big knife jobs, but feels smaller and more nimble in use.

Hope that helps.

 

[Jagger0502]

Thanks for all the input fellas. I just ordered a Dozier KS-3. 3 year waiting list though.... so in three years I will let you know how I like it!

 

[Trial153]

Thanks for all the input fellas. I just ordered a Dozier KS-3. 3 year waiting list though.... so in three years I will let you know how I like it!

They turn up pretty often on the secondary market, Ebay, blade forum ect. Also watch his featured inventory. If you see one grab it, you can always change your standing order to something else.

 

[mcseal2]

Both my Doziers were bought used from Ebay.