Best breed for big game hunting companion.

[gbflyer]

This was my first thought as well, out here I usually hear them referred to just as cow dogs, or Australian Heelers. But yeah, some of the smartest and most agile dogs I've ever seen, and as working cattle dogs they understand protecting and alerting on predators as much as herding, and they are extremely in-tune with their owners.

Only 2 problems I've ever seen with them. The first is they very much tend to be one-person dogs - if you're not their owner, they're kind of "F you" if you try to command them, quite often. I'm sure it can be trained to be minimal, but they aren't the best family dogs because of that - not like a lab. It's more of a limitation, than a problem, if you're cognizant of it. The other problem is they're high-energy and need to be worked, and are best with a lot of outside time, or they'll get pretty squirrely at home. Especially with kids around and a wife they may be a little inclined to not be as obedient to.

These are generalities, of course, and good training and being a good owner can minimize or leverage any of this. But yeah, first thought I had about what kind of dog I'd want in bear country, watching my back, is an Australian Heeler.

That has been my understanding as well. However, I had (passed tragically) a friend who must have been the Heeler Whisperer, Lol. I don’t know if he was that good, had a great breeder, or was lucky in the order. Guy could get them to do anything and they would for anyone else too.

The ones I grew up around that the cowboys had were generally as you described. Pound for pound the toughest animal I’ve ever seen. Take a kick from a 2000# bull then turn around and put him right through a 5 wire fence.

 

[cmeadors13]

i got a bloodhound

 

[EdP]

It is for good reason that folks that hunt bears with dogs have a pack of dogs, not just one, and they loose dogs to the bears. A single dog stands little chance against a bear.

I also don't think that protecting your dog would be an adequate excuse for shooting an "endangered species." You would have to wait for the bear to kill your dog and then come after you. I suspect the bear your dog chased was running from you, not the dog.

 

[Hoghead]

I'd have to disagree with this, yes it makes the training "easier" but when it translates to the real world, it can lead to the dog not listening when he's fresh. I want my dog to listen when he's high strung and potentially easily distracted.

I would say that if you get on a consistent training regiment, you can work through some of the issues you may have with him. I use the Team Dog training program and has been really good for my and my Malinois. Hoping next year he will be going on some hunting trips, although my wife does like the security of having him at home when I am gone, though she doesn't like how high strung he is when I'm not here giving him his exercise and work.

I do that mostly with puppies in the beginning. To keep their attention. I do train them when they are fresh after basic obedience is good. I don't get crazy with commands. I just want them to hunt and not be a pain in the but.

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[gbflyer]

It is for good reason that folks that hunt bears with dogs have a pack of dogs, not just one, and they loose dogs to the bears. A single dog stands little chance against a bear.

I also don't think that protecting your dog would be an adequate excuse for shooting an "endangered species." You would have to wait for the bear to kill your dog and then come after you. I suspect the bear your dog chased was running from you, not the dog.

We have our share of bears in the backyard. Don’t hunt them with dogs however. I’ve never seen one stand up to a barking dog of any breed, including ankle nippers. Bears don’t like dogs. Now a wolf, it will take Fifi right out off the lawn in its mouth with you watching.

 

[RockAndSage]

It is for good reason that folks that hunt bears with dogs have a pack of dogs, not just one. A single dog stands little chance against a bear.

I also don't think that protecting your dog would be an adequate excuse for shooting an "endangered species." You would have to wait for the bear to kill your dog and then come after you. I suspect the bear your dog chased was running from you, not the dog.

Unless a specific state prohibits it, it's my understanding that if grizzly, cougar, or wolves are attacking livestock (and pets are considered property akin to livestock), it's entirely legal to use lethal force to stop the predator. With people, fear of "imminent attack" is the trigger, in protecting self or others.

 

[mntnguide]

It is for good reason that folks that hunt bears with dogs have a pack of dogs, not just one, and they loose dogs to the bears. A single dog stands little chance against a bear.

I also don't think that protecting your dog would be an adequate excuse for shooting an "endangered species." You would have to wait for the bear to kill your dog and then come after you. I suspect the bear your dog chased was running from you, not the dog.

Do you run hounds, or just making a blanket statement? The reason you dump a box of dogs on bears, is because a bear will just run and walk away from a single dog all day long, whereas a pack of dogs can get a bear to go up a tree, or bay up. And when a pack of dogs catches one on the ground, thats when a dog can get torn up cause the bear is forced to fight.

The point is not to have my dog attack a grizzly, the point is to get the grizzly to go the other way, which works plenty well with a single 40lb dog, something i know from experience. As for shooting a bear thats attacking my dog, if the bear is close enough to attack my dog, my life is also in danger, no warden is gonna argue otherwise about that. The wardens out here, are just as sick of grizzlies as the rest of us

 

[grfox92]

It is for good reason that folks that hunt bears with dogs have a pack of dogs, not just one, and they loose dogs to the bears. A single dog stands little chance against a bear.

I also don't think that protecting your dog would be an adequate excuse for shooting an "endangered species." You would have to wait for the bear to kill your dog and then come after you. I suspect the bear your dog chased was running from you, not the dog.

Im under no delusions that any domestic dog is not going to defeat a grizzly bear. Thats not why hes there. The dog is there to create a barrier of protection between me and the bear. Allowing me to get home to my wife and 4 kids in the event of the worst case scenario.

That bear could have taken 1 swipe of his paw and killed my dog. They were that close. To insinuate the non stop barking in his face didn't deter him from trying something I believe is wrong. Not that the bear is afraid of losing a fight to the dog, they just dont want to deal with the hassle.

If im standing 5 feet from a bear and hes tearing apart my dog, my life is in imminent danger and I am shooting or spraying the shit out of that bear. Im not sure at what point im supposed to shoot a bear if hes within 5 to 10 feet of me attacking my dog.

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[RockAndSage]

Im not sure at what point im supposed to shoot a bear if hes within 5 to 10 feet of me attacking my dog.

I'd probably defer to the Tueller Drill on that one. Five to ten feet is one step/lunge and a swipe to your face. Not to mention that the speed of sudden hurtling violence with a grizzly is just faster that what a human is capable of.

 

[grfox92]

I'd probably defer to the Tueller Drill on that one. Five to ten feet is one step/lunge and a swipe to your face. Not to mention that the speed of sudden hurtling violence with a grizzly is just faster that what a human is capable of.

Thats what I was trying to insinuate. Anything passed 20 yards moving in my direction, the shooting starts.

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[jolemons]

So is my wife correct when she says hes a dumbass? Shoot me a PM with that breeder.

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Pm sent

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[6.5Express]

I have a few dogs and recreate in nw wyoming year round. My best dog is a border collie / blue heeler. We got her at about 9 months old from the shelter and the first trip out she ran a sow and cub off that we probably would've rode right into without her. She has run multiple bears off that we would have otherwise rode on to or were coming in while we were glassing including a boar grizzly that snuck in on 2 of my kids and I while glassing for black bears. She made him leave a trail of pee in the middle of the trail as he ran off. She's a great family dog as well. I spend nearly all my time in grizzly country with all or some of my 3 young boys with me as well and it is a very rare occurrence she is not with us. If we sit on a knob to glass, she's watching our back at all times. Quiet but very alert.

We also have a black mouth/mt cur. She can get dang nasty but is a little less predictable. Definitely high energy and may bark more often when not necessary than the border/heeler. She's small but has flat whooped dogs more than twice her size easy. She comes with us horn hunting and on summer pack trips but haven't taken her hunting. I just can't put as much trust in her as I can the other.

My old dog (15 next month) is a cow dog mix similar to a hanging tree. She was mean and chased bears when she was younger but she hasn't gone to the hills in several years now.

 

[6.5Express]

I have a few dogs and recreate in nw wyoming year round. My best dog is a border collie / blue heeler. We got her at about 9 months old from the shelter and the first trip out she ran a sow and cub off that we probably would've rode right into without her. She has run multiple bears off that we would have otherwise rode on to or were coming in while we were glassing including a boar grizzly that snuck in on 2 of my kids and I while glassing for black bears. She made him leave a trail of pee in the middle of the trail as he ran off. She's a great family dog as well. I spend nearly all my time in grizzly country with all or some of my 3 young boys with me as well and it is a very rare occurrence she is not with us. If we sit on a knob to glass, she's watching our back at all times. Quiet but very alert

We also have a black mouth/mt cur. She can get dang nasty but is a little less predictable. Definitely high energy and may bark more often when not necessary than the border/heeler. She's small but has flat whooped dogs more than twice her size easy. She comes with us horn hunting and on summer pack trips but haven't taken her hunting. I just can't put as much trust in her as I do the border / heeler.

My old dog (15 next month) is a cow dog mix similar to a hanging tree. She was onry and chased bears off when she was younger but hasn't been to the hills in several years now.

 

[6.5Express]

I could see some dogs antagonizing the wrong bear and then getting scared and running back to their owner with the bear in tow, but I do not consider that with mine. Id rather know the bear is near before I would otherwise and have some help in running them off as opposed to alarming it close by without a dog.

 

[Jason Snyder]

@RockAndSage I’m not sure how much I have to add to this. The only dog on this list I’ve owned was a blue heeler in college. Awesome dog. Smart as heck and he went a ton of places in the Bob Marshall with me.

I have Drahthaars, which are fearless and loyal dogs with a very good off switch. But, the OP isn’t looking for what they really bring to the table. They are incredible watch dogs and there is absolutely zero percent chance a bear, lion or wolf is getting anywhere close without an alert. They stay at heel the entire time I’m big game hunting. I don’t let them screw off unless we are at a creek or something. Other than that it’s right by/behind me, even with both.

Litter mates are a bad idea for the reasons stated. My dogs are five years apart. The youngest is a screw off. The older much more business like.

As to the barking, I would put an e collar on the dog and work on down stays within visual. Once this is down, move out of sight and use correction for any movement or any noise. A partner is invaluable for this. Be consistent. I rarely ever tie my dogs. Just down stay and they better be there when I get back.

Any dog worth its salt in terms of desire is going to be high energy. That’s life. It isn’t that hard to take them for a hike daily and spend 10 minutes with obedience training. But, they also need the mental stability to lay on their bed and not be a nuisance.

Quick story about alerts from dogs. I was in WY hunting elk. One of my buddy’s friends stopped by on their way in to check a wolf hide. I wanted to see it so he got it out and we unrolled it. I was upwind of the dogs with a pickup and a wall tent between me and the dogs. They both absolutely lost their marbles.

The look on both of their faces made me think they’d bite anyone or anything within 10 feet. My female was barking her head off angry. My male was just braced up ready to go to war. It was really interesting to see the scent response.

 

[RockAndSage]

@RockAndSage I’m not sure how much I have to add to this. The only dog on this list I’ve owned was a blue heeler in college. Awesome dog. Smart as heck and he went a ton of places in the Bob Marshall with me.

I have Drahthaars, which are fearless and loyal dogs with a very good off switch. But, the OP isn’t looking for what they really bring to the table. They are incredible watch dogs and there is absolutely zero percent chance a bear, lion or wolf is getting anywhere close without an alert. They stay at heel the entire time I’m big game hunting. I don’t let them screw off unless we are at a creek or something. Other than that it’s right by/behind me, even with both.

Litter mates are a bad idea for the reasons stated. My dogs are five years apart. The youngest is a screw off. The older much more business like.

As to the barking, I would put an e collar on the dog and work on down stays within visual. Once this is down, move out of sight and use correction for any movement or any noise. A partner is invaluable for this. Be consistent. I rarely ever tie my dogs. Just down stay and they better be there when I get back.

Any dog worth its salt in terms of desire is going to be high energy. That’s life. It isn’t that hard to take them for a hike daily and spend 10 minutes with obedience training. But, they also need the mental stability to lay on their bed and not be a nuisance.

Quick story about alerts from dogs. I was in WY hunting elk. One of my buddy’s friends stopped by on their way in to check a wolf hide. I wanted to see it so he got it out and we unrolled it. I was upwind of the dogs with a pickup and a wall tent between me and the dogs. They both absolutely lost their marbles.

The look on both of their faces made me think they’d bite anyone or anything within 10 feet. My female was barking her head off angry. My male was just braced up ready to go to war. It was really interesting to see the scent response.

It's great stuff, thank you for sharing. Pretty much every time you comment about dogs, I learn something.

 

[grfox92]

@RockAndSage I’m not sure how much I have to add to this. The only dog on this list I’ve owned was a blue heeler in college. Awesome dog. Smart as heck and he went a ton of places in the Bob Marshall with me.

I have Drahthaars, which are fearless and loyal dogs with a very good off switch. But, the OP isn’t looking for what they really bring to the table. They are incredible watch dogs and there is absolutely zero percent chance a bear, lion or wolf is getting anywhere close without an alert. They stay at heel the entire time I’m big game hunting. I don’t let them screw off unless we are at a creek or something. Other than that it’s right by/behind me, even with both.

Litter mates are a bad idea for the reasons stated. My dogs are five years apart. The youngest is a screw off. The older much more business like.

As to the barking, I would put an e collar on the dog and work on down stays within visual. Once this is down, move out of sight and use correction for any movement or any noise. A partner is invaluable for this. Be consistent. I rarely ever tie my dogs. Just down stay and they better be there when I get back.

Any dog worth its salt in terms of desire is going to be high energy. That’s life. It isn’t that hard to take them for a hike daily and spend 10 minutes with obedience training. But, they also need the mental stability to lay on their bed and not be a nuisance.

Quick story about alerts from dogs. I was in WY hunting elk. One of my buddy’s friends stopped by on their way in to check a wolf hide. I wanted to see it so he got it out and we unrolled it. I was upwind of the dogs with a pickup and a wall tent between me and the dogs. They both absolutely lost their marbles.

The look on both of their faces made me think they’d bite anyone or anything within 10 feet. My female was barking her head off angry. My male was just braced up ready to go to war. It was really interesting to see the scent response.

Any good resource for training? I am completely clueless and would need to be shown how to train like a toddler. We've trained our dogs to sit and go to the bathroom outdoors lol. Thats the extent of my abilities.

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[Jason Snyder]

Any good resource for training? I am completely clueless and would need to be shown how to train like a toddler. We've trained our dogs to sit and go to the bathroom outdoors lol. Thats the extent of my abilities.

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Don’t Shoot the Dog is a good read on marker training. I start with marker and positive reward training with pups. By 6-8 months I am collar conditioning them and starting to use a combination of rewards and negative reinforcement.