Berger 156 @ 3050' +/- with 20-22" barrel

[jk_minn]

The title is the goal. The cartridges I am looking at right now are:

1) SAUM IMP
2) WSM
3) MAX

Any one able to confirm if 3050ish FPS is doable with the 156 Berger in the cartridges listed, and a 20-22" barrel? Would like to stick to ADG/Lapua brass. Have thought about the 6.5 - 7 PRC IMP that UM is doing, but I feel the ones listed are overbore enough - but maybe that is what is needed? Also, would like to avoid doing +P...

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[260shooter]

I have a 6.5/7 PRC with a 22" barrel. I'm getting 3100 fps with 147 ELD-M"s and H1000. When weather warms a little I'm going to work with the 156"s and Ramshot Grand powder. Pretty sure it's doable. I'll let you know what I find out.

 

[Pharmseller]

Tikka Veil something, it’s my brother’s but I’m the loader. 6.5 PRC, 2934 fps using R26 and 156 EOL.

Edit to ask, what’s the practical difference (not absolute, we can do math) between 3050 and 2934? What does 116 fps get you?





P

 

[Thejet]

You can get there with a normal 6.5 saum

 

[Mike D Texas]

I can confirm it is achievable in a 6.5 SAUM Improved with H1000 and 21” barrel as long as it is throated properly and not seated too deep in the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[sniper20]

Can I ask why you are wanting to get a certain velocity? An accurate 2950FPS is better than an inaccurate 3100FPS load. I have a 6.5PRC, shooting 59.0gr of N570 getting 2950FPS out of a 24" Browning barrel. If I shoot it enough, I might be able to loosen it up and get up to 3000FPS, but I doubt much more. I could press it faster, but accuracy goes down the drain. I would rather hit slow than miss fast.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I'm doing 6.5 WSM. My goal is to hit as close as I can to 3,000 MV in a 20" barrel with the 147 ELDM if possible, and this is to reduce overall length with my suppressor. I have an 18" 7-08 and a 22" 25-284, and my can is 7.3". The 7-08 handles noticeable better than the 22" rifle with the can attached. So, the shorter the better for me and you can't get there with the 6.5 PRC.

From a reloading perpective, making brass for the 6.5 WSM is a simple one step neck down from 270 WSM brass.

I'm getting a Tikka 6.5 PRC donor rifle and will swap out with L mags if I can't get 3.094" COL. My 6.5 PRC barrel is at the smith getting rechambered in 6.5 WSM, and the donor rifle barrel will be next. I've read barrel life isn't great, so it will be good to have another one laying around, and once I'm finished with load dev, I'll be able to determine how much I can cut off from the factory 24.3".

For all intents and purposes, I agree the 6.5 PRC is the easy button, but I like the process and doing something a little different.

 

[inkedspot]

My 156 load in a 24” 6.5 SAUM was 3000 fps with H1000 and it was too spicy in warm or warm wet weather.

They were very effective, just too hot for my particular rifle. I would’ve needed to back off to closer to 2900 with the 156 to be safe in all conditions

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

My 156 load in a 24” 6.5 SAUM was 3000 fps with H1000 and it was too spicy in warm or warm wet weather.

They were very effective, just too hot for my particular rifle. I would’ve needed to back off to closer to 2900 with the 156 to be safe in all conditions

Roger that and with more usable case capacity, the 6.5 WSM can get you there easier, especially in a 24" barrel if not looking to run a shorter barrel.

 

[Rugger7622]

I've got a 25" barrel, H1000, what do you think the load would have to be to be above or at 3K?

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I've got a 25" barrel, H1000, what do you think the load would have to be to be above or at 3K?

For the 147 EDLM in the 6.5 WSM? According to Gordon's, which has medium-low calibration (accuracy) for H1000, 68.5 grains would get approximately 3,052 MV at around 53,700 PSI. That's with predicted 100% case fill at 3.094" COL. From a pressure standpoint, you'd have a long ways to go, and you could push it further depending on how much H1000 you could stuff in the case.

Based on guys success with H1000 in the PRC and SAUM, I plan to test H1000 when my build is finished. I'm getting 2,828 MV in my 22" 25-284 with 54.5 grains of H1000 and 134 ELDM for comparison.

70 grains of N565 theoretically delivers 3,195 MV at around 62,284 PSI with 99.6% case fill in a 25" tube.

 

[Rugger7622]

I found locally (private seller) some RL26, I bought 4 pounds of it to try out along with the H1000

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

In a 25" barrel with the 147 ELDM, 69 grains of RL26 theoretically delivers 3,223 MV at 63,621 PSI, right under max pressure. Load ratio is 93.8% with 100% burn.

Gordon's calibration/accuracy with RL26 is medium, so YMMV.

 

[jk_minn]

Can I ask why you are wanting to get a certain velocity? An accurate 2950FPS is better than an inaccurate 3100FPS load. I have a 6.5PRC, shooting 59.0gr of N570 getting 2950FPS out of a 24" Browning barrel. If I shoot it enough, I might be able to loosen it up and get up to 3000FPS, but I doubt much more. I could press it faster, but accuracy goes down the drain. I would rather hit slow than miss fast.

No trying to get to a certain velocity - hence why I said 3000 plus or minus. Really the goal is to still be in that 1800 feet per second velocity at 1000 ish yards. Yes you can get close with a regular SAUM/6.5 PRC, but I would rather do it with a larger case in which I don't have to push the limits.

 

[jk_minn]

Well I just had UPS drop off the following:
- ADG 270 WSM Brass
- A pile of 156 Bergers
- SAC 6.5-300 WSM Sizing Die
- K&M Neck Turning kit

Going to make a few 6.5 WSM dummy rounds for the gunsmith to send of to Manson to get a reamer made. Just need to decide on 20 vs 22" barrel ....

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Well I just had UPS drop off the following:
- ADG 270 WSM Brass
- A pile of 156 Bergers
- SAC 6.5-300 WSM Sizing Die
- K&M Neck Turning kit

Going to make a few 6.5 WSM dummy rounds for the gunsmith to send of to Manson to get a reamer made. Just need to decide on 20 vs 22" barrel ....

Start with 22" and check velocity once you find a load that shoots well. You can always cut some off, but you can't add it back.

 

[huntnful]

Well I just had UPS drop off the following:
- ADG 270 WSM Brass
- A pile of 156 Bergers
- SAC 6.5-300 WSM Sizing Die
- K&M Neck Turning kit

Going to make a few 6.5 WSM dummy rounds for the gunsmith to send of to Manson to get a reamer made. Just need to decide on 20 vs 22" barrel ....

Awesome!! I’d go 22”. Extra 50-60fps to ensure your goal and you won’t notice it in the field.

I see most people were shooting H1000 in the info you got. I think a 156 would create an enough pressure that you could use N570 and be right near a full case. In all the cases I've tested, if you can fit a full charge of N570 it produces about 100fps faster velocities than H1000. I don't really like N570 in the bigger cartridges paired with small bores. BUT if velocity is the main goal, it normally shoots great, has low ES and absolutely gives you velocity.

I just bought a 21” 6.5-7PRC. I was just going to shoot 140 hybrids to try and keep the speeds up with H1000 or N565

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

N560-N570 are all worthy of a try alongside H1000. I've also seen guys getting good MV with Magpro and Retumbo. Find one that you can source local reliably that isn't too big a compromise.

 

[ReaptheHeat]

I'm at 2920 with a 22" barrel and Retumbo running ADG brass on a regular SAUM.

I feel 3000 is extra spicy in a 22".

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Well I just had UPS drop off the following:
- ADG 270 WSM Brass
- A pile of 156 Bergers
- SAC 6.5-300 WSM Sizing Die
- K&M Neck Turning kit

Going to make a few 6.5 WSM dummy rounds for the gunsmith to send of to Manson to get a reamer made. Just need to decide on 20 vs 22" barrel ....

Gordon's doesn't have the 156, but it does list a 153 Hornady A-tip. Theoretically, you can get 3,044 MV @63,428psi (MAX) with 69 grains of N565 in a 22" tube. That's with 99% case fill and 100% burn. YMMV with the 156 and other powders.

I found some old 6.5-284 videos on YT from the Best of the West guys. 6 years ago they were smashing antelope, mulies, and elk out to 700+ yards with the 143 ELDX. The 6.5 WSM will have significantly more juice.