Ball of Foot Soreness with Boots. Daily wear Zero Drop/Wide Toe Box

[PSDBowhunter]

I've seen some similar threads on fitment issues with more of a mountaineering boot and some threads on zero drop/wide toe box shoes and boots. I'm looking for some additional insight on my specific situation and wanted to see if anyone could shed some light on it for me.

First off, I have been trail running exclusively in Altra shoes for close to 10 years. In addition to that I have only worn zero drop/wide toe box shoes for daily use (Altra and Lems) for the past 7 or so years.

Being on here and listening to several podcasts over the years I wanted to have a good boot to use for backpacking, hunting, and hiking. I started with a Lowa Renegade and used them on a six day backpacking trip after breaking them in. The boots were okay, but I would get pain in the balls of my feet that made them pretty uncomfortable. I tried the super feet hike support (the ones with the topography lines) and they helped a little, but the pain was still there after a couple miles. I then tried a pair of Schnee Timberlines. Loved the quality and feel of this boot, but experienced the same thing with them after a few miles of hiking.

In contrast, I've had Lone Peak hikers as well as most recently a pair of Topo Trailventure (5mm drop, but still has wide toe box), and I never get the soreness/pain in the balls of my feet with those.

I'm thinking that the combination of a narrow toe box and the larger heel to toe drops of the traditional boots are causing the pain.

My questions are:
1. Is there anything I can do different to make more of a mountaineering boot work for me (i.e. lacing techniques, stretching the leather, etc.)?
2. Am I better off just sticking with the light boots from Altra, Topo, Vivo, etc.?
3. Do I need to try more boots to find the right one?

 

[juju]

I found both of those brands to be too narrow. You probably know that if you do your testing indoors, then you can return boots. Calling the company helps with selection.

 

[rookieforever33]

Nothing beats trying different boots yourself. Keep a log of each including design difference in each. Hopefully you can find a boot/insole combo without breaking the bank. Everyones feet are unique. Good luck finding a good pair for you.

 

[fngTony]

You didn’t mention this but maybe it’s part of your issue, is your heel staying locked in? Asking because if you’re used to a zero or nero drop then get into a traditional drop you’re putting more weight on the ball. A slipping heel will add to that. Have you had someone watch your stride and striking point with both types, I bet that’s different and changing the mechanics of everything.

 

[PSDBowhunter]

I found both of those brands to be too narrow. You probably know that if you do your testing indoors, then you can return boots. Calling the company helps with selection.

Interesting. That very well may be the case based on the last that they use. When you say too narrow do you mean in the toe box or throughout the whole boot? I will say that I have a skinny foot and I like it tight across the middle of my foot. I just like having room for my toes as well.

Nothing beats trying different boots yourself. Keep a log of each including design difference in each. Hopefully you can find a boot/insole combo without breaking the bank. Everyones feet are unique. Good luck finding a good pair for you.

For sure. It also changes as you break them in. I really wanted the Timberlines to be the boot for me as they were very comfortable right off the bat. They felt great on some mountain hikes in PA here until I started getting a few miles in.

You didn’t mention this but maybe it’s part of your issue, is your heel staying locked in? Asking because if you’re used to a zero or nero drop then get into a traditional drop you’re putting more weight on the ball. A slipping heel will add to that. Have you had someone watch your stride and striking point with both types, I bet that’s different and changing the mechanics of everything.

That is a really good question. I can't say that I feel any heel slip, but I've never had anyone watch my gait. I should mention that I do have pretty high arches. I don't know what the heel to toe drop is on the Timberlines, but I'm assuming all of this is more of a mechanical issue and the force on the ball of my foot. Hence why I don't get the issue with low to zero drop shoes.

 

[HighCountryDreamin]

I've seen some similar threads on fitment issues with more of a mountaineering boot and some threads on zero drop/wide toe box shoes and boots. I'm looking for some additional insight on my specific situation and wanted to see if anyone could shed some light on it for me.

First off, I have been trail running exclusively in Altra shoes for close to 10 years. In addition to that I have only worn zero drop/wide toe box shoes for daily use (Altra and Lems) for the past 7 or so years.

Being on here and listening to several podcasts over the years I wanted to have a good boot to use for backpacking, hunting, and hiking. I started with a Lowa Renegade and used them on a six day backpacking trip after breaking them in. The boots were okay, but I would get pain in the balls of my feet that made them pretty uncomfortable. I tried the super feet hike support (the ones with the topography lines) and they helped a little, but the pain was still there after a couple miles. I then tried a pair of Schnee Timberlines. Loved the quality and feel of this boot, but experienced the same thing with them after a few miles of hiking.

In contrast, I've had Lone Peak hikers as well as most recently a pair of Topo Trailventure (5mm drop, but still has wide toe box), and I never get the soreness/pain in the balls of my feet with those.

I'm thinking that the combination of a narrow toe box and the larger heel to toe drops of the traditional boots are causing the pain.

My questions are:
1. Is there anything I can do different to make more of a mountaineering boot work for me (i.e. lacing techniques, stretching the leather, etc.)?
2. Am I better off just sticking with the light boots from Altra, Topo, Vivo, etc.?
3. Do I need to try more boots to find the right one?

I've got a pair of the Crispi guides in EE and after some breaking in they work great for me. Pricey but I have issues with boots without a wide toe box. Early season hiking and light hunting...salomon XA's are the ticket!

 

[fngTony]

That is a really good question. I can't say that I feel any heel slip, but I've never had anyone watch my gait. I should mention that I do have pretty high arches. I don't know what the heel to toe drop is on the Timberlines, but I'm assuming all of this is more of a mechanical issue and the force on the ball of my foot. Hence why I don't get the issue with low to zero drop shoes.

Ya a high arch will help keep your heel from going forward if the insole is shaped to hold it. If your heel moves up (in the direction of leaving the boot) but not forward it creates an angle similar to a higher drop. If you’re used to zero and get into a 8mm drop then a little heel lift can make it closer to 12.

 

[PSDBowhunter]

Ya a high arch will help keep your heel from going forward if the insole is shaped to hold it. If your heel moves up (in the direction of leaving the boot) but not forward it creates an angle similar to a higher drop. If you’re used to zero and get into a 8mm drop then a little heel lift can make it closer to 12.

Any insoles to help that or is that going to come down to boot construction?

I do run the Super feet Hiker insoles in the Timberlines as well.

I started off thinking this may have been a toe box issue, but now you have me thinking more along the lines of too much drop. Especially if that heel is slipping like you mentioned. I'll have to do some testing.

 

[fngTony]

Any insoles to help that or is that going to come down to boot construction?

I do run the Super feet Hiker insoles in the Timberlines as well.

I started off thinking this may have been a toe box issue, but now you have me thinking more along the lines of too much drop. Especially if that heel is slipping like you mentioned. I'll have to do some testing.

I think it's a combination of everything. Some Salewa boots come with (or sold seperatly) their "multi fit" insoles. It's a two part system that you can use together or individually to fit more foot types. Trying on a pair with those is what made me realize I have a relatively narrow heel. I didn't buy the salewas but used what I learned to find boots to eliminate toe and ball pain. Also stay away from a ridiculously hard foot bed (Asolo Fugitive). A stiff shank is one thing but a boot shouldn't feel hard like being bare foot.

 

[Predator_SD]

My questions are:
1. Is there anything I can do different to make more of a mountaineering boot work for me (i.e. lacing techniques, stretching the leather, etc.)? Nope

2. Am I better off just sticking with the light boots from Altra, Topo, Vivo, etc.? Yep, absolutely! I wish i had STARTED with the boots you’re naming instead of destroying my feet in various Rokslide recommended stiff boots.

3. Do I need to try more boots to find the right one? Heck no! I went down that rabbit hole of “these stiff mountain boots hurt my feet so i’ll buy these other stiff mountain boots to fix it” All that does is continue to hurt your feet while draining your wallet!

You nailed it on the narrow toe box and high heel drop. It’s like walking around in high heels but with extremely stiff and hard footbeds that don’t give. Crispis are like walking around on a concrete floor barefoot all day. It’s a recipe for metatarsalalgia or Morton’s Neuroma. Those suck ask me how i know.

I’m going low (5 mm or less) heel drop and plush cushioning to help my feet while they slowly heel from years of abusing them. I’ll never buy another stiff mt boot personally. I’d stick with what was working for ya.

 

[PSDBowhunter]

You nailed it on the narrow toe box and high heel drop. It’s like walking around in high heels but with extremely stiff and hard footbeds that don’t give. Crispis are like walking around on a concrete floor barefoot all day. It’s a recipe for metatarsalalgia or Morton’s Neuroma. Those suck ask me how i know.

I’m going low (5 mm or less) heel drop and plush cushioning to help my feet while they slowly heel from years of abusing them. I’ll never buy another stiff mt boot personally. I’d stick with what was working for ya.

To be honest, the Topo Terraventures are the best boot that I've owned yet. Very plush and comfortable for all day hiking while being more durable than a Lone Peak Altra boot. I guess my biggest worry was messing up my feet with heavy pack weight and a soft/flexible boot.

I'll probably just go with what works for now, but just wanted to make sure I was missing something. No point in trying to force a round peg through a square hole.

 

[juju]

I tried wide widths of those brands for my wide forefeet and found them too narrow. Also I have high insteps and loathe pressure on the tops of my feet. So, my experience may not be helpful at all.

If you're over the hill, your issues may not be with boots per se. Adopt a daily stretching routine that includes your lower back. It may help if you have common neuropathy issues. Or you could be a twenty something yoga instructor slash "antivaxer" and again this may not be helpful at all.

 

[PSDBowhunter]

I tried wide widths of those brands for my wide forefeet and found them too narrow. Also I have high insteps and loathe pressure on the tops of my feet. So, my experience may not be helpful at all.

If you're over the hill, your issues may not be with boots per se. Adopt a daily stretching routine that includes your lower back. It may help if you have common neuropathy issues. Or you could be a twenty something yoga instructor slash "antivaxer" and again this may not be helpful at all.

I'm getting there. Mid 30's now, but still tell myself I feel younger.

I try to stay pretty active, but stretching has always been a struggle for me. Been working more at it over the last couple months.