Backpack Shootout - 9 Backpacks Go HEAD to HEAD ***Updated 8/5/2020***

[md126]

Find N Tines, Is the webbing upgraded on the whole pack or just the frame?

Also, please let us know how the new lumbar handles a heavy load.

Thanks

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

Find N Tines, Is the webbing upgraded on the whole pack or just the frame?

Also, please let us know how the new lumbar handles a heavy load.

Thanks

yes the entire pack, any place that they use webbing. It’s shiny and much smother through the buckles. I’m pretty sure it’s the extact same that Kifaru uses, if not looks and feels the same. Once I get a at least 60lb load on it and get it out for a hike I’ll report back on the lumbar.

pics show new webbing and Velcro added behind lumbar pad.

 

[JoshOR]

Great info! Much appreciated, thank you!

 

[Dunky]

looking forward to what you think after you put some weight in it.

 

[DJB]

Thanks for the review it was very helpful. When will the individual pack reviews be up on your site?

 

[JNDEER]

yes the entire pack, any place that they use webbing. It’s shiny and much smother through the buckles. I’m pretty sure it’s the extact same that Kifaru uses, if not looks and feels the same. Once I get a at least 60lb load on it and get it out for a hike I’ll report back on the lumbar.

pics show new webbing and Velcro added behind lumbar pad.
View attachment 263709View attachment 263710View attachment 263711View attachment 263712View attachment 263713

Thank you sir- that was much appreciated.

PLEASE report back after you give it a go on how you feel the lumbar pad feels compared to the first time.

My testing led me to believe it could be the belt and the pad leaving to the movement of felt "slipping" that Zach felt. I say the belt too because I have zeo slipping on my K2, but when i put the K3 belt on the K2 it has a little more wiggle with weight in the pack. Going to run the new belt for a while to see if the belt needs to get broke in.

PS - If you are looking to move up to Sacramento.... SMUD is just as expensive as PGE

 

[Zach Herold]

Thanks for the review it was very helpful. When will the individual pack reviews be up on your site?

I plan on getting them up on my channel in the next month or so.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

 

[DJB]

I plan on getting them up on my channel in the next month or so.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Thanks look forward to it!

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

yes the entire pack, any place that they use webbing. It’s shiny and much smother through the buckles. I’m pretty sure it’s the extact same that Kifaru uses, if not looks and feels the same. Once I get a at least 60lb load on it and get it out for a hike I’ll report back on the lumbar.

pics show new webbing and Velcro added behind lumbar pad.
View attachment 263709View attachment 263710View attachment 263711View attachment 263712View attachment 263713

Put 60 pound sand bag in the new K3 and hiked 2 miles. Initial impression is good. I had only one shim in the lumber and had no slipping. I would say it now feels a lot more like the k2. Huge improvement from original k3. Again I need more time and more weight to say this is it, but past first test. Note: last k3 slipped bad in first mile with same weight so I’m comparing apples to apples on this first 2 mile test.

What the fix did was lock in the lumbar pad from moving up and down. Zach showed it in part 1 with his hand how the lumbar pad would slide up and down about 1-1/2” - 2”.

If it continues to perform like it did it will be my #1 pack going into season.

One thing to note with Exo packs: by design they use a much softer duel density foam. Also they use a stretch fabric one the lumbar. Due to these factors I don’t think it will ever stick like say a Stone Glacier, however sometimes the stone is so sticky it can leave your back red and sometimes sore if the lumbar pad is directly contacting skin or with thin base layer. So like all things in life there are trade offs.

 

[ExpectNoMercy]

This is great!

 

[JNDEER]

Put 60 pound sand bag in the new K3 and hiked 2 miles. Initial impression is good. I had only one shim in the lumber and had no slipping. I would say it now feels a lot more like the k2. Huge improvement from original k3. Again I need more time and more weight to say this is it, but past first test. Note: last k3 slipped bad in first mile with same weight so I’m comparing apples to apples on this first 2 mile test.

What the fix did was lock in the lumbar pad from moving up and down. Zach showed it in part 1 with his hand how the lumbar pad would slide up and down about 1-1/2” - 2”.

If it continues to perform like it did it will be my #1 pack going into season.

One thing to note with Exo packs: by design they use a much softer duel density foam. Also they use a stretch fabric one the lumbar. Due to these factors I don’t think it will ever stick like say a Stone Glacier, however sometimes the stone is so sticky it can leave your back red and sometimes sore if the lumbar pad is directly contacting skin or with thin base layer. So like all things in life there are trade offs.

I did notice that the lumbar pad foam seemed way more squishy and not as firm in the K3 compared to the K2.

Thanks for the initial test and post up some results as you go.

 

[Dunky]

Put 60 pound sand bag in the new K3 and hiked 2 miles. Initial impression is good. I had only one shim in the lumber and had no slipping. I would say it now feels a lot more like the k2. Huge improvement from original k3. Again I need more time and more weight to say this is it, but past first test. Note: last k3 slipped bad in first mile with same weight so I’m comparing apples to apples on this first 2 mile test.

What the fix did was lock in the lumbar pad from moving up and down. Zach showed it in part 1 with his hand how the lumbar pad would slide up and down about 1-1/2” - 2”.

If it continues to perform like it did it will be my #1 pack going into season.

One thing to note with Exo packs: by design they use a much softer duel density foam. Also they use a stretch fabric one the lumbar. Due to these factors I don’t think it will ever stick like say a Stone Glacier, however sometimes the stone is so sticky it can leave your back red and sometimes sore if the lumbar pad is directly contacting skin or with thin base layer. So like all things in life there are trade offs.

Would be nice if exo offered the fabric portion as an option in the future so you didn’t need a whole frame set up. After looking at your pictures it seems doable to sew the Velcro pieces to the existing panel if needed.

 

[NDGuy]

No I didn't, I only tried the Lanner they sent. But I am about to order another bag from them that will fit on this frame.

Which bag are you ordering?

 

[Zach Herold]

Which bag are you ordering?

I am looking into a few of them around the 3000cu range. Im also looking into the custom build.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

 

[NDGuy]

I am looking into a few of them around the 3000cu range. Im also looking into the custom build.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

So are they like Kifaru where you order the frame + pack. So setup would be north of $800?

 

[Kevin_t]

Regarding Seek Outside backpacks .. it depends. All of our bigger (non Flight series ) packs use the same frame , belt and harness. From there, we offer two solutions integrated (which is what this review was) and breakaway . Breakaway is like the meat shelf where the bag separates , integrated is just bag directly on the frame. You can move between both of these platforms with the same frame , harness , belt. So for example, Zach could buy a custom integrated pack with the pocketing he likes and slide it on , or he could purchase a breakaway panel and different pack and go from an integrated Lanner to a breakaway Peregrine or similar. It is almost infinitely adaptable , you can go from a sub 3 lb backpacking integrated pack to a 5 lbs 8,000 CI with meat shelf with the same frame components.

 

[Zach Herold]

Regarding Seek Outside backpacks .. it depends. All of our bigger (non Flight series ) packs use the same frame , belt and harness. From there, we offer two solutions integrated (which is what this review was) and breakaway . Breakaway is like the meat shelf where the bag separates , integrated is just bag directly on the frame. You can move between both of these platforms with the same frame , harness , belt. So for example, Zach could buy a custom integrated pack with the pocketing he likes and slide it on , or he could purchase a breakaway panel and different pack and go from an integrated Lanner to a breakaway Peregrine or similar. It is almost infinitely adaptable , you can go from a sub 3 lb backpacking integrated pack to a 5 lbs 8,000 CI with meat shelf with the same frame components.

And that is one of the many reasons Seek Outside is so badass!

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

 

[MuleDeerMike]

Put 60 pound sand bag in the new K3 and hiked 2 miles. Initial impression is good. I had only one shim in the lumber and had no slipping. I would say it now feels a lot more like the k2. Huge improvement from original k3. Again I need more time and more weight to say this is it, but past first test. Note: last k3 slipped bad in first mile with same weight so I’m comparing apples to apples on this first 2 mile test.

What the fix did was lock in the lumbar pad from moving up and down. Zach showed it in part 1 with his hand how the lumbar pad would slide up and down about 1-1/2” - 2”.

If it continues to perform like it did it will be my #1 pack going into season.

One thing to note with Exo packs: by design they use a much softer duel density foam. Also they use a stretch fabric one the lumbar. Due to these factors I don’t think it will ever stick like say a Stone Glacier, however sometimes the stone is so sticky it can leave your back red and sometimes sore if the lumbar pad is directly contacting skin or with thin base layer. So like all things in life there are trade offs.

The K2 belt slipped really bad for a lot of people, myself included. I haven't tried the K3 but ever since Exo announced it last year they have been touting the design of the belt as a fix for the slipping... Disappointing that they rushed the K3 out to market and didn't actually solve the issue before selling God knows how many of them but glad to hear they may have finally figured it out for guys going forward.

Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk

 

[S&S ARCHERY]

Put 60 pound sand bag in the new K3 and hiked 2 miles. Initial impression is good. I had only one shim in the lumber and had no slipping. I would say it now feels a lot more like the k2. Huge improvement from original k3. Again I need more time and more weight to say this is it, but past first test. Note: last k3 slipped bad in first mile with same weight so I’m comparing apples to apples on this first 2 mile test.

What the fix did was lock in the lumbar pad from moving up and down. Zach showed it in part 1 with his hand how the lumbar pad would slide up and down about 1-1/2” - 2”.

If it continues to perform like it did it will be my #1 pack going into season.

One thing to note with Exo packs: by design they use a much softer duel density foam. Also they use a stretch fabric one the lumbar. Due to these factors I don’t think it will ever stick like say a Stone Glacier, however sometimes the stone is so sticky it can leave your back red and sometimes sore if the lumbar pad is directly contacting skin or with thin base layer. So like all things in life there are trade offs.

Glad you are liking how the Lumbar pad is feeling with the small change we added. It does help to reduce the pad from sliding up but most of that can actually be avoided by making sure the lumbar pad is in put in place correctly to begin with.

When you attach the velcro flap at the bottom of the lumbar pad to the backside of the lower, you want to push up on the pad so it's sitting flush with the bottom of the frame and not hanging below it. If you pull down thinking you are making it tighter that actually causes it to be worse. When you re-attach that velcro flap the second you put that pack on it will instantly slide up, which is what was happening in the review video. Installed correctly you could potentially pull it down but it should have very little movement up. It's my fault for not communicating that in our fitting videos. The added velcro this year was put in place to eliminate that placement being as critical for proper performance.

I will shoot a video to better illustrate what I'm referring too and get that posted up here soon to show how that should be done.

You are 100% correct in that there is a tradeoff with too much stickiness to the lumbar. I have prototyped and tested countless variations of our lumbar pad. I always prefer when the lumbar pad is allowed to slide around a little. It becomes increasingly noticeable with heavy loads and hiking in uneven terrain, say a downfall jungle. The really sticky lumbar pad will chew up your lower back leaving red marks, rubs, bruises, etc. If the pad is allowed to move a little that's drastically reduced. Its very intentional that our lumbar pad does this.

We did change up our webbing supplier for production starting this January. It wasn't a quality issue but a supply issue. We were having a tough time with our old supplier getting shipments in time so we changed that up. I have spent the vast majority of the last 6 months working on our internal processes so we can continue to improve stock availability; with the goal to be able to ship almost all orders within 24-48 hours. The webbing was one of many small changes we made to help with that.

MuleDeerMike, the K3 was absolutely not rushed out to the public. I spent the better part of 2 years designing that frame before it was released. As with all things we learn more over time and at Exo we try to be very responsive to small design changes we can make to continue to improve on our product. The added velcro on the lumbar for this year is a good indication of that. It was my fault in the design for not accounting that the lumbar pad could be installed incorrectly and we made this change to help reduce that.

There definitely are still some guys that see slippage of the lumbar pad regardless of pack generations, like you have, but in talking with our customers the vast majority say it was improved from K2 to K3. Pretty rare that I talk someone who prefers a K2 over a K3. I definitely did not eliminate it for all body shapes and sizes like I was hoping to. That continues to motivate and drive me in pushing our designs further.

Thanks,
Steve

 

[Zach Herold]

Glad you are liking how the Lumbar pad is feeling with the small change we added. It does help to reduce the pad from sliding up but most of that can actually be avoided by making sure the lumbar pad is in put in place correctly to begin with.

When you attach the velcro flap at the bottom of the lumbar pad to the backside of the lower, you want to push up on the pad so it's sitting flush with the bottom of the frame and not hanging below it. If you pull down thinking you are making it tighter that actually causes it to be worse. When you re-attach that velcro flap the second you put that pack on it will instantly slide up, which is what was happening in the review video. Installed correctly you could potentially pull it down but it should have very little movement up. It's my fault for not communicating that in our fitting videos. The added velcro this year was put in place to eliminate that placement being as critical for proper performance.

I will shoot a video to better illustrate what I'm referring too and get that posted up here soon to show how that should be done.

You are 100% correct in that there is a tradeoff with too much stickiness to the lumbar. I have prototyped and tested countless variations of our lumbar pad. I always prefer when the lumbar pad is allowed to slide around a little. It becomes increasingly noticeable with heavy loads and hiking in uneven terrain, say a downfall jungle. The really sticky lumbar pad will chew up your lower back leaving red marks, rubs, bruises, etc. If the pad is allowed to move a little that's drastically reduced. Its very intentional that our lumbar pad does this.

We did change up our webbing supplier for production starting this January. It wasn't a quality issue but a supply issue. We were having a tough time with our old supplier getting shipments in time so we changed that up. I have spent the vast majority of the last 6 months working on our internal processes so we can continue to improve stock availability; with the goal to be able to ship almost all orders within 24-48 hours. The webbing was one of many small changes we made to help with that.

MuleDeerMike, the K3 was absolutely not rushed out to the public. I spent the better part of 2 years designing that frame before it was released. As with all things we learn more over time and at Exo we try to be very responsive to small design changes we can make to continue to improve on our product. The added velcro on the lumbar for this year is a good indication of that. It was my fault in the design for not accounting that the lumbar pad could be installed incorrectly and we made this change to help reduce that.

There definitely are still some guys that see slippage of the lumbar pad regardless of pack generations, like you have, but in talking with our customers the vast majority say it was improved from K2 to K3. Pretty rare that I talk someone who prefers a K2 over a K3. I definitely did not eliminate it for all body shapes and sizes like I was hoping to. That continues to motivate and drive me in pushing our designs further.

Thanks,
Steve

Thanks so much Steve for hopping on the thread and adding all that great information I truly appreciate it.

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