Are we really hunting?

[WoolOverAll]

Anti crossbow guys will gladly use a wheel bow with no shame. Different times I suppose...

 

[Blacktail_]

What are your thoughts. All is legal. Whitetail deer hunting, over bait with cell cameras and a crossbow. Personally I think this going to far and not hunting, harvesting. This is night and day from when I grew up bowhunting deer, no bait, no cameras. Killing a mature hunted whitetail was HARD and required a lot of work to do it consistently. Now you dump corn, set a camera, pattern a deer, check the camera before you walk into your stand so you do not spook deer, and then kill him. To easy?

Won’t ever shame someone for putting meat on the table but I’m darn glad I live in the west. Hunting the mountains for blacktail that have probably never been seen by other humans, big difference from people hunting the same 7 deer they can name every year on their farm over east.

 

[Fireflyfishing]

I am to the point where I would be ok if they get rid of all that stuff and go back to open sites or 1x max scopes. Don’t allow any electronics, including video cameras. Bring back into relevance the flat shooting rounds. It would be an awesome twist to the craziness that is long range hunting and social media influencers. I would even be ok with straight wall cartridges only. Give me some motivation to dust off the 444 marlin i inherited.

This is coming from a guy who is all in on expensive guns and optics for long range hunting and practices out to 1250 regularly.

Put your money where your mouth is.

I have no issues going 1940’s, but I prefer my modern gizmos and aids.

The Indian word for bad hunter is vegetarian...

This is internet gold right here.

 

[Rich M]

You’re comparing a 40 year old late onset hunter or what ever they are called to a 13 year old kid. I would hope the 40 year old is a little more capable.

I do too. But He does lack the take em by the hand and lead him to the game approach folks do w their kids.

The lack of training seems visible in elk hunting. The kid gets taught, the guy has to “earn it like a man”. Not sure the late onset guy ever catches up.

Down here folks take pretty little girls out to shoot some nice bucks. Cute as heck. Its mainly a property access thing but folks like to say otherwise. You got many acres and your grandkids outhunt some dude on public land so its a big thing.

 

[rodney482]

Im all-in on getting kids hooked on hunting. If some early success helps with that—and I believe it does—then Im all for making that happen. My state puts the youth weekend ahead of our rifle season. Any legal weapon and any deer (must be accompanied by an adult hunter). Also a youth waterfowl weekend ahead of that opener (same). And a youth turkey weekend. Less-skittish animals on a more predictable pattern and a bit nicer weather, and timed so its before many of the extracurricular school activities really kick in, is all part of maintaining a tradition of hunting. Not everything needs to be hard right from the start.
Not sure how anyone would argue against that, but I’ll argue for it if you want.

Then they hit 18 and its no longer easy and they give it up. Yeah hunting should be hard, same w any sport, with challenge comes great satisfaction.

 

[Boarmaster]

My first 20 years of my adult life I moved around the country quite a bit. I learned in all things to get along and be successful ( and invited) it was best to respect the customs of the region I was living in and to learn their ways. I got along dang good with the natives and learned one heck of a lot about many types of hunting and the outdoors. I’m glad I did that now some 40 years later.

 

[Boarmaster]

Anti crossbow guys will gladly use a wheel bow with no shame. Different times I suppose...

People seem to want to stop the technology right where they presently are….. or what their interests are.

 

[KurtR]

Then they hit 18 and its no longer easy and they give it up. Yeah hunting should be hard, same w any sport, with challenge comes great satisfaction.

Maybe kids in South Dakota are built different I hunted the youth season in the late 80’s and early 90’s along with all my friends and my kid hunted youth season with all his friends and none of them quit. Youth season is over at 16 that’s when you start hunting on your own.

 

[Macintosh]

You gonna keep paying your kid’s rent and phone/internet when they 30 too? Seems like a lot of folks do.

When do you stop pampering?

Why is your kid entitled to the at ease elk/deer in nice weather when the 40 yr old onset hunter isn’t? He’s trying to feed his family, your kid is trying to make you happy.

Doesnt make sense to me. You want your kid to hunt - take him or her. Plain and simple. You dont need a special season unless you lack skills as a hunter.

Come on, you are tilting at windmills.

Did you toss your kid the keys to your truck and tell them to head into traffic on icy, snow-covered roads first thing with no instruction? Isolate them from life and then release them into society with no “upbringing”? Its ridiculous to think that kids cant benefit from “going with” for a couple years in a little more controlled environment, and then be better prepared when you do turn them loose on their own. If you dont want or need the opportunity via a special season, thats great. The data compiled by the us fish and wildlife service on why people hunt and why they stop hunting suggests it might be helpful though. You are also assuming its all for the kid…there is also an element of making it easier for the parent or mentor, too. Softer? Maybe. But are you “making it harder” right up until you fail? Also maybe. Question is—does it matter? And what is the cost? It has such a low cost, I think we are fools not to try it and see. Based on what I see, it works.

And, this oughtta break some minds:

https://www.vtfishandwildlife.com/hunt/hunting-and-trapping-opportunities/white-tailed-deer/novice-deer-hunting-weekend

 

[summs]

That is a whole other rabbit hole. Its just an issue for bowhunters because more hunters in the woods...... maybe. It would be interesting to see that stats if there are that many more hunters now during bow because of xbow. And if harvest numbers are up. I think in many states it still requires an exemption as well.

I have a friend that is in his late 70s that had to switch to Xbow in massachusetts. He is not harvesting more deer as a result. Does the same as he had for the past 20 years.

This subject has been beaten to death. As been said a million times, compound bows should also be not allowed then, right?

If anything, it can be argued crossbows are more humane because the injury risk is reduced, theoretically.

I'm curious, what is your issue with a crossbow, the way you hold it (vs. a regular bow) or the speed it shoots? If speed is the issue do you also feel certain rifle calibers should not be allowed?

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, just trying to understand the logic. 90% of the time, if we are being honest, it's because as bowhunters we are all butt hurt that there are more hunters during "our" season. And yes, I'm guilty of thinking that way as well.

I own and have used a crossbow to shoot deer.
I'm against it being the same as archery because it's not. It's a gun that shoots an arrow.
I actively encourage my dad to use a crossbow because it's so much easier.
He wont get busted standing.
He wont get busted drawing.
He wont get tired holding full draw.
He can shoot past 25 yards.

Just has to point and shoot at anything within 50 yards (it's an older crossbow, not a modern ravin)

I don't think crossbows make more people go in the woods, Id say the barrier to entry is way higher. Often crossbow people I see have $2000 setups. I rarely see another archer walking around with carbon Hoyts or flagship Mathews. Most common brand at the ranges are bear bows from where I go.

 

[rodney482]

Maybe kids in South Dakota are built different I hunted the youth season in the late 80’s and early 90’s along with all my friends and my kid hunted youth season with all his friends and none of them quit. Youth season is over at 16 that’s when you start hunting on your

Maybe kids in South Dakota are built different I hunted the youth season in the late 80’s and early 90’s along with all my friends and my kid hunted youth season with all his friends and none of them quit. Youth season is over at 16 that’s when you start hunting on your own.

built diff lol.. yeah we didnt have that soft crap here in IN in the 80's... wasnt till the age of "everyone is a winner" did IN bring in youth season and pussified the sport.

 

[Macintosh]

Then they hit 18 and its no longer easy and they give it up. Yeah hunting should be hard, same w any sport, with challenge comes great satisfaction.

You really think kids are MORE likely to give up hunting if they have an easier intro, than if they never have a taste of success? Sorry, what I see does not support your claim. Besides, in at least the case of my state its also about creating an easier situation for parents to take their kids out. And for any hunter to be a mentor, without having to take time away from the regular seasons.

 

[rodney482]

Come on, you are tilting at windmills.

Did you toss your kid the keys to your truck and tell them to head into traffic on icy, snow-covered roads first thing with no instruction? Isolate them from life and then release them into society with no “upbringing”? Its ridiculous to think that kids cant benefit from “going with” for a couple years in a little more controlled environment, and then be better prepared when you do turn them loose on their own. If you dont want or need the opportunity via a special season, thats great. The data compiled by the us fish and wildlife service on why people hunt and why they stop hunting suggests it might be helpful though. You are also assuming its all for the kid…there is also an element of making it easier for the parent or mentor, too. Softer? Maybe. But are you “making it harder” right up until you fail? Also maybe. Question is—does it matter? And what is the cost? It has such a low cost, I think we are fools not to try it and see. Based on what I see, it works.

And, this oughtta break some minds:

https://www.vtfishandwildlife.com/hunt/hunting-and-trapping-opportunities/white-tailed-deer/novice-deer-hunting-weekend

No we went w adults or mentors during regular season. With driving our state places more restrictions on you, not less.

 

[bnewt3]

On the topic of youth days,

people I know have personally encountered some wild, reckless hunters on public land. One just about shot over my dad's head at a deer they were both looking at. Not one spec of blaze orange on the guy. A little time for kids in the woods where the chances of that is greatly reduced seems reasonable to me.

In no way is hunting ever a guaranteed harvest. Otherwise it would be called deer shooting, not deer hunting.

 

[rodney482]

You really think kids are MORE likely to give up hunting if they have an easier intro, than if they never have a taste of success? Sorry, what I see does not support your claim. Besides, in at least the case of my state its also about creating an easier situation for parents to take their kids out. And for any hunter to be a mentor, without having to take time away from the regular seasons.

yep ive seen it a bunch, they take it for granted

 

[bnewt3]

built diff lol.. yeah we didnt have that soft crap here in IN in the 80's... wasnt till the age of "everyone is a winner" did IN bring in youth season and pussified the sport.

If its a sport, name another sport where kids and adults are forced to "compete" against each other at all levels.

 

[rodney482]

On the topic of youth days,

people I know have personally encountered some wild, reckless hunters on public land. One just about shot over my dad's head at a deer they were both looking at. Not one spec of blaze orange on the guy. A little time for kids in the woods where the chances of that is greatly reduced seems reasonable to me.

In no way is hunting ever a guaranteed harvest. Otherwise it would be called deer shooting, not deer hunting.

no hunting to it.

Groundblind w tripod sitting over a foodplot on summer patterns w a rifle. 3 year olds killing mature bucks is not uncommon.

 

[Lawnboi]

yep ive seen it a bunch, they take it for granted

I have seen this. It’s not that it’s easy. It’s that it goes from a family tradition, to a kill mission.

 

[207North]

This is amazing. I never realized people feel this strongly against a 2 Day youth deer season.

Nevermind Cell cams and crossbows.

Eat their own is right.

 

[rodney482]

what really happens