Anyone else cringing?

[Mykolaivka887]

point systems are broken! then only work when you have enough tags and applicants to clear the pool every few years or so. This 15-25 years right now is a joke for some tags. When will we see 30-40 years for some deer and elk tags? its coming in some places. Way I see it things will change when the newer generation grows up and they are 20-30 points behind the curve with almost impossible draw odds and they begin to hold seats in game commissions and offices

There's a lot to be said about random permit draws and doing away with points systems.

 

[diggler]

There's a lot to be said about random permit draws and doing away with points systems.

Its nice for everyone to be in the same playing field, but there would be an uproar, for good reason, if peoples points just all of a sudden disappeared and they said we are going completely random.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Its nice for everyone to be in the same playing field, but there would be an uproar, for good reason, if peoples points just all of a sudden disappeared and they said we are going completely random.

Yeah, it would have to go through the public process, which all states have within their constitutions. Otherwise, it would never stand through the court decisions to follow.

 

[5MilesBack]

point systems are broken! This 15-25 years right now is a joke for some tags.

You said it right there........."for some tags". But I still wouldn't call that "broken". Whether it takes 15-25 years or 40 years, someone(s) will draw those tags still, and it will be those that have waited the longest to do so. But that's how these point systems were designed to work when they were set up decades ago. The ones with the most points draw the tags. It's not "broken" just because there are now exponentially times more people wanting to hunt than when they started these point systems. All that should do is force those folks to focus on the tags that they actually CAN draw. But the system has always worked like that.

Thinking it's broken would be like saying the real estate market is broken just because you can't afford to buy a house in San Francisco. Then don't buy a house there........look elsewhere, where you can afford it. This isn't some new mystical form of deductive reasoning. It is and always has been just simple deductive reasoning.

 

[realunlucky]

You said it right there........."for some tags". But I still wouldn't call that "broken". Whether it takes 15-25 years or 40 years, someone(s) will draw those tags still, and it will be those that have waited the longest to do so. But that's how these point systems were designed to work when they were set up decades ago. The ones with the most points draw the tags. It's not "broken" just because there are now exponentially times more people wanting to hunt than when they started these point systems. All that should do is force those folks to focus on the tags that they actually CAN draw. But the system has always worked like that.

Thinking it's broken would be like saying the real estate market is broken just because you can't afford to buy a house in San Francisco. Then don't buy a house there........look elsewhere, where you can afford it. This isn't some new mystical form of deductive reasoning. It is and always has been just simple deductive reasoning.

Real estate law needs some tweaks just like point systems.

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[5MilesBack]

Real estate law needs some tweaks just like point systems.

Ya, except real estate law doesn't change supply or demand. Changing the point systems, let's say to all lottery, would definitely increase demand for the same number of tags.

 

[wapitibob]

Wyoming allows averaging of points for group applicants. I'm guessing many of these high point apps in the general draw did it because they wanted to hunt with a low point holder, either a family member of friend or someone who held the keys to a really good piece of property.

Every 1st choice applicant is shown in the PP demand report and all members of a party have the same point totals.. A 10 point member grouped with a 5 point holder will both have 7.5000 points in that report.

 

[Fordguy]

As long as we've circled back around to this- everyone has the chance to earn more money. You can change careers, go to (or go back to) college, or increase your wealth by any number of other options, then you can buy your more expensive house.

You can't buy points any faster than anyone else. Where you are in line will always be where you are in line unless you stop buying points or someone else either stops buying points or draws a tag ahead of you (unless you're in a random draw situation).

You're talking about a system that makes sure that very few have an opportunity to access the limited supply based on the age of the system- since the system hasn't been in place long enough for human mortality thin out a significant number of the top point holders. Even that wouldn't be enough. Excluding a random draw situation, at some point your only chance to hunt will come when you've managed to outlive the other max point holders.

Most everyone has an opinion on the point systems, and usually that opinion is colored by how much they have invested in the system compared to the opportunity that the system will or could eventually provide them. Getting in on the ground floor is MUCH different than jumping in and starting to buy points when the system has been in place for a several decades.

 

[Whip]

Every 1st choice applicant is shown in the PP demand report and all members of a party have the same point totals.. A 10 point member grouped with a 5 point holder will both have 7.5000 points in that report.

Thanks, I didn't know that it showed that way.

 

[Indian Summer]

To me the one only way to eliminate a point system is to do it the same way it became a problem. Over time. The first step is to quit selling them. Then as the people with the most points draw their licenses they are removed from the system. Keep doing that and the points needed to draw will creep down. Keep doing that until the points are gone and by then have a plan of what to do next. I’m not in favor of totally random though.