Another Which Binocular Thread... Around 1k

[HikeForAReason]

Around 10x42 currently considering:

Vortex Razor HD 10x42
Maven B.2 9x45
Leupold BX-5 Santiam HD 10x42
Zeiss Conquest HD 10x42
Leica Trinovid HD 10x42

Any input, experience, other options would be great.

Anyone's thoughts on Zeiss or Leica warranty or customer service? I am confident in the other three.

Could stretch the budget a bit if there is a better option.

Thanks.

Hello,

I just had this big decision last week. Picking optics is pretty opinionated since everyone's eyes are different but I'll try to explain it. Sorry a long post. Was using a pair of 8x32's on Olympic peninsula in thick country. Moving to eastern WA needed bigger binos and was going to do Leupold BX-5's. People seemed to really like them or complain about the eye cups and for the money It was disappointing it was such a consistent concern. Also looked at Zeiss but each time I did I'd just want their upper line and I couldn't afford it at the time and I would rather put that money to other gear in off season. There's some fantastic comparisons from bird reviewers on YouTube. The color aperture with some optics and color difference of what you see through the optics between all the optics is slight but amazing how different colors seem to glow with the different brands like grass. I think leicas we're known for really color popping. Could be interesting for you to see what works best for you. I'm red green colorblind so I'd offer my input but it probably wouldn't be applicable to you. I settled on tract optics 12.5x50 and love them. Super clear and seem quality built. Love the eye cups and zoom piece. From what I've read they have a good warranty and durability but time will tell. In terms of vortex it's a personal opinion and observation but I've got older vortex rangefinder and like it. Not the clearest but it's a rangefinder and works for what it is supposed to do. I bought a Leupold vx-5 scope this fall and looking through Leupold vs vortex equal value colors and clarity seemed to pop in Leupold. Also the dial for zoom was so stiff. Just little things but for the money it was important to get it right. I don't know if vortex changed quality recently but they just don't seem what they are used to. Got buddies that run vortex binos. They dropped it once this fall and now your right eye gets a spot in vision when you take your eyes off binos. It's weird. But then another buddy has similar problem with his pair of vortex. Ones a viper and other is diamondback. Someone else is returning a scope for what looks like hard water spots in his vortex scope. All buys within last couple years. Sure i know of some people not having problems with theirs but it's concerning durability long term. I'm not sure if they're making them cheaper and just replacing them more or what. warranties are important but I don't want to carry backups in case I have to return something mid season. Just could be worth looking into if the quality and durability is going down.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

You're a bit over halfway to affording binoculars that will be amazing for the rest of your life. Don't settle now. Used Swarovski Els and zeiss victory sfs have been going under 2k here for months.

 

[HikeForAReason]

Hello,

I just had this big decision last week. Picking optics is pretty opinionated since everyone's eyes are different but I'll try to explain it. Sorry a long post. Was using a pair of 8x32's on Olympic peninsula in thick country. Moving to eastern WA needed bigger binos and was going to do Leupold BX-5's. People seemed to really like them or complain about the eye cups and for the money It was disappointing it was such a consistent concern. Also looked at Zeiss but each time I did I'd just want their upper line and I couldn't afford it at the time and I would rather put that money to other gear in off season. There's some fantastic comparisons from bird reviewers on YouTube. The color aperture with some optics and color difference of what you see through the optics between all the optics is slight but amazing how different colors seem to glow with the different brands like grass. I think leicas we're known for really color popping. Could be interesting for you to see what works best for you. I'm red green colorblind so I'd offer my input but it probably wouldn't be applicable to you. I settled on tract optics 12.5x50 and love them. Super clear and seem quality built. Love the eye cups and zoom piece. From what I've read they have a good warranty and durability but time will tell. In terms of vortex it's a personal opinion and observation but I've got older vortex rangefinder and like it. Not the clearest but it's a rangefinder and works for what it is supposed to do. I bought a Leupold vx-5 scope this fall and looking through Leupold vs vortex equal value colors and clarity seemed to pop in Leupold. Also the dial for zoom was so stiff. Just little things but for the money it was important to get it right. I don't know if vortex changed quality recently but they just don't seem what they are used to. Got buddies that run vortex binos. They dropped it once this fall and now your right eye gets a spot in vision when you take your eyes off binos. It's weird. But then another buddy has similar problem with his pair of vortex. Ones a viper and other is diamondback. Someone else is returning a scope for what looks like hard water spots in his vortex scope. All buys within last couple years. Sure i know of some people not having problems with theirs but it's concerning durability long term. I'm not sure if they're making them cheaper and just replacing them more or what. warranties are important but I don't want to carry backups in case I have to return something mid season. Just could be worth looking into if the quality and durability is going down.

I just joined the forums and didn't realize how long the post actually posted up! Sorry about that. Also don't know how to edit existing post. I just wanna say not trying to start a brand war or make anyone mad with the opinions/observations especially with the vortex stuff. Just recent observations in my friend group.

 

[Coors Man 264]

I just joined the forums and didn't realize how long the post actually posted up! Sorry about that. Also don't know how to edit existing post. I just wanna say not trying to start a brand war or make anyone mad with the opinions/observations especially with the vortex stuff. Just recent observations in my friend group.

I appreciate the response. I don’t mind reading long posts at all. The reason I made the thread was just to get additional comments, takes, reviews, on binoculars. Really appreciate the information. I understand your take on vortex binoculars. It’s one of those, “great warranty cause you’re going to need it,” things. I have heard the razor hd and especially the uhd are great binos. It does worry me if I look at spending the money on Swarovski’s, Zeiss, or Leica, that I may need to spend additional money on repairs if needed, or don’t receive great customer service.

 

[Coors Man 264]

You're a bit over halfway to affording binoculars that will be amazing for the rest of your life. Don't settle now. Used Swarovski Els and zeiss victory sfs have been going under 2k here for months.

I hear ya. I just keep telling myself ya have to say stop eventually lol. Do you have any experience with Swarovski or Leica warranty or customer service? I am hesitant to spend that kinda money and then get lack luster customer service or be charged for repairs. I have been looking closely at the SLC’s.

 

[jimh406]

Look at Tract Toric as well. They sell direct (means cheaper for the quality you are getting) and through Amazon. Free Returns. If you don't like them, send them back. Fwiw, that was my strategy, and I now own two pairs.

 

[HikeForAReason]

I appreciate the response. I don’t mind reading long posts at all. The reason I made the thread was just to get additional comments, takes, reviews, on binoculars. Really appreciate the information. I understand your take on vortex binoculars. It’s one of those, “great warranty cause you’re going to need it,” things. I have heard the razor hd and especially the uhd are great binos. It does worry me if I look at spending the money on Swarovski’s, Zeiss, or Leica, that I may need to spend additional money on repairs if needed, or don’t receive great customer service.

Well me personally if I get a Zeiss or swaro bino I'm gonna splurge on the top of the line or upper end ones. I don't know buying bottom of the barrel of a brand feels like buying a 4 cylinder muscle car because you want the looks of it but not all the abilities of the V8 model. If I'm gonna buy a top end brand I'd rather buy the upper end to know what the brand can REALLY do and what they are proud to put their name on. In the end if you buy a pair and don't like them you'll probably get a slight distaste for the brand and go a different way in the next pair. Meanwhile all your judgement of the brand was off their economy model.

 

[HikeForAReason]

Look at Tract Toric as well. They sell direct (means cheaper for the quality you are getting) and through Amazon. Free Returns. If you don't like them, send them back. Fwiw, that was my strategy, and I now own two pairs.

I recently got the 12.5x50's and they seem great. Really excited to put them through the ringer. Only ever seemed to find good things on the reviews especially for price.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

I hear ya. I just keep telling myself ya have to say stop eventually lol. Do you have any experience with Swarovski or Leica warranty or customer service? I am hesitant to spend that kinda money and then get lack luster customer service or be charged for repairs. I have been looking closely at the SLC’s.

No warranty experience, I don't own any Swarovski or Leica products. I've been running zeiss victory sfs since 2016, they've been spectacular.

 

[eaglemountainman]

Call Doug and talk to him about those Kowa Genesis.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I hear ya. I just keep telling myself ya have to say stop eventually lol. Do you have any experience with Swarovski or Leica warranty or customer service? I am hesitant to spend that kinda money and then get lack luster customer service or be charged for repairs. I have been looking closely at the SLC’s.

I haven’t ever had to send any of my Swarovskis in but there’s a bunch of documented CS experiences over on bird forums and I’ve yet to read or hear of a bad experience. As long as it’s under warranty and not something you caused they fix it. People have had the rubber armor come apart from exposure to chemicals which wasn’t Swaros fault and they repaired them free of charge.

A buddy of mine sent very well used EL’s in for service that had bad scratches on all of the external lenses and asked for them to be replaced and it was less than $200 to replace them all which I think is very reasonable.

I do have CS experience with Leica on a LRF and it was not positive. The beam was way off right out of the box, I sent them in a couple weeks after getting them and they denied the warranty saying it had been dropped (it had not) and had no visible signs of damage. I bought them on close out for like $400 and they wanted more money to fix them then I paid for them. I’ve heard of a lot of other not so stellar CS with Leica too. I still like their stuff though and will continue to buy it but just like that LRF I’ll continue to buy from a good company like Euro Optic that will go to bat for their customers to make stuff right. I would be far less concerned about needing their CS with binos than a LRF too.

Between Swaro and Leica binos I’m always buying Swaro though. I’ve had Leicas and for what you can get them used for they are excellent since they don’t hold their value as well, but new Swaro all day.

 

[Reed104R]

I've had 3 positive experiences with Swarovski CS, but I only needed scope eyepiece rings, covers or caps replaced. Never any service issues. If you buy used, note the seller's name, as Swarovski traces ownership for registration purposes. Vortex has the best CS I have ever dealt with. They are fast and thorough, with customer satisfaction a priority. Alot of advice this forum leans toward buying used Swarovski. I agree and have done so for years, but I believe technology eventually surpasses the older optics and newer models are likely to be optically superior. I have a bunch of binoculars and have spent (or wasted) alot of time in comparison. I recently compared Razor HD and UHD's to two SLC's from the mid 2000's and saw very little difference. The UHD's were probably the best overall to my eyes optically, by the narrowest of margins (newer technology and AK prisms?). If forced to choose, I'd still take the SLC's. I'll never forget when I bought my first pair of SLC's about 25 years ago. I handed them to my father, who looked through them and profoundly remarked, "Wow!". I'll never forget the grin on his face. Neither he nor I ever imagined binoculars could be so good.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I've had 3 positive experiences with Swarovski CS, but I only needed scope eyepiece rings, covers or caps replaced. Never any service issues. If you buy used, note the seller's name, as Swarovski traces ownership for registration purposes. Vortex has the best CS I have ever dealt with. They are fast and thorough, with customer satisfaction a priority. Alot of advice this forum leans toward buying used Swarovski. I agree and have done so for years, but I believe technology eventually surpasses the older optics and newer models are likely to be optically superior. I have a bunch of binoculars and have spent (or wasted) alot of time in comparison. I recently compared Razor HD and UHD's to two SLC's from the mid 2000's and saw very little difference. The UHD's were probably the best overall to my eyes optically, by the narrowest of margins (newer technology and AK prisms?). If forced to choose, I'd still take the SLC's. I'll never forget when I bought my first pair of SLC's about 25 years ago. I handed them to my father, who looked through them and profoundly remarked, "Wow!". I'll never forget the grin on his face. Neither he nor I ever imagined binoculars could be so good.

That’s comparing 20 year old Swaros that aren’t even their flagship line which have had two major glass enhancements since then to Vortex’s flagship line that costs almost as much as current SLC HD’s.

I thought the UHD’s were nice too, but they aren’t alpha tier $$ good. If they were $1000 street price I’d probably own a pair and they’d be the top dog in that price range, but they just aren’t worth what Vortex wants for them. Used they’re still $1200-$1400 which is what used SLC HD’s and Ultravid HD’s go for.

 

[Reed104R]

You can buy used or refurbished UHD's in the $1k range if you look around. Keep in mind the SLC was developed as a bright, high contrast, and color neutral hunting binocular in Europe (I would suggest this is why many bird watchers preferred Leica and Zeiss). The newer models shifted away from that premise. Some may also recall when the EL's came out that many still preferred the SLC's for their lack of field flattening technology, because they were a little brighter in low light. I think the Swarovski playing field eventually leveled out with the newer models, which may have contributed to the demise of the SLC. Lucky for us, they last forever!

 

[Venom One]

I hear ya. I just keep telling myself ya have to say stop eventually

Agree 100%. I bet if you removed the brand name and distinguishing characteristics, most wouldn't be able to tell the difference between $1000 glass and $3000 glass.

 

[Reed104R]

Agree 100%. I bet if you removed the brand name and distinguishing characteristics, most wouldn't be able to tell the difference between $1000 glass and $3000 glass.

If you looked through some B&L's made in 1932 I just had rebuilt, you might wonder if we've come as far as you thought!

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Agree 100%. I bet if you removed the brand name and distinguishing characteristics, most wouldn't be able to tell the difference between $1000 glass and $3000 glass.

If someone can’t tell the difference between that they need their eyes checked. When I hand someone a pair of my Swaros their typical reaction is “wow”.

Yes there’s a big difference between $1K and $3K binos.

 

[Coors Man 264]

Agree 100%. I bet if you removed the brand name and distinguishing characteristics, most wouldn't be able to tell the difference between $1000 glass and $3000 glass.

Yep, exactly what I’m thinking. I know people like to get a thumbs up for buying 3k Swaros, and you’re not going to get anybody to say something bad about something they spent their money on. But, I know, I probably couldn’t tell a difference between a set of Vortex UHD’s or, Swaro EL’s. And I bet most people couldn’t.

 

[Coors Man 264]

If you looked through some B&L's made in 1932 I just had rebuilt, you might wonder if we've come as far as you thought!

Wouldn’t doubt it, those do sound pretty cool.

 

[WRO]

I have had a lot of people say that. Going to look into them. thx.

It’s not an accident, only schott glass in the discussion


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