Accubond tip deformation.

[camping1601]

Getting this from my Tikka 300 WSM with the bullets in the mag.
I know it's from recoil, but are there any solutions?

 

[doverpack12]

I first noticed this on my Winchester 30-06 probably 2010 ish and contacted Nosler. They said performance and impact would be unaffected to 200 yards after that impact may change some. I now use th deformed tips for Foulers or confirming zero. I tried a stiffer mag spring and it helped a little but didn’t stop it. Happens now on my cooper 7mm STW. I think it really comes down to you can’t hold those rounds tight enough and still have good feeding and loading by hand easily.

 

[JohnyRingo]

Try lengthening your bullets so that they barely fit into your magazine. That will give them less room to slam into the magazine on recoil. You could also put a muzzle brake on your rifle. I did both of these and now my 300 H&H doesn't deform my Nosler Ballistic Tips.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

Try lengthening your bullets so that they barely fit into your magazine. That will give them less room to slam into the magazine on recoil. You could also put a muzzle brake on your rifle. I did both of these and now my 300 H&H doesn't deform my Nosler Ballistic Tips.

You may risk jamming the bullet into the lands and then having the bullet stuck in the throat. Upon unloading, you get your ejected case and a whole bunch of powder all inside your action. The nice thing, you still have the bullet, stuck in the throat. Reloading your COAL to the magazine is like buying a 747 for the peanuts, you have it all backwards. Actual jump from the bullet is critical in accuracy. Maybe the incorrect jump may be causing a pressure spike, thus cause the rounds to move forward inside the magazine too much?

I would recommend the Hornady Lock-N-Load OAL gauge: Hornady Lock-N-Load OAL Gauge Straight | Sportsman's Warehouse

As for bullet deformation, when you load the magazine, just have all of the tips against the front of the magazine and not at the back. While I am guessing now, maybe a muzzle break?

 

[camping1601]

Thanks for the input guys.
I do have a brake for it but I use it only for working up loads and do not hunt with it on.
I'm about maxed out with OAL so the cartridges fit the magazine.
It sounds like it's just the nature of the beast (light gun with heavy recoil) and I'll have to deal with it until I find a different bullet.

Thanks again for the input.

 

[RoJo]

In addition to deformed tips, is it possible the bullets are also being driven farther into the cases, shortening OAL and possibly affecting accuracy on follow-up shots?

Not likely I'd guess...just a thought that crossed my mind.

 

[JohnyRingo]

You may risk jamming the bullet into the lands and then having the bullet stuck in the throat. Upon unloading, you get your ejected case and a whole bunch of powder all inside your action. The nice thing, you still have the bullet, stuck in the throat. Reloading your COAL to the magazine is like buying a 747 for the peanuts, you have it all backwards. Actual jump from the bullet is critical in accuracy. Maybe the incorrect jump may be causing a pressure spike, thus cause the rounds to move forward inside the magazine too much?

I would recommend the Hornady Lock-N-Load OAL gauge: Hornady Lock-N-Load OAL Gauge Straight | Sportsman's Warehouse

As for bullet deformation, when you load the magazine, just have all of the tips against the front of the magazine and not at the back. While I am guessing now, maybe a muzzle break?

If your rifle has a detachable magazine box, there is no way that the COAL will cause your bullet to get stuck in the throat. The lengths allowed by the detachable magazine is conservatively short for that reason. This is why quite a few people who shoot magnums don't want to own a gun with the detachable magazine. They can't extend the length of the cartridge to cut the distance to the lands to their liking. Again, if you fill up the detachable magazine with a longer bullet, you will take care of the deformation of the tips and you will still have plenty of room in the throat.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

If your rifle has a detachable magazine box, there is no way that the COAL will cause your bullet to get stuck in the throat. The lengths allowed by the detachable magazine is conservatively short for that reason. This is why quite a few people who shoot magnums don't want to own a gun with the detachable magazine. They can't extend the length of the cartridge to cut the distance to the lands to their liking. Again, if you fill up the detachable magazine with a longer bullet, you will take care of the deformation of the tips and you will still have plenty of room in the throat.

Yeh, you are really just wrong. It is very simple to run the bullet long and then proceed to jam the bullets into the throat, regardless of the magazine length. I have personally done this. I have seen others do this. The magazine length has nothing to do with the chambering of the rifle barrel. They are two totally different concepts and considerations. Please, just stop.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

Thanks for the input guys.
I do have a brake for it but I use it only for working up loads and do not hunt with it on.
I'm about maxed out with OAL so the cartridges fit the magazine.
It sounds like it's just the nature of the beast (light gun with heavy recoil) and I'll have to deal with it until I find a different bullet.

Thanks again for the input.

Maybe some other things to consider. Are you shooting from a prone position? Are you using any kind of sled to help with recoil? Do you have a good recoil pad? These things might also be altering your bullet tips.

Good luck out there!

 

[camping1601]

Maybe some other things to consider. Are you shooting from a prone position? Are you using any kind of sled to help with recoil? Do you have a good recoil pad? These things might also be altering your bullet tips.

Good luck out there!

Doesn't matter what position I shoot from. I think it's just the gun slamming into the bullet tip. It's a pretty light gun with a pretty heavy recoil.

I'll add with this Tikka and my 700 chambered for 7mm STW it's not possible to seat a bullet to touch the lands and still fit the magazine.

I think I'll load the next batch with .010 clearance fit in the mag and see how that works. Or maybe try another bullet?

 

[hodgeman]

That's been the curse of hard kicking guns for ages. The old Speer "Mag Tip" and Nosler "Protected Point" Partitions were attempts to design a bullet that had some protection from battering against the front of the magazine.

I've never noticed it effected accuracy enough to worry about overly much. Your neck tension is more than likely sufficient to prevent the bullet from being driven back into the case- that would be very unusual.

A few designs ( I believe H-S Precision is one) have shoulders in the magazine to prevent the tip from hitting- but not the Tikka.

 

[Idaho Lefty]

In addition to deformed tips, is it possible the bullets are also being driven farther into the cases, shortening OAL and possibly affecting accuracy on follow-up shots?

Not likely I'd guess...just a thought that crossed my mind.

I could be possible, with "Light" neck, tension ( due to an oversized, expander ball or, Neck Dia. ! ),.. most "good" dies, have this covered but, everyone should, "check" for this ! Has NOT been a "problem" for me, tho. I'm going to try Johnny Ringo's, idea and set my bullets, OUT further, to within .005 /.010 off the Magazine's front, "Wall" ! The "Freebore" in most Tikka's is over .100 and MY bullets "Jump" about .110 or so and the Newer Bullet design's with, Tangent Ogive's, shoot real well ! ( like Nosler AB's, Berger Classic Hunters and VLD "Hybrids" ) Thanks,.. Johnny and RoJo for the great, info !

 

[elkguide]

I could be possible, with "Light" neck, tension ( due to an oversized, expander ball or, Neck Dia. ! ),.. most "good" dies, have this covered but, everyone should, "check" for this ! Has NOT been a "problem" for me, tho. I'm going to try Johnny Ringo's, idea and set my bullets, OUT further, to within .005 /.010 off the Magazine's front, "Wall" ! The "Freebore" in most Tikka's is over .100 and MY bullets "Jump" about .110 or so and the Newer Bullet design's with, Tangent Ogive's, shoot real well ! ( like Nosler AB's, Berger Classic Hunters and VLD "Hybrids" ) Thanks,.. Johnny and RoJo for the great, info !

If you were told load your bullets to be to close to the full length of your magazine, you will likely cause feeding problems. Bent tips have been a "problem" for many years. The recoil will drive the bullet in the magazine in any heavy recoil rifle. I have not found it to be and issue on any animal out to 500 yards. Beyond that you "might" see a tiny discrepancy.


(still can't even begin to comprehend the thought process behind what shooting from a different position would have to do with a deformed bullet tip????????????????????????????????)

 

[Idaho Lefty]

Bullets loaded "out" farther with, tips close to the front Mag wall, would have LESS, "Inertia" and "travel" distance was my thinking !
You are right Elkguide, by seating Bullets out, too close to the Magazine's front "Wall", could cause, feeding problems !
I'll just "deal" with the slightly, deformed tip's as, they would only be the last 2 shots, in the Magazine that, are deformed a bit, anyway ! I always hit, the Bullseye with, my FIRST "perfect" shot, anyway,.. LOL !

 

[Idaho Lefty]

@ camping 1601,.. please let us know how THAT works ( .010 "clearance" ) and IF, your gun still feeds, good ! THANKS !

 

[howl]

Speer makes their Grand Slam line with "Mag" tips that are already somewhat flat. I have not used them. I like the high BCs of plastic tips like everyone else. Also, having used the deformed tips for off-season practice to the end of the distance I shoot at game, I will say the slightly deformed tips have not made for misses. So, it's not a real concern for me.

If you load 50 rounds before season, how are you going to find yourself without a fresh enough one to load at the top of the mag?

 

[JohnyRingo]

I am just sharing my experience with my Browning X-Bolt and its detachable magazine. In my mind, I couldn't deal with the fact I was shooting bullets without perfect tips. What's the point of designing a perfectly conical tip if it was "okay" to shoot one that was deformed. I extended the bullet to where the tips were slightly off the front of the magazine. There are no feeding problems and they are still a considerable distance from the lands. The deforming of the tips instantly went away. Since then, I also put a muzzle brake on my rifle, so maybe extending the bullets have become a moot point. If my rifle had an internal magazine, I don't think I would mess with the length of the bullet. I don't think that this is a problem with internal magazines because I think the spring that holds the cartridges are stronger than the ones in the detachable magazines.

 

[mtmuley]

My primary hunting rifle is a .300 RUM that weighs 8.5 pounds all up, no brake. I shoot 200 grain Accubonds at 3200 fps. Serious recoil. I load to mag length. No feeding issues, but I still get a bit of deformation, In 14 or 15 years of the Accubond, I can assure you the deformation is not an issue. Used to get in my head till I tested them. With a hard kicker, I doubt the deformation can be totally eliminated. mtmuley