7mm Rem Mag vs the new age

[buffybr]

I started deer and elk hunting in the mid '60s. My first centerfire rifle was a .30-06. Ten years later I had it rechambered to .30 Gibbs, just because I liked the shape of the Gibbs case. Those two chamberings kept my freezers full of deer, elk, moose, and other big game meat through the '90s.

During that period I often thought that I would like a 7 mm Rem Mag, but the 7 RM ballistics weren't that much different that the ballistics of my .30-06 and .30 Gibbs that I could justify buying a 7 RM.

Then in 2000 I had an opportunity to join some friends on a South African hunt, and because a case fire-forming accident damaged my .30 Gibbs, I bought a 7mm RM in a Rem 700 ADL. I later "upgraded" to a 700 BDL, but those two 7 mm RMs went with me on several African hunts, deer, elk, and antelope hunts here in Montana, and 3 or 4 hunts in Canada that put a Musk ox and 2 Caribou bulls (including the one in my avatar) into the all time Boone and Crockett record books.

My favorite elk and other big game rifle now is my .300 Weatherby, with my 7 mm RM a close second. In recent years I've thought of rechambering my 7 RM to a 7mm Mashburn or a 7mm/.300 Win, but again I can't justify enough improvement over the standard 7mm RM.

 

[fuzzymarindave]

No flies on the old 1962 7RM cartridge.

Companies doing lots of promoting and sales work to keep ID Sales going and growing. If you have a 7RM you don’t need a 7 PRC, ditto on 300 WM vs 300 PRC. If you “want one”, get it but you “don’t NEED one”!! Like most things in life.

Yes, that is how I look at it too. I know one fellow who has only one rifle in 7mm Rem Mag and he travels the world; all his trophies are with that cartridge. I looked past the 7RM and went with both a 6.8 Western and 280AI. My 300 PRC is my most accurate rifle so far, so I think Hornady did something right with that cartridge!

 

[Fmuguira]

The old cartridges perform admirably; where a new cartridge can be a benefit, at least to some degree, is if you are wanting to shoot the absolute longest, highest bc bullet out there today and then the new, whiz bangs most likely have a faster twist barrel. This is usually more for ultra long range steel (>1000 yds) and not so much for a true all around hunting rifle.

I guess in certain instances I still like my Model A s and can pass on a Tesla Can still turn some wrenches on that Model A !!

 

[Tx270WT]

Well my xbolt 7mm rem mag slings those 195gr bergers like a pro so I’m not sure what else I’m going to get out of a 7prc. I’m not shooting animals past 500 yards and don’t have a 1000 yard range. Maybe I should check with hornady’s marketing team to see what I’m missing out on.

 

[Fmuguira]

I think you re not missing out on anything; maybe spending money that all the manufacturers want …?

 

[sdupontjr]

Well my xbolt 7mm rem mag slings those 195gr bergers like a pro so I’m not sure what else I’m going to get out of a 7prc. I’m not shooting animals past 500 yards and don’t have a 1000 yard range. Maybe I should check with hornady’s marketing team to see what I’m missing out on.

What twist is your Xbolt if you don't mind me asking? My older A-bolt II is a 9.5 twist.

 

[Tx270WT]

What twist is your Xbolt if you don't mind me asking? My older A-bolt II is a 9.5 twist.

I believe it’s 1:8. It’s one of their new western series.

 

[sdupontjr]

I believe it’s 1:8. It’s one of their new western series.

Ah nice. yeah I wish mine had a faster twist.

 

[Harvey_NW]

And the newer factory rifles have more consistent chambers.

This is key.

Crickets from the 6.5 PRC and 7 PRC users and Hornady fan clubs.

Any folks had different results from their chronographs and factory loads, specifically the 7 PRC?

That bandwagon has lost multiple wheels, unless there is compelling info showing things in a different light.

Feel free to show me a classic factory 260 or 284 option that will shoot factory ammo with high bc bullets over 2800 fps, I'll wait. There's plenty of posts out there showing the factory Federal stuff is matching box velocity of 3,000fps out of seasoned 24" barrels. Hornady took a blasting because they had to face powder and component shortages just like the rest of us. But there's a lot of bashing from dudes that buy a 7 PRC with a 22" bbl, throw a factory 175 in it and shoot it over a chrono and get 2800 fps, and claim Hornady's marketing is trash. In reality that barrel is 2" shorter than test barrel length (-50fps on avg), and after 200 rounds it will likely speed up 100-150fps. Do the math and oops.. It's exactly right.

 

[WyldGoose]

No complaints from me on the old 7 Mag. Last year I picked up a 22” 8 twist X-bolt “suppressor ready” model and I buy hand loaded ammo for it. Most accurate rifle I’ve ever owned. And the 6” can knocks down a ton of recoil and need for ear pro.
Only wish the overall length was shorter.

 

[gerry35]

This is key.


Feel free to show me a classic factory 260 or 284 option that will shoot factory ammo with high bc bullets over 2800 fps, I'll wait. There's plenty of posts out there showing the factory Federal stuff is matching box velocity of 3,000fps out of seasoned 24" barrels. Hornady took a blasting because they had to face powder and component shortages just like the rest of us. But there's a lot of bashing from dudes that buy a 7 PRC with a 22" bbl, throw a factory 175 in it and shoot it over a chrono and get 2800 fps, and claim Hornady's marketing is trash. In reality that barrel is 2" shorter than test barrel length (-50fps on avg), and after 200 rounds it will likely speed up 100-150fps. Do the math and oops.. It's exactly right.

Hornady took a blasting because they failed to tell everyone that they were getting 150-200 fps less with the new powders they had to use but still claimed 3000 fps. If they would have been honest there wouldn't have been a big issue. With 26" barrels the speeds were around 2880 fps on average. Lots of info on YouTube confirms that. Had they developed a round that doesn't rely on RL 26 to get the speed they wanted they would have been better off. A 1 in 8 twist 7 mm RM will outperform the 7 PRC since it has more case capacity.

 

[Harvey_NW]

Feel free to show me a classic factory 260 or 284 option that will shoot factory ammo with high bc bullets over 2800 fps

A 1 in 8 twist 7 mm RM will outperform the 7 PRC since it has more case capacity.

My comparison was specifically factory rifle with factory ammo.

 

[farmermail]

"Standard" twist rate is the real difference between 7 PRC and 7 Rem Mag. Longer bullets need a faster twist. Lead 175's from a 7 mag (normally in the 1:9.5 range) are on the edge of stabilization. Copper (i.e. Hammer, Barnes, et al) bullets in the 160 or heavier range really don't shoot worth a darn at 1:9 or slower. Some guns fine, some not as fine. PRC has a "factory" 1:8, allowing for longer, heavier bullets as a standard (especially mono's) vs. "on the edge". If one is looking for a new gun, PRC is a nice choice. If one has a 7 mag, no need to upgrade in my opinion (I personally have a couple of 7 mags, love 'em). Can a person build a 7 mag with a 1:8, modified chamber, etc.? Of course, will work great I suspect. Or, just go get a 7 PRC off the shelf, have fun, and save a ton of money. With the technology available today with scopes/rangefinders/ballistic calculators, 100 or 200 FPS difference at the muzzle doesn't matter at all.

 

[Doc Holliday]

No complaints from me on the old 7 Mag. Last year I picked up a 22” 8 twist X-bolt “suppressor ready” model and I buy hand loaded ammo for it. Most accurate rifle I’ve ever owned. And the 6” can knocks down a ton of recoil and need for ear pro.
Only wish the overall length was shorter.

Ive had my eye on that exact rifle. Is the 22" the end of the muzzle brake that comes with it, or is there 22" of rifling for the bullet to travel down? I know my A-Bolt .270 is listed as having a 22" barrel on the specs by Browning, but there is only 19" of rifling. 3 inches is just the BOSS. Also, how is the trigger?

 

[WyldGoose]

Ive had my eye on that exact rifle. Is the 22" the end of the muzzle brake that comes with it, or is there 22" of rifling for the bullet to travel down? I know my A-Bolt .270 is listed as having a 22" barrel on the specs by Browning, but there is only 19" of rifling. 3 inches is just the BOSS. Also, how is the trigger?

View attachment 756096

Mine looks to have around 21” or so of rifling in the barrel. While the trigger is adjustable, I installed an Mcarbo spring to lighten it up before I ever shot it.

 

[Fmuguira]

Harvey_NW , you re exactly right about new rifles needing 150-200 rounds to get their barrel seasoned in and for velocity to “quit” increasing.

Can t tell you how many guys I know and/or have heard about that “work up a great load for their new rifle” and then 6-7 boxes later are popping primers, beating on their bolts to get opened, etc !!

 

[MtnW]

Some pretty knowledgeable and experienced gun writers of a earlier time who actually hunted a lot and reloaded in quantity, championed the various 7 Magnum’s. I had a few older friends who I grew up around who had been on yearly 14 day BC hunts for stone sheep, grizzly, moose, Mtn caribou who are no longer with us, all use the 7MM Mag of some form. Several of these guys used the various forms of 7MM Mashburn Mags. Most used the 175 grain Nosler Partitions . These guys could hunt with any caliber rifle they wanted to use. Wether it be a 7MM PRC , 7MM STW, 7MM Weatherby, 7MM Mashburn , it’s pretty much splitting hairs over the common 7MM REM Mag. All formidable hunting rifles.

 

[bmart2622]

My comparison was specifically factory rifle with factory ammo.

Youre going to be waiting a while on that one

 

[35WhelenAI]

This is key.


Feel free to show me a classic factory 260 or 284 option that will shoot factory ammo with high bc bullets over 2800 fps, I'll wait. There's plenty of posts out there showing the factory Federal stuff is matching box velocity of 3,000fps out of seasoned 24" barrels. Hornady took a blasting because they had to face powder and component shortages just like the rest of us. But there's a lot of bashing from dudes that buy a 7 PRC with a 22" bbl, throw a factory 175 in it and shoot it over a chrono and get 2800 fps, and claim Hornady's marketing is trash. In reality that barrel is 2" shorter than test barrel length (-50fps on avg), and after 200 rounds it will likely speed up 100-150fps. Do the math and oops.. It's exactly right.

I stand by what I say, Hornady was not upfront with their ammo claims. They knew they weren't getting what they should, and they kept their mouths shut.

This isn't what-about-ism and talking other 7mm cartridges other than the the 7 PRC. For what it was created to do and advertised to do at a point in time, it didn't.

The 7mm PRC is the first time I've seen having to rely on barrel break in and seasoning in order to reach published velocities. A 30-06 ought to be over 2800 fps with a 180 gr factory anything after a hundred rounds or so, but it isn't. Is the 7 PRC different in that regard?

 

[bmart2622]

Ive read that reply several times and dont see anything that comes close to an example that he requested