6.5CM vs .308Win

[16Bore]

What's all this coffee reference about?

Apparently the flat brim hipster movement has turned it into a benevolent event and elevated the status of a cup of joe to a backcountry status symbol.

 

[JWP58]

308win.

 

[Formidilosus]

This is great for shooting targets and rocks but doesn't the frontal diameter and overall mass of the .308 bullets create a much larger and devastating wound channel at nearly all ranges?

I do understand ballistics and have quite a bit of experience shooting at distance with the .308, but not in a hunting situation. What I don't seem to understand is that there seems to be a difference between just the ballistics of hitting at a set distance and the ability to kill quickly at that same range.

Between these two different calibers wouldn't the increased energy (regardless of how you measure that energy K.E., Momentum, Taylor knock out) and larger diameter of the .308Win be a better choice for 90% of the shots you will encounter in the field than the better dope and drop of the 6.5 on the 1-5% of the shots in the field?

Ft-lbs of energy is not a wounding mechanism, and tells you litteraly nothing about what a bullet will do to an animal. Damage based metrics, or how deep and wide and wound is, does tell you what to expect from a bullet when placed into an animal.


No, using similar bullets the difference in wounds between the 308 and 6.5 is statistically meaningless.



Terminal ballistics and how bullets destroy tissue, and by effect how bullets kill, for some reason is stuck somewhere between myth, legend, nonsense and straight BS. If someone is talking about anything other than how deep and how wide a wound is... They have no idea what they are talking about with regards to terminal ballistics. "Energy", TKO, "knockdown power", "momentum", etc are all things thought up by individuals to try and explain how bullets kill, before we KNEW how they kill.


How deep. How wide.

 

[16Bore]

308win.

Makes more sense than most will admit to.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

If I was going to make a switch from the 300 win mag to a short action the pick of the litter is 7mm-08

I like the heavier bullet selection for smacking things that want to eat you.

 

[4IDARCHER]

I understand what you are saying but I also believe that there is a tie between K.E. and Momentum and the depth and width of a wound channel from a bullet. I understand ballistics (I actually literally grew up part time in a ballistics lab) that is why I don't understand the current swing to the 6.5 for a hunting round and not just long range shooting. For long range shooting the bullet just has to get there. For hunting the bullet has to get there and then do a job (killing quickly).

 

[KurtR]

If you think the 6.5 is new to killing it isnt.

 

[LifeAndLiberty]

Makes more sense than most will admit to.

Well, we can at least agree upon that even if we may prefer to take our coffee differently. The .308 is a classic case of "familiarity breeds contempt, rarity breeds admiration." Or however that phrase goes. I believe last year Becca on here took a brown bear with a .308.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AKMAN]

With regard to the 6.5 Creedmoor zealots, it'd be fun to know how many folks out there were 260/6.5 Swede/6.5 etc fans before the creedmoor was new/cool. 6.5 Creedmoor is the new 300 win mag.

 

[Shooter19802003]

...and that's where you lost me.

There is a difference between hunting and shooting. A bunch of guys sitting under an awning looking for critters through their spotting scopes connected to a digital device and shooting across a canyon doesn't require hunting skill......at all. It does require shooting skill and math though. Reference the thread of the guys shooting the wolf on here.

 

[cuerro viejo]

There is a difference between hunting and shooting. A bunch of guys sitting under an awning looking for critters through their spotting scopes connected to a digital device and shooting across a canyon doesn't require hunting skill......at all. It does require shooting skill and math though. Reference the thread of the guys shooting the wolf on here.

Still got to be able to find them. Thus why on the thread they where 2 wolves for 10 people.

 

[KurtR]

There is a difference between hunting and shooting. A bunch of guys sitting under an awning looking for critters through their spotting scopes connected to a digital device and shooting across a canyon doesn't require hunting skill......at all. It does require shooting skill and math though. Reference the thread of the guys shooting the wolf on here.

That is what would be called an opinion. Everyone is entitled to one but trouble starts when they are stated as facts.

 

[JWP58]

If you think the 6.5 is new to killing it isnt.

Oh boy, I'm waiting with bated breath someone might trot out the ol "Scandinavian" and "moose" talk....

 

[KurtR]

Oh boy, I'm waiting with bated breath someone might trot out the ol "Scandinavian" and "moose" talk....

Instead of bated just hold it......my Grandpa was resizing .243 brass well before i was long for this earth and killing lots of stuff on the SD prairie. Pretty sure we are just german and rusian and havnt killed any moose.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

I have no sentimental connection to any particular caliber... same as the other tools in life I own.

The 2012 sandy hook deal and subsequent ammo shortage opened my eyes to attaching my hunting ammo supply line to any "military" "tactic oil" rounds.

As for long range shooting, it's another solution looking for a problem. Lots of kooks in life will try to spend their way a particular skill set for nearly any endeavor that requires years of practice and hunting epitomizes this.



The day I switch to some relatively niche caliber will be the day the airlines lose my baggage on some islamastan hunt and I'll be SOL. Mr Murphy has a habit of attacking us at the weakest link.

Also another reason not to use a firearm that is ammo picky.

 

[JWP58]

Instead of bated just hold it......my Grandpa was resizing .243 brass well before i was long for this earth and killing lots of stuff on the SD prairie. Pretty sure we are just german and rusian and havnt killed any moose.

Damn!!! That's a buzzkill.

On a side not the ol' 6mm is pretty devastating to critters itself.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

Oh boy, I'm waiting with bated breath someone might trot out the ol "Scandinavian" and "moose" talk....

You beat me to it. My buddy johanas lives in Gothenburg Sweden but his family hunts in northern Sweden. As related to me that the 6.5x55 was always considered an inferior moose round. Now his smokin hot wife... nothing inferior about her! Haha. Let's see if that'll smoke him out of the bush and into replying.

He's just bitter cuz he's not allowed at my dads cuz grandpa made a rule that if you ain't a Finn you aren't allowed in. Lol

Whatever you do, don't bring your girlfriend to Sweden. That's like taking sand to the beach. Then again my years in the bush has proven that even a doe can look good if you need it to. Lol. But a buck would be not ok. That's gay.

Arguing about calibers is less interesting then creapin on fatties at willistons Walmart. Sure I'd take the pear shape with the stretch marks over the grandma greeter, but let's be honest it doesn't really matter in the end anyways.

then again maybe it does.. douchebags out there pressure women into getting bolt ons and injecting shot into their face, same thing with animals. It's okay if ur buck doesn't look like it's been eating steroids and boner pills, and it's okay if your gun doesn't shoot 18 million miles with negative wind drift... life's full of coming up short, that smoking hot tits on a stick isn't going to be that fun to be around once the war paint won't cover it up, neither will ur laser cannon that pole axed the 28 point buck at 2 miles make you less of an kook at life.

 

[KurtR]

Damn!!! That's a buzzkill.

On a side not the ol' 6mm is pretty devastating to critters itself.

I got a Ruger m77 in 6mm rem handed down to me from my Grandpa and I agree they do a nice job at killing while being really fun to shoot.

 

[Shooter19802003]

Still got to be able to find them. Thus why on the thread they where 2 wolves for 10 people.

There is no dispute there, nor did I say there was. What is brought into question is hunting skill. The further you remove yourself from your prey, the less HUNTING skill is involved. It is on a sliding scale the closer you are, the more hunting skill is required......the further away the more shooting skill. You are a fool if you deny this. I hunt at fairly close range....because I have to where I live. Not because i am some great white hunter. However to compare my hunting skill to that of a hunter of old would be foolish on my part. I can't get anywhere close enough to use some primitive bow with stone arrow heads or a spear. That.....is hunting skill in its purest form. A form I can't even come close to. Like wise i have tried to hunt with a trad bow. I have been successful only a small portion of the time....and my hat is off to the guys with the HUNTING skill to pull this off. If you can't tell the difference between hunting and shooting skill....i don't know what to tell you. Other than don't let your own interest cloud your judgment. I'm not against "long range hunting", it's not my thing. I can't do it here for one. I have no quarrel with what folks choose to do, I can care less. I however, just prefer to call things what they are......thats all.