6.5 Eld-m vs TMK for elk

[Jesseb]

Another eld-m vs tmk thread. I drank the koolaid for match bullets this past season and between my daughter and I we took 1 elk and 2 mulie bucks. I took my biggest buck ever with the 77 tmk out of an 18” AR. 1 shot at about 250yds and dropped. she took a mature cow and a small buck with 130 tmk out of her 22” 6.5 Grendel. Muzzle velocity on that one is right at 2500. Buck was a bang flop with lungs obliterated and tore the top of the heart right out. Elk was interesting. Broadside 100yd shot with perfect placement behind the shoulder. Bullet recovered in broken offside shoulder but it had clearly tumbled. It went though both lungs sideways, not much destruction but the fastest 1 shot kill I have ever seen on an elk! No tracking necessary. She killed her elk the year before with 129 ablr. Also worked great but she did hit her 3 times. The recovered 130 tmk weighs 129 grains, so it lost the tip and that’s about it. Looks like it hit the on side rib and that sent it tumbling on entry. Entry wound was large which has me wondering if it was tumbling before impact. Maybe hit a branch that I didn’t see? She hit dead nuts where she was aiming and I tested the load extensively before season and it was shooting nice tight 3/4-1” groups with no evidence of key holes. Impact speed would have been around 2350fps. So it worked, both critters drt. But I like to tinker. I have a bunch of bullets for sale but I had a partial box of 123 a-max bullets so I loaded them up yesterday and shot couple groups at 100 yds. 1/4-1/2” groups with ease! And I was around 2750fps. So, assuming the tmk tumble was a fluke, 130tmk at 2500 or 123 eld-m at 2750???? Sadly I already sold 200 of the a-max. I could also go 130 eld-m. Velocity would be between 2500-2600. If it were deer only, I would go 123 all day long. The groups were crazy good.

Recovered 130 tmk

 

[North River]

Strange things happen to bullets....

Would you mind sharing your load data? I'm shooting a bolt action Grendel and find that I tend to bulk out on powder capacity before finding pressure. The book data being kept to gas gun pressures means there is a bit of room for improvement for the bolt gun loader.

 

[Jesseb]

With the 120-130 class bullets, the ball powders are your friend for velocity. Cfe223, Leverevolution, 2520, staball match etc. I load them at 2.290-2.300 oal running asc and pri mags. I had the 129ablr just over 2600fps with those powders but settled on 2500fps with an upper limit load of 8208xbr, mainly for temp stability. I think I am at 27.3 grains for the xbr and had lever up to 31 grains but accuracy wasn’t there for this barrel. I run the 130tmk with the same 27.3 xbr charge. I got 2750 out of the 123 amax with lever with excellent accuracy across 3 charge weights.

If you like the speed kills concept and copper projectiles, I have had great results on deer with the 105 Cavity Back MKZ and the 110 maker T-Rex. Both wreck internals and expand pretty violently. The last buck I killed with the MKZ was a short track job as he only made it 30 yards, which I hit him on the run. A blind man could have followed the blood trail! Lungs gone along with the top of the heart. Both of those mono’s are much softer and better constructed imho than anything Barnes has ever put out. I really wanted to try them on elk but decided the heavy for caliber fragmenting sounded better to me for the big guys. I limit my girls to 200-250yds max so the slower velocity doesn’t bother me.

 

[North River]

Thanks. I’m shooting a 16” bbl but extrapolating for difference of length I’m still not getting those kind of velocities with 123s. Right at 2450 with max book load of CFE 223 which is about all you can fit in the case. I am loading to AR mag length tho.

I am generally a 250yrd hunter as well, but I do like to be able to point and shoot to that distance, so I’ve dropped down to the next level of weights; 100 amax, 100 Scenar, and 107 TMK. Getting between 2600-2650 as as top loads with TAC. CFE and Superf topped out in the high 2500 range. I think there’s just not enough room in the case or barrel length for those slower powders. May drop down to 4198 burn rate and mess around, but probably not, I’m pretty happy with 2600+.

 

[Jesseb]

I have always had good luck with Lever. This newest barrel is loving it and I just discovered my 22 arc does as well. Just loaded up more for each of them. 123 amax/eld-m hits lands at 2.350 and 2.365 in the 2 grendels I have at the moment. I load them at metal mag length of 2.300. Load em long and run lever up to maybe 32 and I bet you get over 2500. My choice on your list would be 123 eld-m or 107tmk. I would try 8208xbr or Benchmark with that 107. Should get you best velocity and super temp stable. I may try some of the 123’s/lever in my 16” upper tomorrow. I will let you know how it goes. I ran them once in it during break in a while back with 28 grains Tac, no work up, and put down a 1/2” group.

 

[Luked]

I have always had good luck with Lever. This newest barrel is loving it and I just discovered my 22 arc does as well. Just loaded up more for each of them. 123 amax/eld-m hits lands at 2.350 and 2.365 in the 2 grendels I have at the moment. I load them at metal mag length of 2.300. Load em long and run lever up to maybe 32 and I bet you get over 2500. My choice on your list would be 123 eld-m or 107tmk. I would try 8208xbr or Benchmark with that 107. Should get you best velocity and super temp stable. I may try some of the 123’s/lever in my 16” upper tomorrow. I will let you know how it goes. I ran them once in it during break in a while back with 28 grains Tac, no work up, and put down a 1/2” group.

With the Lever have you seen or experienced any issues with temp?
I have done a lot of reading on it and a lot say it is not very temp stable.
Really curious to hear your thoughts about this.
OP don't want to hijack your thread but thought it would be something to consider with the Lever powder.

 

[Jesseb]

I have actually never hunted with it. I have always found an acceptable load with 8208xbr. I have heard lever is sensitive but I have also heard it is no worse than others. I shot it the other day at around 50 and I will shoot it today around 75 so we shall see what that yields. My daughter’s elk hunts start in mid August. I will fine tune the load on a 90 degree day and call that good. With a max range of 250 yards for them, all I care is that it’s safe on a warm day. If you want to wring everything you can out of these smaller cartridges, you may have to accept a little extra work like warm weather load and cool weather load. For my use situation, even a 1.5” group is totally acceptable, so I go for velocity. That’s why I have a 22” barrel on this upper. Right now, lever is giving me max velocity AND best accuracy.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

we've only used 123 gr eldm factory ammo in our grendels and they have been nothing but pleasant surprises, 21 kills, 8 species bigger than coyote, 10-420 yards, average shot distance 170 yards, average recovery 10 yards (most drt's, the odd 15-50 yard), no anomalies or weird things so far in 7 seasons (moose, black bear, sheep, antelope, whitetail, muley, wolf) and lots of it from 16" barrel at only 2386 fps launch including 420 yard drt whitetail