257 weatherby or 300 win mag

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Just got back from successful elk hunt. Granted my .308 doesn't have a belt around the bottom, but i can tell you my real world experience. At about 85 yards I center punched both lungs from a steep downward angle. I used a 175 grain Federal Terminal Ascent. Entry was perfect .30 caliber and exit was >3". Bull still went about 75 yards before a finishing shot put him down.

I recommend you get behind the .300 and find a load that you can shoot comfortably and confidently. There is a big difference to me personally between an "adequate" big game round and "ideal". Give me bigger holes, exit wounds, and energy every time. To quote my outfitter, "...big exit holes are what kill elk..."

 

[goathunter]

Wow......some of you guys....

Worse case put two in him

Things aren't always so simple

 

[skings22]

Thanks everyone for the post. I just picked up some Hornady superformance for the 300 win mag. Going to try and take it out this weekend.

 

[Idaho4x4Bronco]

Thanks everyone for the post. I just picked up some Hornady superformance for the 300 win mag. Going to try and take it out this weekend.

Those are super good bullets Imo. Killed about 13 so far with them with great results.

 

[Wrench]

I shoved a 100gr tsx through a Roosevelt elk at a measured 400 yards. The elk took one in the lungs and bang flopped.

I personally love the flat trajectory of the .257 and would shoot a 100gr tough bullet and never look back.

At 400 yards with a 3500fps plus gun, there's no reason to sweat BC unless you're hunting in 70mph winds.

The point and click is worth it for up close to 400. They are not easy on meat, but kill like an anvil falling from the sky.

 

[Indian Summer]

Online ballistic calculator using same weight bullets discussed above but in a Nosler.

View attachment 331747

View attachment 331748

I don't care which you shoot, but unless missed something, the 300 crushes the 257 on energy . There's less drop with the 257 and it's velocities are similar to the 300 comparing those two bullets, but the energy of the 180 gr out of the 300 is significantly more at 400 yards, 1354 vs 2027. I suppose the fact that the 300 crushes at both ends is the downside.

EXACTLY! Wrecking balls are heavy for a reason! Thank you.

 

[Indian Summer]

Sometimes it takes the “I hit him perfect, never found him” experience for people to realize the importance of energy AND the toughness of an elk. I can tell you they don’t give a rat’s ass about trajectory. I can also tell you, from experience, that losing an elk that you know is laying dead somewhere will make you rethink your philosophies on ballistics. It’ll make you start thinking “Maybe a little recoil isn’t so bad. Maybe a muzzle brake will make me comfortable with a more adequate elk gun.” You’ll be sick over it and thinking of every way to make sure it doesn’t happen again…. I hope.

Unfortunately some will just shrug it off saying “I guess maybe I didn’t hit where I thought. I’m sure he lived”

 

[bluetick78]

This cracks me up. A bigger heavier bullet performs the same. Welcome to the internet!

I didn't say they performed the same, read the edit, if you can read.....or did you get tender emotions hurt because I said something besides a 300 winny ninny bro banger can kill elk?

 

[Indian Summer]

I didn't say they performed the same, read the edit, if you can read.....or did you get tender emotions hurt because I said something besides a 300 winny ninny bro banger can kill elk?

Nope. But my emotions do get hurt when I know an elk is rotting away and gave it’s life to be coyote food. You suggested that there is no reason to go with a bigger gun. There is. Energy. You left that part out… bro.

 

[MJB]

Many ways to skin a cat

 

[SummitsCalling]

My vote is the 257 since thats what your most comfortable with as someone who owns a 300wm

In terms of toughness, you have more than enough. Everyone knows an old cow elk is tougher than a bulls anyways.

 

[BuzzH]

I have two rifles one is a 257 weatherby that I Have taken 11 Antelope with and am very comfortable behind.
Shooting 115 berger vld . The other is a 300 win mag that I have only taken out once for a deer hunt and got my deer
with it. I am shooting 165 grain berger vld. I got drawn for Elk this year and Really considering using the 257 mag. I will
keep my shots to under 400. yards. What do you guys think? Scott

I think it makes no difference...use what you want.

 

[hobbes]

Your biggest problem with the .257 is you are comparing it to a 300 Win Mag. The 115 grain bullet isn't going to compete very well with a 300 WM shooting a 180 grain bullet or bigger. It also looks like you can't load a much heavier bullet. If you'd just asked will my .257 be sufficient for elk, you'd have gotten more answers in the affirmative at reasonable ranges.

I like data that isn't circumstantial, which is why I immediately go to the numbers. Data like that doesn't lie and has nothing to do with shot placement.

I don't think many folks would say that an 06 wasn't enough for elk. I'd bet it's killed more elk than any rifle out there. Here's the 257 compared to an 06 not shooting the largest bullet but one that you'd find plenty of folks shooting. The 06 has more energy but not a huge amount. I think your relatively tiny bullet is your biggest hurdle.

 

[Idaho4x4Bronco]

Nope. But my emotions do get hurt when I know an elk is rotting away and gave it’s life to be coyote food. You suggested that there is no reason to go with a bigger gun. There is. Energy. You left that part out… bro.

I feel like you would need to have made a very poor shot to lose an animal honestly. At that point, the small difference in caliber wont matter.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I feel like you would need to have made a very poor shot to lose an animal honestly. At that point, the small difference in caliber wont matter.

I don’t know you, but that is a very naive and ignorant statement. Anybody that has hunted for any significant period of time has lost an animal. I don’t care if it’s a rabbit, squirrel, pheasant, whitetail, elk, or bear. If you pull that trigger and cripple an animal and don’t recover it and don’t feel guilty you’re no sportsman. Thus if you can shoot a bigger, better, round comfortably why wouldn’t you? What are you trying to prove? Maybe your one of those guys that fishes for trophy bass in the weeds on a UL with light line. “I hooked a lunker but the dang thing got away from me. He’ll rust that hook right out and be fine…”

Caliber always matters. If you start with a larger diameter round you are going to leave at least a bigger entry hole. All other variables being similar, you’re also going to have a bigger exit too.

 

[Idaho4x4Bronco]

I don’t know you, but that is a very naive and ignorant statement. Anybody that has hunted for any significant period of time has lost an animal. I don’t care if it’s a rabbit, squirrel, pheasant, whitetail, elk, or bear. If you pull that trigger and cripple an animal and don’t recover it and don’t feel guilty you’re no sportsman. Thus if you can shoot a bigger, better, round comfortably why wouldn’t you? What are you trying to prove? Maybe your one of those guys that fishes for trophy bass in the weeds on a UL with light line. “I hooked a lunker but the dang thing got away from me. He’ll rust that hook right out and be fine…”

Caliber always matters. If you start with a larger diameter round you are going to leave at least a bigger entry hole. All other variables being similar, you’re also going to have a bigger exit too.

Not saying it doesn't matter though, just saying elk aren't bulletproof and shot placement rules all. Are you trying to imply we should shoot a pheasant with a cannon or something because bigger is better?

I've never lost an animal, had my license for 22 years now. I shoot most my elk with a 270 too.

I see both sides of the argument, but elk are not bulletproof and 400 yards isn't far.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Shot placement does rule, we agree on that. However, when you’re hunting $hit happens sometimes and the margin of error can be greater if you are shooting larger caliber rounds. Same as bowhunting, a heavier broadhead with larger cutting diameter tips the odds in your favor when $hit happens and the shot isn’t ideal.

I shoot pheasants with a 20 and a 12 and don’t use anything smaller than 6s. Day in day out my favorite load is a 5 until late season when I switch to 4s exclusively. Why? Fewer but larger and heavier pellets to penetrate late season feathers and fat.

If you haven’t lost an animal in 22 years you are a rare individual indeed. Kudos to your diligence and marksmanship. Personally ive been hunting for more than 35 years, and I’ve lost pheasants with a broken wing that hit the ground running, squirrels in hollow trees, rabbits in brush piles, and whitetails I hit a little too far back. I’m not ashamed to admit it and they all hurt.

The .270 is a proven elk killer in the .30-06 family of cartridges. It’s also larger diameter than a .25.

 

[mavinwa2]

Over the years, 50 of them, I've shot bull elk with 270, 308, 30-06 and 300WM.
all get the job done with good shot placement.

But the 300 Winchester Magnum, 200 Gr Partition, and observing the results....DEVASTATING!!
Never had a bull go more than 50 yards and most dropped in their tracks.

The 270, shot 2 bulls. Lung shot, one made it 100 yards, the 2nd bull 200 yards with both lungs shot & heart clipped!. Lost the 2nd bull to another hunter. Where I hunt in WA State, elk goes for more than 100 yards, good chance another hunter is putting it down. Which was the case with 2nd bull. NEVER used 270 again on elk after that.

300WM, My go to cartridge for elk hunting the past 30 years.

 

[Formidilosus]

Nope. But my emotions do get hurt when I know an elk is rotting away and gave it’s life to be coyote food. You suggested that there is no reason to go with a bigger gun. There is. Energy. You left that part out… bro.

Exactly what does “energy” do for wound channels?

 

[Indian Summer]

Exactly what does “energy” do for wound channels?

We can go back and forth all day. The last few posts above this are excellent. Respectable non-argumentative guys with actual experience and nothing to prove.

So now it’s about wound channels? No. It’s about marginal shots which we can all agree happen. No benchrests on flat ground and adrenaline free trigger pulls when we’re hunting elk on public land. So if the wound channel isn’t in the ideal spot it’s good to have the energy to cause damage because of hydrostatic shock.

We don’t shoot turkeys with cannons but every once in awhile it seems like the BBs bounce right off. They are extremely tough as well. Think about that for a second….. why don’t we use the same size shot for turkeys that we do rabbits? States even regulate the minimum size shot for turkeys. They want that energy! And for the record it has nothing to do with chest pounding because “I shoot a magnum”. To me it’s about respect for the animals I pursue. I want them dead on their feet before they even hit the dirt.

Disclaimer: Dead on their feet is just a figure of speech. I have to say that so I don’t have to read about the scientific facts about oxygen loss to the brain being the actual cause of death which takes a few seconds. It’s also a fact that in steep thick elk country they don’t have to make it too too far to land in some pile of stuff where we walk right by and never find them. I’ve looked for elk before where we ended up finding them the next day…. or days later after the birds revealed their resting place and said wow… we were so close the first night. We walked right past him.