223, 223AI, or 22 ARC? Which one?

[Schmo]

I'll tell you what. If you go that route and end up not liking it, PM me and I will take it off your hands.

Haha okay awesome!

 

[SouthPaw]

My thought for changing barrels. I know the barrel is obviously not cheap, but I’d love to shoot the 80 ELD, and my current barrel does not like the 75 or 80 ELD. I understand there is no guarantee a new barrel will either.

What loads did you try with the ELDs? It might be worth trying a few different loads to get them to shoot in your current barrel before investing in a new barrel. I've got two factory 8tw tikkas that shoot the 80eldm well.

Also, for curiousity, did the uni-throater work for you to get more loading length and/or speed? Any negative effects?

 

[Schmo]

It might be worth trying a few different loads to get them to shoot in your current barrel before investing in a new barrel.

I’ve tried running them 6 ways to Sunday and no juice. 77TMK shoots really well.

I’m actually going to do some more load dev with the 77TMK on that factory barrel, since I may keep it as a backup. It was my first barrel to throat, and I accidentally throated way too long. COAL with the 77 is 2.550”, and the ogive is still .065” off the lands. Fortunately, even throated too long, it still shoots 10 shot groups 1” and under.

As to benefits of throating, I was pushing the 80 ELD to 3,042 fps without being in too much pressure. Still would get at least 3 firings on Starline brass with that loading.

 

[Packmansion]

I am doing exactly what you are! I think Im going to go with a 1:7 223 wylde so I can chase the lands a little bit. 223 ai is appealing but not sure it will give me a whole lot of what I want. The fire forming and dies kinds of kill it for me. My purpose for my build is mainly high volume of shooting with optimized BC and loooooog barrel life. I plan to shoot 1000s of round out of this rifle. Based on Hornady load data should be able to get 2800 fps out of a 20" barrel with a wide selection of powders and the 80 eldm. I can see the 1:8 twist being a bummer. A properly twisted 223 wylde is not a sexy exotic thing but more of a tool. The more guns I build, the more I cherish my most utilitarian builds. As someone mentioned this is a tough decision because youre really splitting hairs, the 22 arc definitely has some performance but the way I see it the plain old 223 with unlimited brass is just a good reliable thing to have around. I plan to use mine on prarie dogs out to 400 yard with a few times out to 600. I also would not mind using it on whitetail but im in a 243 minimum state where it is illegal to hunt varmints with anything larger than .224 during deer or elk season, which is best time to hunt varmints. I am guessing I will get 7000 rounds before it dies, it will take me a few year... 223 Wylde is 0.0619 FB, 5.56. is 0.05 FB, 223 rem is 0.025 FB. On My AR-15's an 80 eldm kisses lands around 2.51 to 2.52 coal. Im using MT 223 mags at 2.6" coal (realistically 2.59). This will give me 0.07" to chase lands which should get me to 7000, but jumping never killed anyone. I have a few ARs chambered in 223 Wylde and they shoot factory 55 and 68 very well no issues. Seems like a flexible setup as I can shoot the 55 fodder up to 80 eldm. Might try 88's, hornady says 2700 fps out of 20" well see...

 

[.270]

I have all three cartridges, with the .223 and 22 ARC being in gas guns. The .223 wylde I dont load heavy for, just stick with 55-64 grs for that round. The .223AI is a bolt gun with a 22" barrel and 1-7.7 twist. I have had no problems shooting any of the three bullets you listed, I did throat it to shoot the 77 tmk at 2.45 coal using MDT magazines. I am currently shooting the 80 eldx at 3030 using Laupa brass and 8208 XBR.

The 22 ARC is in a 20" barrel with the 1-7" twist. Working on a load with 75 eldm and H4350, currently shooting around 3055 with great SD/ES but accuracy is around 1.5 MOA, would like to tighten that up. Shoots factory Hornady 75 eldm rounds at 2950 with the same accuracy, maybe a little better. The only brass I can find is Hornady, I know Alpha makes some but I haven't found any available. The loaded factory 22 ARC is around 1.10 a piece and new unprimed brass is .80 cents or more, so it makes sense for me just to buy the factory ammo for the brass. Extra range time is always a good thing.

The 22 ARC is an easier option to get the performance out of the .22 cal heavies, especially with factory 75 eldm shooting pretty good. 22 ARC in a bolt gun will exceed what I can do in a gasser, but like you know, opening up the bolt face, new magazines, dies and a limited selection of available brass are some of the deterrents.

I think the .223AI will do what you want to accomplish in shooting the 75-80gr bullets, 100 fps faster then a .223. Plus the AI shoulder looks cool but so does the little fat ARC case. You'll just need a new sizing die, I still use my .223 seater with no issue.

 

[Schmo]

I’ve been thinking some more on this lately. In a way, I’d really like the performance of the 22 ARC. But, after really thinking about it, I think either the 223AI or the 22 ARC would be amiss of what I’m looking for. I think I need to stay with regular .223. Probably a Wylde chamber, possibly with .100 freebore.

A long time ago, I just absolutely fell in love with the 223 in a bolt gun. Just some about it does it for me. Lots of cheap brass, good performance, and something I have a blast shooting.

For a more powerful trainer, maybe one day I’ll set up a 6 ARC to have in addition to the 223.

 

[KyleR1985]

From a 16” Howa mini .223, LC once fired brass. I got heavy bolt at 27gr/2913 combo. Nothing prior.

Confirmed sub MOA with 26.5gr lever this past weekend for 5 shots.

Loading long makes a dramatic difference in the .223. Enough to cure my desire for a 22arc. At least in a bolt gun.

 

[ACHILLES]

Lever and cfe can make the 223rem punch above its weight class. I was testing cfe 223 and 77tmk in my 26” 223rem last weekend. Running them at 3050fps, coal 2.4. The 22ARC should do around 2980fps with cfe-223 in a 16” with 77tmks. From comparing my 22arcs and 223rem bolt rifles the ARC pushes the heavy’s 160-180fps faster than the 223 at equal pressures with 4-5gr more powder in Sammi 22arc chambers.

 

[Firth]

It's tough to beat the logistics of 223 for volume bot gun practice. If you don't have one, that's the direction I'd go. If you already have one set up for that, I'd personally lean 22 arc for the extra speed.

 

[Packmansion]

I’ve been thinking some more on this lately. In a way, I’d really like the performance of the 22 ARC. But, after really thinking about it, I think either the 223AI or the 22 ARC would be amiss of what I’m looking for. I think I need to stay with regular .223. Probably a Wylde chamber, possibly with .100 freebore.

A long time ago, I just absolutely fell in love with the 223 in a bolt gun. Just some about it does it for me. Lots of cheap brass, good performance, and something I have a blast shooting.

For a more powerful trainer, maybe one day I’ll set up a 6 ARC to have in addition to the 223.

Id go plain 223 Wylde if you want to feed from a magazine. Based on my research the longest mags are right around 3.5" oal I guess you could jump but the Wylde seems to be a sweet spot. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong on that. The Hornady 5.56 load data looks promising, 88 eldm going 2700 out of a 20" with cfe 223 max load... I ordered a barrel and went 7" twist I'll report back when I get it.

 

[WhoGarrDen]

Id go plain 223 Wylde if you want to feed from a magazine. Based on my research the longest mags are right around 3.5" oal I guess you could jump but the Wylde seems to be a sweet spot. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong on that. The Hornady 5.56 load data looks promising, 88 eldm going 2700 out of a 20" with cfe 223 max load... I ordered a barrel and went 7" twist I'll report back when I get it.

Reviving this as I'm considering 223 wylde for a 16" gas gun. This gun will be plinking and varmints inside 500yds. I'd like to run the lighter varmint loads for 0-300 max point blank shooting on coyotes. I assume at 16" barrel velocities I won't have any issues with a 1:7 in the lighter bullets?

 

[Packmansion]

Reviving this as I'm considering 223 wylde for a 16" gas gun. This gun will be plinking and varmints inside 500yds. I'd like to run the lighter varmint loads for 0-300 max point blank shooting on coyotes. I assume at 16" barrel velocities I won't have any issues with a 1:7 in the lighter bullets?

I would not go with an ar15 in 223. Id go 6mm arc, 22 arc or go to a bolt gun and your options really open up. Caviat here is cost, the 223 wylde cant be beat for component and factory offerings. The big thing with ar is the lower pressure and the mag length restrictions. If you're not saving the fur I'd buy a target long range rig in 6GT or 6Creed or 6.5 creedmoor and now you have a gun you can compete in long range matches with and will be a joy to hunt varmint with. Your next hurdle with be getting good enough glass. 500 yards is long for how small some varmint are and mirage is a bitch and unavoidable even with a high end scope. 1:7 is perfectly fine. With wind an ar 15 in 223 wyled will be a challenge at 500 yards. I built my 223 wyled in a bolt gun and acquired longer coal magazines. I have the benefits of the 22 arc bullets with the cost benefits of the 223 brass.

 

[nm.otter]

For me, .22 GT in a bolt gun looks pretty sweet.

 

[Marbles]

I'm playing with the same question. It will be a TC Encore, so no concerns on case head size.

Looking to set it up for my 7 year old.

Feel like a 223 Wylde chamber is the correct answer as I already load 223, recoil will be lower, and cheaper ammo.

But the 22 ARC sounds like more fun.

 

[eric1115]

I'm playing with the same question. It will be a TC Encore, so no concerns on case head size.

Looking to set it up for my 7 year old.

Feel like a 223 Wylde chamber is the correct answer as I already load 223, recoil will be lower, and cheaper ammo.

But the 22 ARC sounds like more fun.

You know the answer. Giant piles of spent brass are the answer. A 7 year old needs mountains of spent brass to get to where they can shoot the difference. I can't do that with ARC cases the way I can with .223, but if you can more power to you. Pick something where 100+ round range days don't tempt you to start doing cost per round math.

 

[Marbles]

You know the answer. Giant piles of spent brass are the answer. A 7 year old needs mountains of spent brass to get to where they can shoot the difference. I can't do that with ARC cases the way I can with .223, but if you can more power to you. Pick something where 100+ round range days don't tempt you to start doing cost per round math.

Yes and yes. And yes the extra 12¢ a shot to reload.....well I'm already doing math.