22 Creedmore legal use issues!

[Erik1972]

So, I am researching 22 Creeds right now and watching lots of videos on them. I am having an issue understanding the legality of this caliber on game. Every state I hunt in for deer and bear, this caliber is too small and therefore illegal. But I watched two videos of very high profile hunters using this caliber in Texas and Idaho or Utah on deer and bear. I know in Colorado there is a minimum of .24 state wide on any game. I am confused?


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[JollyRoger]

Laws are different about that from state to state. I don’t know about other states but where I am it just has to be center fire for big game, just know the rules in your area.

 

[waspocrew]

So, I am researching 22 Creeds right now and watching lots of videos on them. I am having an issue understanding the legality of this caliber on game. Every state I hunt in for deer and bear, this caliber is too small and therefore illegal. But I watched two videos of very high profile hunters using this caliber in Texas and Idaho or Utah on deer and bear. How is MuleyFreak able to use this caliber on black bear, harvest one and get away with it? I know in Colorado there is a minimum of .24 state wide on any game. I am confused?


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He “got away with it” because it was legal. Apparently he shot the black bear in Montana which has no caliber restrictions.

You need to know the regulations in the states you hunt. For example, in Wyoming I can hunt deer and antelope with my 22 Creed, but not elk.

 

[False_Cast]

I hunt Ohio, WV, MI, CO and a few more and we have to be .24 or larger for much smaller game than elk, mule deer and black bear. Utah just says center fire for rifle but handguns must be .24 or larger.

I guess in my mind and what little research I have done so far, I wouldn't use anything less than a .243 on any big game.


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You’re wrong about an impressive amount in such few words. For one, Michigan has no such restriction. No need to explicitly state that you’ve done “little” research or that you’re “guessing.”

 

[ARK_Ginger]

*sarcasm* Remove the caliber mark on the barrel and downsize 6mm creed brass, problem solved.

 

[BradArnett]

I am not wrong about an impressive amount, MI has a .slug gun, muzzy or .35 caliber limit below the limited firearms deer zone and above the limited firearms deer zone center fire must be larger than .22 caliber. Right from the regs book.


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You in fact are wrong. There is no centerfire restrictions here in Northern michigan except "no .22 or smaller rimfire"

Here's the regs

 

[ColPenguin]

I hunt Ohio, WV, MI, CO and a few more and we have to be .24 or larger for much smaller game than elk, mule deer and black bear. Utah just says center fire for rifle but handguns must be .24 or larger.

I guess in my mind and what little research I have done so far, I wouldn't use anything less than a .243 on any big game.


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Ohio has to use straight walled cartridge of .357 - .50 caliber, or shotgun, for firearm season.

West Virginia is any centerfire cartridge. There is a caliber restriction of .25 only for rimfire cartridges. Those are mutually exclusive restrictions.

 

[The Guide]

But I watched two videos of very high profile hunters using this caliber in Texas and Idaho or Utah on deer and bear.

Did you verify if those states had caliber restrictions? Many states have no caliber restrictions during rifle seasons. Each state has its own ability to choose what is legal and very few have decided small calibers aren't legal.

I guess in my mind and what little research I have done so far, I wouldn't use anything less than a .243 on any big game.

Why wouldn't you use anything less than a .243 caliber on game animals? .224 caliber bullets are very effective on game animals from moose to deer when used within their abilities.

Jay

 

[hereinaz]

Problem with lots of research on the internet, is the old “common wisdom” persists and it is outdated, merely opinion, or flat wrong. It is really hard to sift through it all. Hard enough to read and understand all the regs sometimes.

Do what you feel comfortable with, but it’s the right bullet at the right velocity. A .22 creed will definitely work with the right bullet. Only your fear of the unknown will stop you.

And, understand shot choice. If you know you’re gonna be tempted with any shot angle you get, and “send one through the paunch to reach vitals on a once in a lifetime hunt” then shoot a bigger, fast copper bullet and hope it works.

It’s funny to me how many podcasts talk about how the little cartridges aren’t as effective, but the stories of “how tough” an animal is shows it’s about shot placement. Animals are the same tough regardless of bullet size if it’s the same shot placement. Unless it is a CNS shot.

 

[HandgunHTR]

It’s funny to me how many podcasts talk about how the little cartridges aren’t as effective, but the stories of “how tough” an animal is shows it’s about shot placement. Animals are the same tough regardless of bullet size if it’s the same shot placement. Unless it is a CNS shot.

In regards to the bold/italics above, 99% of the time, they are using bonded or mono bullets as well and then lament that the didn't drop at the shot, or it ran, even with good shot placement, and use that as their justification as to why the animals are "so tough".


As to the state restrictions, if you do a search on my posts here, I posted a response on the .223 thread that lists the caliber requirements (or lack thereof) for all 50 states.

 

[hereinaz]

In regards to the bold/italics above, 99% of the time, they are using bonded or mono bullets as well and then lament that the didn't drop at the shot, or it ran, even with good shot placement, and use that as their justification as to why the animals are "so tough".


As to the state restrictions, if you do a search on my posts here, I posted a response on the .223 thread that lists the caliber requirements (or lack thereof) for all 50 states.

I will remember the list! Thanks.

Yeah, it’s so funny the way they wrap themselves up in circles. JVB did a podcast with Seth from Hornady and they killed a pile of African animals with 22 creed and 22 arc. All quick and clean kills on dozens.

Then a few episodes later, he did the infamous one on small calibers not effective on big game.

 

[LongWayAround]

@Erik1972 caliber restrictions are the least of muleyfreak's malfunctions.

#dontgivehimclicks

 

[Article 4]

I live in hunt in states that have no centerfire rifle requirements however, I completely disagree with this policy when,

• We have minimum muzzleloader requirements - for moose, elk, sheep, and bear the min is .50 cal and deer sized and smaller it .45
• We have minimum arrow weight and pull weight requirements (300 grains and 40lbs)
• Minimum broad head cutting requirements 7/8 and .015 thick

The rule should be revisited and I would vote for minimum caliber and bullet weight requirements for anything larger than deer sized animals, including bears...

 

[svivian]

I live in hunt in states that have no centerfire rifle requirements however, I completely disagree with this policy when,

• We have minimum muzzleloader requirements - for moose, elk, sheep, and bear the min is .50 cal and deer sized and smaller it .45
• We have minimum arrow weight and pull weight requirements (300 grains and 40lbs)
• Minimum broad head cutting requirements 7/8 and .015 thick

The rule should be revisited and I would vote for minimum caliber and bullet weight requirements for anything larger than deer sized animals, including bears...

 

[Carl Ross]

I live in hunt in states that have no centerfire rifle requirements however, I completely disagree with this policy when,

• We have minimum muzzleloader requirements - for moose, elk, sheep, and bear the min is .50 cal and deer sized and smaller it .45
• We have minimum arrow weight and pull weight requirements (300 grains and 40lbs)
• Minimum broad head cutting requirements 7/8 and .015 thick

The rule should be revisited and I would vote for minimum caliber and bullet weight requirements for anything larger than deer sized animals, including bears...

So the constitution is the ONLY law, except for some rules you want to stop people from hunting with guns you don’t personally approve of?

 

[Article 4]

So the constitution is the ONLY law, except for some rules you want to stop people from hunting with guns you don’t personally approve of?

What an ignorant arguement

So in your mind, someone should shoot an elk or grizzly bear with a 22 rim fire because it’s their right to?

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

So the constitution is the ONLY law, except for some rules you want to stop people from hunting with guns you don’t personally approve of?

For real! Unbelievable opinion there. Sad to see.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Maybe I’ll go turn my 13 big game animals that died to an 80 grain ELDX since September back in, and apologize to their families that the average distance travelled from shot until death was less than 40 yards.

 

[Lawnboi]

243 87 vmax: good
224 88 eldm: bad

Arrow: ethical
223: unethical

 

[Article 4]

Maybe I’ll go turn my 13 big game animals that died to an 80 grain ELDX since September back in, and apologize to their families that the average distance travelled from shot until death was less than 40 yards.

good plan - i am sure the local zoo wondered how they died