2018 for First Lite...30 new pieces.

[Mz71]

Did you see a hooded Halstead? Probably the only thing I will look to add to my setup.

 

[wind gypsy]

My biggest challenge is always regulating heat, I sweat too much.. it doesnt look like they make much use of pit zips in pieces like the new soft shell or hip zips in pants.. First lite and Sitka must lose a pile of sales to kuiu by refusing to add these features (and zip off bottoms) to more pieces.

That's fine but damnit, I don't want to buy kuiu.

 

[N2TRKYS]

I saw only a hooded version. Callahan was there extolling the virtues of the hood, so I doubt there is a hoodless. Also, I’m not sure if that jacket replaces the uncompahgre or not. I also had a 10 minute discussion with them about zipoff baselayer pants. Unfortunately, I was unable to convince them to make some! Looks like Kuiu capris for all my friends. The merino x is stretchier and a has a different feel than old merino. Still quiet, but not as soft? Soft May not be be right word for it. Also they changed the stitching to a vertical stitch. Can’t tell you how durable it will be. Should resist picking up burrs, etc better.

Thanks for the info.

 

[mpg07]

Is it just me, or do they make a very limited amount of product? seems to be always sold out.

 

[ChrisC]

I also had a 10 minute discussion with them about zipoff baselayer pants. Unfortunately, I was unable to convince them to make some! Looks like Kuiu capris for all my friends.

Did they offer some sort of explanation as to why they are not making zip off bottoms? There seems to be a lot of interest and kuiu's merino is just not nearly as soft and comfortable as First Lites.

 

[dplantz]

My biggest challenge is always regulating heat, I sweat too much.. it doesnt look like they make much use of pit zips in pieces like the new soft shell or hip zips in pants.. First lite and Sitka must lose a pile of sales to kuiu by refusing to add these features (and zip off bottoms) to more pieces.

That's fine but damnit, I don't want to buy kuiu.

Wear corrugate pants and layer aerowool/Merino on top. Bring a puffy and puffy pants if you wanna sit still a while after climbing.

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[MT_Wyatt]

Other notes:
Not sure why they filled a puffy with 800 down and 37.5. Don’t know what benefit you get by mixing the two

Thanks for the report.

On down/syn mixes - moisture migration and resistance to clumping/moisture penetration are normally cited. Generally the idea is to leverage the strengths of both. Since it’s a much burlier looking jacket, I’m guessing they are less concerned with moisture resistance as absolute warmth would be more the priority.

On merino outer layer toughness, I’d also agree that it doesn’t seem like the ideal material. The lack of shine is a really nice feature over poly though. If they could pull of a tough (and well fitted!) hoody in a merino blend that would be a nice piece to try.



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[TheCougar]

Did they offer some sort of explanation as to why they are not making zip off bottoms? There seems to be a lot of interest and kuiu's merino is just not nearly as soft and comfortable as First Lites.

Basically, why would you want zip off base layers when you can have puffy zip offs? I told him because they cost half as much and weigh half as much, and it may not be cold enough to warrant puffy pants. Then there is the whole durability piece of it. I didn’t convince him. He doesn’t see why I would want them over the puffy pants.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Basically, why would you want zip off base layers when you can have puffy zip offs? I told him because they cost half as much and weigh half as much, and it may not be cold enough to warrant puffy pants. Then there is the whole durability piece of it. I didn’t convince him. He doesn’t see why I would want them over the puffy pants.

Apples and oranges to me.

I wear a base layer while moving in really cold weather. Zip on/off bottoms are a great way to remove them when it is hot or put them on when cold without removing boots.

Imo puffy pants a going to be mainly used only when Still. Zip on and off is great if not essential for this use.

Really two different things imo.

 

[dotman]

Basically, why would you want zip off base layers when you can have puffy zip offs? I told him because they cost half as much and weigh half as much, and it may not be cold enough to warrant puffy pants. Then there is the whole durability piece of it. I didn’t convince him. He doesn’t see why I would want them over the puffy pants.

Too bad they think/feel this way, guess customer input doesn’t matter? I’m not using my puffy pants in Sep but like to use a base layer bottom in the morning but at about 10am I peel them off.

 

[dplantz]

If you're going to be moving and will get too warm for base layers, then don't wear the base layer in the first place. Heaven forbid your legs are a tiny bit chilly for a minute while you're getting started up the mountain. Or starting up from a stop and sit where you had the puffy pants on. And I'm not so sure puffy pants weigh more than base layers. Definitely not as compact, but I think weight is pretty comparable. Good on Callaghan for standing his ground and not copycatting another company's lesser solution.

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[Hiwallman]

Anyone know if the original Uncompaghree is going to remain in the line or has it been totally replaced with the newer version with down fill. Also...is the dry earth color being continued in all pieces??....I need a large puffy in dry earth color. Thanks.

 

[MuleyFever]

If you're going to be moving and will get too warm for base layers, then don't wear the base layer in the first place. Heaven forbid your legs are a tiny bit chilly for a minute while you're getting started up the mountain. Or starting up from a stop and sit where you had the puffy pants on. And I'm not so sure puffy pants weigh more than base layers. Definitely not as compact, but I think weight is pretty comparable. Good on Callaghan for standing his ground and not copycatting another company's lesser solution.

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Merino base layers regulate heat much better than puffy pieces. That is why they are superior, not inferior options when moving/stopping/moving. This is why we wear base layers and not just a soft shell material next to skin and throw on a puffy every time we stop to glass. The ability to wear a base layer for the colder periods of the day and remove that layer easily is a great option.

 

[doverpack12]

Basically, why would you want zip off base layers when you can have puffy zip offs? I told him because they cost half as much and weigh half as much, and it may not be cold enough to warrant puffy pants. Then there is the whole durability piece of it. I didn’t convince him. He doesn’t see why I would want them over the puffy pants.

Should have asked him why they even offer Merino bottoms if the puffy zip offs solve all the problems. I’ll keep enjoying my kuiu Merino zip offs. Neither first lite pant offered to this point has the ability to go through all conditions without putting on and removing Merino bottoms. They also refuse to put hip vents In pants which is just ignorant.

 

[wind gypsy]

Wear corrugate pants and layer aerowool/Merino on top. Bring a puffy and puffy pants if you wanna sit still a while after climbing.

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This is basically what I do, but with attack pants. I wear no base bottoms to the low 20s and still sweat my ass off in pants without hip zips. The stitching in the crotch of my corrugates tried to help by falling apart but that's not a preferred solution. I'm good in a Wilkin and Chama hoody to the 20s too, unless it's windy. When I put a shell on for wind the pit zips help from sweating a lot too.

Haven't needed the zip off bottoms but see the utility for other situations.

 

[Desk Jockey]

If you're going to be moving and will get too warm for base layers, then don't wear the base layer in the first place. Heaven forbid your legs are a tiny bit chilly for a minute while you're getting started up the mountain. Or starting up from a stop and sit where you had the puffy pants on. And I'm not so sure puffy pants weigh more than base layers. Definitely not as compact, but I think weight is pretty comparable. Good on Callaghan for standing his ground and not copycatting another company's lesser solution.

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Hey bud. It’s a preference. Maybe you don’t see the value but others do. Kinda like a hood on a Halstead fleece or a softshell or More pockets on a softshell. Seems like FL took that feedback to heart and made changes.

Some of their customers - no you, but others - are saying they like FL base layers more than other brands but wish they had an option for zip off.

As far as zip off being a kuiu design, I had a set of army polypropylene bottoms split down the seams and sewn with velcro so I could remove them without taking off my pants and boots in 1996. Somewhere I have som Pictures of me in my “stripper undies”, so that concept has certainly been around at least that long and I stole the idea from a ranger buddy so really even longer.

Maybe you wouldn’t buy them, but I would.

 

[N2TRKYS]

If you're going to be moving and will get too warm for base layers, then don't wear the base layer in the first place. Heaven forbid your legs are a tiny bit chilly for a minute while you're getting started up the mountain. Or starting up from a stop and sit where you had the puffy pants on. And I'm not so sure puffy pants weigh more than base layers. Definitely not as compact, but I think weight is pretty comparable. Good on Callaghan for standing his ground and not copycatting another company's lesser solution.

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X2

That's why I want to add a puffy pant. Merino base layers don't do me any good for what I need.

 

[HeadnWest]

If you're going to be moving and will get too warm for base layers, then don't wear the base layer in the first place. Heaven forbid your legs are a tiny bit chilly for a minute while you're getting started up the mountain. Or starting up from a stop and sit where you had the puffy pants on. And I'm not so sure puffy pants weigh more than base layers. Definitely not as compact, but I think weight is pretty comparable. Good on Callaghan for standing his ground and not copycatting another company's lesser solution.

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I would not call it a lesser solution, that would just be your opinion. Factually, it is another option. An option that some other people like.

That's totally fine that you do not like the zip off baselayers and that you have a system that works for you. But there are others who find them extremely useful. Everyone experiences are going to be different. We can only offer what our opinions are, but cannot consider them absolute, as others have different experiences and opinions.

 

[hflier]

Ha, not anymore, taken down.

It is unclear, does the new catalyst system include pants too?


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[HeadnWest]

It is unclear, does the new catalyst system include pants too?


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According to their youtube video, it does come as a jacket and pants system.

Catalyst Softshell System - YouTube