Winchester 6.8 Western 162gr Copper Impact ammo CAUTION!!!

[cuttingedge]

I got my 6.8 Western Winchester XPR and have been attempting to sight it in. Using the Copper Impact I have not been getting anything close to good results. The primers are smashed pretty flat. In the same box, the bolt won't close on some rounds, it closes tightly on some, and once chambered some will not extract. I cycled the reminder of the box just through the rifle without firing them, and it is throughout. I will not shoot anymore of them.

I have also been shooting the Wonchester 170gr power point with none of the above issues. I will contact Winchester about this ammo.

 

[Truaxdw]

Might just be that lot. Check any other boxes if you have more than one. Same thing happen to me with factory nosler e-tips in 7mm-08. I’d give them a call. They will make it right.

 

[cuttingedge]

I went back to the store I purchased them from because this is the only ammo they have and it's all the same lot. I was not expecting a refund, I just wanted to make them aware of the problems with the ammo.

I have messaged Winchester about the problem and expect to hear from them Monday. If not, I will call them.

 

[cuttingedge]

I finally got to talk to a person at Winchester Ammo after several attempts to contact them. I was pretty disappointed. They told me I would get a call in 5 to 7 days to resolve the bad ammo issue.

To be blunt, this ammo with the inconsistent brass could be dangerous and might cause a catastrophic failure. The folks at Winchester didn't seem very concerned with the issues I had with it. I am going to take some measurements of the unfired rounds tomorrow and will add the info here.

 

[doc holiday13]

have you run a go and no-go gauge through your gun yet?

 

[cuttingedge]

have you run a go and no-go gauge through your gun yet?

I haven't. The 170gr ammo did not exhibit any issues. All cycled fine. Primers still had Radius evident at the edges. Primer dimples after firing looked fine. It just wasn't accurate enough. It was only with the copper impact that I saw the problems.

 

[doc holiday13]

I haven't. The 170gr ammo did not exhibit any issues. All cycled fine. Primers still had Radius evident at the edges. Primer dimples after firing looked fine. It just wasn't accurate enough. It was only with the copper impact that I saw the problems.

Well a go gauge would rule out your guns chamber being possibly too small

 

[cuttingedge]

These are 2 different boxes of the 162gr Copper Impact fired from the same rifle. If you look at the primers, you can see some are just hammered and some have more normal looking primers. In the boxes of 170gr Power Point they all look uniform with no over pressure signs. I measured the unfired cartridges. The stated dimension is 1.7435". Measuring using a stationary magnifying glass and my digital calipers, I got from 1.730" to 1.751". I realize an optical comparator would be ideal, but I don't happen to have one of those at my house. I have been a Quality Manager of a CNC Machine shop in my past life, so I am ok at measuring stuff.

I was taking another closer look at the cases. That round shadow on the base is where firing the case actually pressed the brass base into the machined ejector hole.

 

[Gila]

Copper fouling can be an issue with new barrels. I always make sure that the chamber and bore are clean through out the break in process. Once my barrels settle in the copper fouling is minimal.

But what I see here is that they may have seated the bullets too long and you are actually jamming the bullet in the lands causing over pressure. That is why the bolt won’t close or is difficult to close. I would measure the COAL of the unfired PowerPoints and the CIs with your mic. Should be the same. The meplat on mono bullets is very long but the OGIVE should be the same distance to the base of the case (CBTO) as the PowerPoints. If it was a headspace issue the Powerpoints would have shot the same way. In any event, I think you are correct to not shoot any more of the CI rounds. Winchester needs to take care of this.

 

[jrock_jeep]

I had some federal fusion do this in an old model 70 300wsm. It was the only ammo to ever to that, some were really hard to lift the bolt and eject. Took it to my gunsmith and he found nothing wrong with the rifle. It was decided that this batch of ammo was just garbage. I've never bought fusion again.

 

[cuttingedge]

Copper fouling can be an issue with new barrels. I always make sure that the chamber and bore are clean through out the break in process. Once my barrels settle in the copper fouling is minimal.

But what I see here is that they may have seated the bullets too long and you are actually jamming the bullet in the lands causing over pressure. That is why the bolt won’t close or is difficult to close. I would measure the COAL of the unfired PowerPoints and the CIs with your mic. Should be the same. The meplat on mono bullets is very long but the OGIVE should be the same distance to the base of the case (CBTO) as the PowerPoints. If it was a headspace issue the Powerpoints would have shot the same way. In any event, I think you are correct to not shoot any more of the CI rounds. Winchester needs to take care of this.

I think I mistated. Not a headpsace issue with the rifle, but fluctuation in the dimension from the base to the shoulder of the ammo. I did measure COAL of the copper impact and it was within the tolerance range.

I sent the ammo back to Winchester almost 2 weeks ago now and have heard nothing.

I did buy some Winchester 165gr Accubond LR and my rifle likes this particular ammo.

 

[Lou270]

I see lot of complaints with the newest
long range rounds (prc, western, et all) for pressure, clickers, chambering etc…. The legacy hunting and battle rounds had tolerances built in (chamber dimensions, taper) for reliable feeding, extraction, and ejection in adverse conditions. The new rounds are built primarily for accuracy using some of the lessons learned from the more ideal conditions of competiton (tight tolerances, minimal taper, sharp shoulders, etc…). Seems to me there is some correlation there?

Lou

 

[cuttingedge]

I see lot of complaints with the newest
long range rounds (prc, western, et all) for pressure, clickers, chambering etc…. The legacy hunting and battle rounds had tolerances built in (chamber dimensions, taper) for reliable feeding, extraction, and ejection in adverse conditions. The new rounds are built primarily for accuracy using some of the lessons learned from the more ideal conditions of competiton (tight tolerances, minimal taper, sharp shoulders, etc…). Seems to me there is some correlation there?

Lou

You know, when I started having issues with this rifle, I honestly wished I had just bought a 30-06 and been done with it. In reality, the trusty ole -06 would do anything I need done, for less money and better ammo availability.

 

[Lou270]

You know, when I started having issues with this rifle, I honestly wished I had just bought a 30-06 and been done with it. In reality, the trusty ole -06 would do anything I need done, for less money and better ammo availability.

I have 2 30-06 and 2 6.8 Western. Best to have the bases covered. Seriously 6.8W is a great round. I think the manufacturers will take some time to work the bugs out of the newest “high performance” stuff in production. The 06 has only had about 120 years of kinks sorted out

Lou