Why so much emphasis on super fast prone shots?

[Hunter26]

I think you should be smart about what you are doing and hope that people use common sense and regardless I know some people won't but do what you want to do. Train how you want to train. I know I have learned a lot by trying things, messing up, getting in a hurry and now my skills to seal the deal have greatly improved. None of that wouldn't be without trying things, messing up, having success and learning.

 

[7RemMag]

The words of my Dad ring in my head here...."Big bucks aren't going to give you a perfect shot." He said with frustration on more than one occasion in my early teenage years hunting alongside him. He'd hunted the same farmlands and woods of Northcentral PA that I cut my teeth on for right around 30 years. He'd most certainly enjoyed his fair share of success. I was young and apprehensive, and missed out on several really nice PA whitetails because I was apprehensive to take the shot and simply not quick enough. 300-400 yard shots in the farmlands weren't uncommon. I was plenty capable of taking some of the shots he was talking about, but I didn't. I would assume mostly due to confidence. I don't regret having not taken those shots, but I most definitely have found that being willing and CAPABLE(That's the important part) of taking those shots has brought more game home. Dad is right. Big bucks haven't always given perfect, broadside, standing shots with lots of time to 'set up".

I virtually never shoot prone. It's not comfortable to me. Instead, my farthest shots have been off a "cradle" tripod. I can get this set up pretty quick, but if I need to be quicker, I'm personally comfortable and practiced offhand at 2-300 yards fairly easily. I've never timed myself, and probably won't as it's not something I strive for. I've never had to take a quick shot like that in the few years I've lived in the West. That doesn't mean being able to won't come in handy some day.

Perhaps these individuals you speak of, which I don't personally feel I've seen, are attempting to measure their abilities so that they know their limitations and capabilities in the field? Assuming that's the case, I can't ever argue that that's a bad thing. Maybe this "training" is helping them build confidence in themselves and their equipment. Out of all the variables when taking a shot at a critter-Distance, time to shoot, position of the animal, rifle/cartridge selection, etc. I feel that the individual capabilities of the shooter and equipment, and their knowing them, and being confident in them, is paramount.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Adding a time element to otherwise low pressure flat range practice is a good way to create pressure similar to what exists in the real world.

Taking time and keeping score is a very common way to create pressure and benchmark skill standards in other shooting disciplines/training. They just haven’t been common been common in hunting practice.

The flip side can suck.

More than once I have been setup on a buck and had wait actual hours for him to take a step. Thats a lot of strain on the body over a prolonged period of time. Since I can't stay in the gun that long there's a lot of backing out of the gun (don't move it) and getting into the gun (don't move it). Not all end in a shot opportunity.

Had a spike get a hair up its butt and blow out a buck I waited half a day on. Had a herd of cattle bust a double drop tine toad that I waited over 6 hours; bedded behind a log and didn't want to shoot him in the head.

Long time on the shot opportunity is a mixed bag. Lots of time for your mind to mess with you but also lots of time to get everything ready to go and including dry fire.

 

[The Guide]

Words have meaning. So not moving animals… got it.

Animals also often just move continuously.

I take the practice as a way to get you to build your position as fast as possible while waiting on the animal to give you a shot opportunity.

There are things you have to do prior to shooting a distance past your maximum point blank range to effectively engage a target. These things take time. The more efficient you can be at doing those things and gaining muscle memory while practicing, the faster you can do it in the field under pressure and time constraints of an animal staying in the target window.

Sometimes it isn't the fact that you have jumped game or that you are taking a shot on moving animals but that the animals are close to a hard boundary or the animal is in a group and getting a good shot opportunity is limited to small windows when the target animal is clear. Anyone who has hunted long enough has had a missed opportunity due to not being ready for the shot when an opportunity was presented. This isn't always a case of a lost animal but just a lost shot opportunity. That opportunity could have been a closer shot, a shorter drag, a better angle, or a multitude of other things. The sooner you get to the position where all you need to do is put the final squeeze on the trigger, the greater your opportunities are.

As far as using prone as the position to gain speed, prone should be the slowest position to build. If you can build your prone position fast, your seated, kneeling, and standing positions should increase in speed just based on the fact you know how to deploy your rifle and other parts of the setup effectively and efficiently. I don't see it as them trying to sell anything but trying to give people a shortened learning curve so that it doesn't take them 40 years self enrichment to become highly effective. These skills are learned by repeatedly doing things and as we all know the number of people who shoot monthly are minimal and those who shoot weekly are almost nonexistent in the grand number of shooters.

Jay

 

[flyfisher117]

People don’t train? Rokslide is upset
People at least training something? Rokslide is upset
People training every scenario they can foresee in their hunts? Rokslide is upset.

TLDR: no matter what you do someone on Rokslide will be upset with how you do it.

 

[omicron1792]

I agree with you. When I started here I thought I had to learn how to shoot prone. I bought bipods and practiced. Then when hunting I realized I have never once had a shot where shooting prone would have helped. My bipods just sit in a drawer now.

Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, the groupthink is strong on this site. Most of it has been helpful to me. Some, like prone shooting, has not.

 

[Skerhunter]

Most people are slow to identify a target, set up the shot, and execute a good shot (I assume most on the slide are way more proficient than the average hunter). I think we can all agree that rifle hunters don’t practice enough or the correct way. I would rather see guys brag/debate about practice on here vs have them take poor rushed shots that wound animals in the field.

This summer I will be doing all sorts of weird stuff in my yard getting ready for archery season!

 

[Jason Snyder]

I’m not into groupthink. My hunting conditions are not the same as someone else’s. I don’t even own a tripod for shooting. All that to say, the faster you can build a stable platform and then execute a good shot, the more opportunities you will create in the field.

Many folks never even practice from field positions. They shoot off a bench. With sandbags. Great.

If the end goal is to be a better shooter in the field, you need to shoot in field settings, from field positions, with your gear. It really doesn’t take that long to execute a perfect shot sequence. Most folks waste a lot of time getting into position and setting up for the shot. If you want to be faster at that you should practice it. If you don’t, drive on.

I can think of one very good whitetail buck I missed an opportunity on because I took far too long getting set up. It had nothing to do with spooking him. He was following does and didn’t stand in the open for very long.

 

[greyghostnw]

Always good to practice a multitude of scenarios like anything to be well tuned at your craft or interests. Practice being uncomfortable. With saying that 90% of my shots are proan and way i hunt typically ill have as much time as i need to assess situation. Upwards of hours. Cant think of a time last few years when in the high country above timber ive had less than an hour to evaluate everything. Knowing your area helps with that though, animals routines etc…Snap shots should be practiced for certain but i focus on other aspects well before any shot fired.. after the shot gets played out and should be high on list to make decisions for success and give honor to your efforts. Good luck

 

[Marshfly]

People don’t train? Rokslide is upset
People at least training something? Rokslide is upset
People training every scenario they can foresee in their hunts? Rokslide is upset.

TLDR: no matter what you do someone on Rokslide will be upset with how you do it.

Why is everyone talking about training? This thread is about shot opportunities.
Who's upset?

 

[The Guide]

Why is everyone talking about training? This thread is about shot opportunities.
Who's upset?

Train for the shot. Maybe we hunt different styles. I (can and have) take a prone shot on almost every animal that I can. Do I have a tripod for areas where prone isn't the best option? Sure but I'm not packing a tripod with me everywhere. I setup my hunting style so that prone is always an option. Walk higher ground, use higher ground to stalk closer. I might be able to get closer and only have a standing offhand shot but instead, I work the terrain to get a vantage point to shoot from. I'll take a 300 yard prone shot over a 100 yard offhand running shot every day.

Jay

 

[Beendare]

Yes, being efficient with your weapons system is stupid....

Love the sarcasm!

I'm an archery guy so sure...it's different from long range shooting but some of the same principles apply.
I have seen many bowhunters lose their shot opportunities by taking too long....or stray thoughts crept in that held them back.

Inevitably they say, "I didn't have a shot"
No, you did have a shot..... you just weren't ready to take it.

I've seen the same guiding some rifle guys. When testing their rifles on arrival, they shot well but took their sweet time to do it.

I think its a skill worth improving.....

 

[Chris in TN]

I'm a lifelong hunter that has averaged 3-4 deer per year for 35+ years now and maybe more - I long ago stopped counting - nevermind the coyotes and other stuff. I have shot deer offhanded, from improvised field rests, seated behind a tripod, seated behind a tall bipod, seated behind crossed sticks, draped over tree limbs or tree trunks, prone over a fire ant mound (don't try in warm weather), prone over a ditchbank, using backpacks and binocular for front rest prone, prone behind a harris bipod....ehhh, you name it.

My shooting regime is to shoot something different every day. Other than confirming zero or load development avoid the bench. Be the only guy at the range shooting prone or crosslegged. GO SQUIRREL HUNTING A LOT. Nothing has honed my shooting more than squirrel hunting and learning to make do with whatever rest is handy when I see half of a squirrel's head rising over a forked limb. Any rest is better than offhanded. A length of paracord looped over a tree limb above you then held in your left hand while you shoot 'offhand' position, is light years better than full offhand, if you're sitting in or under a tree. A bogpod seems heavy until you're trying to shoot in brush too tall for prone. Two arrows with the tips rubber-banded together for a rear cross-stick rest can be combined with a tripod or other improvised front rest and increase your effective range by perhaps 30-50% over a front rest alone, and I have killed deer with just the two arrows rubber-banded as a front rest. A single stick or tree limb whittled from a nearby tree, held in your left hand with the other end jabbed in the ground, is more than sufficient for 100+ yard shots at deer while seated.
Learn to use everything, be ready to use anything. Literally anything taller than ground level is a potential rest. Learn what works well enough. Prone can't be beat if the terrain allows it but a lot of terrain won't allow it. And also learn when to forget all that and just shoot, when you have to.

Also, when I am practicing, my norm is to take one, or perhaps two, rounds of ammo, whether I'm shooting at home or driving to the local range. Get into position (Ideally after a short hike - I can do that at home), fire one shot. If you miss, you either shoot again and make a hit really fast or walk back home dejected. Might as well get used to that before you go hunting.

 

[Ryan Avery]

I see you got the jump to conclusions game for Christmas.

This has zero to do with what you said.

Being proficient isn’t what I’m asking about all, though it seems most here made that assumption for some reason.

I simply don’t see all these rushed prone shot opportunities. I guess others hunt in ways that they do. But it seems lots here also don’t.

Many hunters operate within their own bubble, believing that if something doesn’t happen to them, it must not happen at all. However, I see a different perspective. I hunt with a variety of people in different terrains and witness missed opportunities every year, not just during quick prone shots. You specifically mentioned quick prone shots, but in general, hunters struggle with all shooting positions. We invest a significant amount of money, time, and effort in hunting each year, and DIY hunting is becoming increasingly challenging due to fewer opportunities available. We should strive to be lethal in every scenario.

 

[Andrew12gauge]

I killed this buck when we were moving through some country, I didn’t see him until he and his does saw me. I got prone and made the 318 yd shot in less than a minute of him spooking. He and his does paused at that point to look back before going over the ridge. He slid/rolled down into the creek bottom. That is why sometimes you need to make a fast prone shot

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jason Snyder]

I shot this deer at about 275 yards. I was sitting in some trees glassing a semi open canopy and understory. This buck came off the hill from his bed. I shoved my pack ahead of me, proned out and shot him. Time from seeing him to death was probably 10 seconds. Another 10 and I might not have had an opportunity at him.

 

[Dioni A]

I've shot probably 80 percent of my animals in the prone position. Some hurried most not. The emphasis on speed in the class is too simulate stress as others have said. If your not getting the original point of your question by this point I'm agreeing with others that the real intention of this thread was too point out your own opinions. we trained pretty much every position you can think of. Most of the pictures are just of guys in the prone.

 

[Tmac]

In order of frequency, sitting off sticks, off hand, using rock/tree/etc., kneeling off sticks, prone off pack/rolled up clothes/etc. Position usually dictated by vegetation, distance and time. Why wouldn’t you practice all positions you may use so you can be quick but not in a hurry?

 

[roosiebull]

I can think of a few critters I’ve killed that would have lived if I couldn’t get in a very stable position fast, and I can think of several more critters that lived because the shooter couldn’t get in a stable position fast. (Including myself)

I don’t see the conspiracy or controversy of pushing people to get in very stable positions quickly. Even if you never have to get prone fast, being well practiced doing so will be a benefit.

Doing things faster makes the situation that much more chill and controlled when you have plenty of time, and not having that ability creates more pressure/urgency no matter how much time you have

If you think it doesn’t apply to you, just do your thing. No reason to get offended by people who see the value in it.

There are so many scenarios here on the coast where shot opportunities are quick and fleeting, like you have a very short window, and once it’s passed that window, you will never see it again

 

[Marshfly]

Many hunters operate within their own bubble, believing that if something doesn’t happen to them, it must not happen at all. However, I see a different perspective. I hunt with a variety of people in different terrains and witness missed opportunities every year, not just during quick prone shots. You specifically mentioned quick prone shots, but in general, hunters struggle with all shooting positions. We invest a significant amount of money, time, and effort in hunting each year, and DIY hunting is becoming increasingly challenging due to fewer opportunities available. We should strive to be lethal in every scenario.

I totally agree Ryan.
The quippy response was uncalled for however. I was asking a very genuine question about opportunities and nothing about training.

If your not getting the original point of your question by this point I'm agreeing with others that the real intention of this thread was too point out your own opinions.

You see what you want to see. I can't control what you assume about my intentions...
I also can't control how long people continue to respond here.

It's interesting how many people are claiming to take the VAST majority of shots prone. That honestly shocks me.

And as I stated in the very first post, that was my actual inquiry. The attacks on my intent are eye opening and lead me to think I am not really interested in participating here much any more. I see that more and more from members here as time goes on. It's pretty discouraging and disappointing. Especially when it comes from the owner of the site.