Why are people cutting barrels off

[ORJoe]

People are looking at how much velocity is lost with a shorter barrel (it's not much) and what does that translate to in terms of lost range for a given result (also not much) and then honestly realizing that they can't shoot that far anyway.

 

[Bluefish]

Velocity isn't quite over rated as it's the most important component to Energy. Energy equals mass (off the bullet in this case) x velocity squared. So losses in velocity have much more impact on energy. Cutting your barrel reduces velocity typically by 50 ft/sec per inch. So by losing that velocity, the bullet energy drops more than linearly...hence the need for better bullet construction

Having hunted with subsonic for the first time this year, velocity is not critical to taking an animal. Velocity is important for bullet performance and time of flight (drop). If you match velocity and bullet performance, the job gets done. No real magic of any caliber/cartridge. Imho where velocity is important is long range. No way to shoot a long way without velocity, but better bc can help make it less important.

 

[mt100gr.]

Velocity isn't quite over rated as it's the most important component to Energy. Energy equals mass (off the bullet in this case) x velocity squared. So losses in velocity have much more impact on energy. Cutting your barrel reduces velocity typically by 50 ft/sec per inch. So by losing that velocity, the bullet energy drops more than linearly...hence the need for better bullet construction

I can't say 50fps/inch is or isn't, but I've never seen that much lost when cutting a barrel. Typically 20 -30 fps/inch.

Figure out the max range you'll be hunting and how much barrel you need to get a good bullet there at better than the minimum impact velocity for reliable upset for that bullet. Done.

"Energy", if you're talking ft lbs and some magic number, doesn't tell you anything.

Merry Christmas!

 

[JohnJohnson]

"Energy", if you're talking ft lbs and some magic number, doesn't tell you anything.

It's about knowing the limits of your cartridge and bullet. For instance I just ran the numbers for my 6.5CM which puts out 143 ELD-X bullets at 2600 fps at the muzzle. I can kill elk out to 300 yards with that combo after which it drops below 1500 ft/lbs of energy and can no longer penetrate the skin of an elk due to lack of KNOCKDOWN POWER®™.

 

[TaperPin]

I began to accept much shorter barrels - main gun now has 24” barrels, down from 26”. As a back up if it doesn’t work out I do have one 26” 7 mag.

I feel better about the 24” when it’s not directly next to the 26”.

Most of my life the 26” was a good trade off - very little extra weight and adds a measurable amount to the velocity - essentially for free. 27” would probably be better.

The most inefficient thing someone can do is cut down a barrel, especially on a long range rifle. Wind drift is the hardest thing to estimate and the more velocity the better to help overcome this. Long range prs, Palma, elr, f class rifles all have barrels 26“ to 30” for a reason - length works.

Short barrels with cans are definitely popular, but it’s not performance based - it’s call of duty/militia based. There’s room for people to shoot whatever they want, I just don’t see the benefit to carbine length barrels for western hunting conditions.

 

[hereinaz]

Short barrels with cans are definitely popular, but it’s not performance based - it’s call of duty/militia based. There’s room for people to shoot whatever they want, I just don’t see the benefit to carbine length barrels for western hunting conditions.

LOL, I missed that the memo going short snd suppressed came from video games cause I have never played Call or Duty or been in a Militia. It could be true, maybe I am following a trend. I did assemble snd stamp two SBR in AR platform, a 14” .223 (hunting) and a 5” 300 BO (fun/defense).

And, I hunt in western conditions.

I thought I just wanted a shorter rifle I could carry Sis shoot suppressed. I figured I could go to a smaller caliber and shorter barrel and pretty well match my ballistics of my 7 mm out to 7-800 with my .25.

The vast majority of long range shots successfully taken on game in my presence and by the guys I have gotten into long range have been taken in conditions that my .25 will work just fine.

Probably all the shots, 60% inside 300 yards, then 20% to 600, 10% to 800 and 10% to 1000.

To me, that ratio says short barrel small magnum for wind, weight, and size.

And, now that I started the suppressor trend in my very small hunting/shooting circle, the guys with suppressors have followed with short barrels. The cave men shooting brakes still have their 26” barrels that are the same length as our suppressed rifles.

I am a huge proponent of being prepared and capable to make long range shots. And, really only the 800 yard plus shots would need my 7mm with 26” barrel. I am OK with walking away from all of the 800 yard plus shots, but my 7mm will be in the truck as backup if those are the only shots a hunt is presenting.

The trend doesn’t effect even the VAST majority of western hunters who will never shoot past 500 yards, and a lot of them are the ones running shorter barrels because velocity is a much smaller factor inside that range, and most of their shots will even be inside 300 yards, just like me.

 

[Billy Goat]

It's about knowing the limits of your cartridge and bullet. For instance I just ran the numbers for my 6.5CM which puts out 143 ELD-X bullets at 2600 fps at the muzzle. I can kill elk out to 300 yards with that combo after which it drops below 1500 ft/lbs of energy and can no longer penetrate the skin of an elk due to lack of KNOCKDOWN POWER®™.

And this is why we need the sarcasm faces.

 

[mtwarden]

Call to Duty FTW

 

[mt100gr.]

Short barrels with cans are definitely popular, but it’s not performance based - it’s call of duty/militia based. There’s room for people to shoot whatever they want, I just don’t see the benefit to carbine length barrels for western hunting coconditions.

Never tried to Call a Doody....but if I did, and it came in, I'd shoot it suppressed with a 16-18" barreled rifle.

Lots of benefit to short barrels and suppressors. Keep looking. Less length works.

Merry Christmas!!

 

[fwafwow]

Not sure about poaching, but it definitely is nice to have my rifle in between my legs pointing up when riding in a truck or side by side.

 

[willfrye027]

I’m jealous of you guys who live in suppressor friendly states.

Since I can’t have one, I like 26”. Less muzzle blast and muzzle rise is the biggest reason for me.

 

[Billy Goat]

Here's one way to look at it. A lot of bullets are loosing 175 ish fps per 100 yards. If you cut your barrel down 5" and loose 30 fps per inch, you still aren't loosing 100 yards of velocity.

If you aren't planning on really pushing that gun to max distance, why do you need it? It's costing you 80 yards for easier handling. So if you had the velocity for 800 yards, well you took it down to say 720. If you aren't planning but 600 and in, or even less, what are you really giving up?

 

[TaperPin]

There’s nothing wrong if someone wants to shoot a short barreled rifle with the performance of a smaller cartridge it’s just not for me. I try to get rifles to shoot as fast as they can safely - looping off a giant chunk of barrel to avoid wearing ear plugs just doesn’t compute.

 

[fwafwow]

There’s nothing wrong if someone wants to shoot a short barreled rifle with the performance of a smaller cartridge it’s just not for me.

To me it’s not the performance of a smaller cartridge. It’s the performance of the same cartridge, but at a distance/range that is relevant to me. Plus all of the other benefits that have been stated elsewhere

 

[JohnJohnson]

The most inefficient thing someone can do is cut down a barrel, especially on a long range rifle. Wind drift is the hardest thing to estimate and the more velocity the better to help overcome this. Long range prs, Palma, elr, f class rifles all have barrels 26“ to 30” for a reason - length works. Short barrels with cans are definitely popular, but it’s not performance based - it’s call of duty/militia based. There’s room for people to shoot whatever they want, I just don’t see the benefit to carbine length barrels for western hunting conditions.

They also know that heavier guns are easier to shoot so the top shooters are all rocking 20-25+ pound rigs. Have you followed their lead on that too? Or have you ignored it in favor of a more practical solution, like people who hunt suppressed have done with their barrel length?

 

[Wrench]

I'm willing to argue with anyone about energy's lack of importance in making animals dead.

Someone feel free to kick the ball and I'll happily return it.

 

[PantherCity]

Except gain 240 fps and quite a bit of downrange energy... oh, and burn all the cartridge powder for even more efficiency.

Cutting a barrel from 26" to 18" increases recoil and adds muzzle blast tremendously... catalyzing the NEED for a suppressor.

So the short barrel is producing less energy at the muzzle but is somehow sending more energy back into your shoulder via recoil?

I think Newtons 3rd law of motion would prove that false.

Or is all that unburned powder causing the rifle to be propelled back into your shoulder like a rocket?


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[pirogue]

Some of these weight reduction proponents (for chopping) are probably in the 6.5 Creedmor, less recoil, crowd favored by the women and feeble old men.

 

[jimh406]

Some of these weight reduction proponents (for chopping) are probably in the 6.5 Creedmor, less recoil, crowd favored by the women and feeble old men.

Based on what I've seen here, there aren't many old men who favor the 6.5. They seem to be the opposite.

 

[Marble]

I doubt I will ever cut a barrel. A 22" barrel in a standard caliber is not long at all. I would rather have the velocity.

IME, there is a 40-100 fps gain loss with barrel with each inch of barrel length lost. There is a point of diminishing returns in both directions and the added benefit of length varies wildly among cartridges.

Generally, longer barrels can shoot slower powders better. Thus, shooting a 26 vs a 24" barrel in my magnum guns makes a gigantic difference.

I really am only concerned with a couple guns where I care about getting the most speed. Most of my guns, I only look for accuracy.

If I could shoot a suppressor here in CA, I definitely would.

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