Why are bullets frequently found just under the hide on the opposite side?

[Caseknife]

I've shot nothing but Barnes TSX and TTSX for well over 20 years and I would say that half of my shots have ended up under the off side hide on elk and those have all been 150 yrds or less. The bullet expended all the energy inside the animal and hit the "trampoline" hide.

 

[The Guide]

It has more to do with pressure and how a physical body is designed to stand up to pressure. If you blow up a balloon and slowly insert a long needle into it, you will find that the needle easily passes through the first side but is much more difficult to pass through the second side to exit the balloon due to the way forces are distributed.

Jay

 

[180ls1]

Okay. I have thought about it.

Since it’s not complicated, How much does the hide have to stretch before the bullet breaks through?

I have a video of a 225eldm entering a hard quartering away buck. I was amazed how big the "temporary dent" was the bullet made as it pushed in. It by no means "cut" its way in.

 

[hereinaz]

Next animal you down, push a blunted arrow through the hide with a force meter and let us know.

I am going to take my force meter and do just that!!!

I am interested.

 

[E.Shell]

I don't have a force meter...yet. You guys are costing me a lot of money here.

 

[Trumpkin The Dwarf]

I am going to take my force meter and do just that!!!

I am interested.

Careful, the arrow may snap before it punctures.

 

[hereinaz]

Careful, the arrow may snap before it punctures.

The force meter I bought has some different screw on attachments I am going to use. Probably thread some stuff for it too.

Making the contraption to hold the hide in a repeatable way is going to take the most time, I think. Gonna be simple, 2 wood frames and screw them together. But, make them in such a way that it completely traps the hide and doesn’t let anything slide. I think one larger than the other so they nest inside each other. So it is stretched like a drum.

 

[Formidilosus]

The force meter I bought has some different screw on attachments I am going to use. Probably thread some stuff for it too.

Making the contraption to hold the hide in a repeatable way is going to take the most time, I think. Gonna be simple, 2 wood frames and screw them together. But, make them in such a way that it completely traps the hide and doesn’t let anything slide. I think one larger than the other so they nest inside each other. So it is stretched like a drum.

That isn’t going to measure the force required on an animal.

 

[hereinaz]

That isn’t going to measure the force required on an animal.

No, it won’t, but still interesting and fun experiment.

An entire hide on an animal will get a lot of stretch and the hide is connected by the fibers to the muscle and bone. And, a static force is going to be different than a moving bullet.

It will at least show the difference between a pointed object and a blunt one. I don’t even think I could push a mushroomed bullet through a hide. That will be an interesting comparison to me.

 

[35WhelenAI]

They don't have much surface area, so the small surface area yields higher pressure on that surface vs a well expanded mushroom spreading it over a larger area.

I've seen tiny exit wounds from the Barnes I have used. Don't use them much anymore.

Barnes bullets with copper petals cut tissue. They don't bludgeon it. Of course they will be more prone to exit cleanly and with a less impressive hole. At what point in the animals death did a small exit hole have a negative affect?

 

[LostWapiti]

I have recovered a bunch of bullets under the far side hide. I think that's a good thing. All of its energy is absorbed into the animal. Mission accomplished I would say.

I’m always conflicted on this. I love dumping energy but I also like having a big leaking hole.

 

[Taudisio]

I’m always conflicted on this. I love dumping energy but I also like having a big leaking hole.

“Dumping energy”

 

[LostWapiti]

“Dumping energy”
View attachment 775933

love that too

 

[5MilesBack]

At what point in the animals death did a small exit hole have a negative affect?

It's not the effect on death, it's the effect on blood trails and being able to find the animals quickly and easily.

But even two holes doesn't guarantee that. I shot a cow one time with the 7mag and a 175gr Partition. Two holes, heart shot.......not a drop of blood in the snow for several yards and then only a single drop. Several yards later a few drops, then at about 100 yards a small pool, then at about 1/4 mile the cow slumped over a blowdown. Without snow she would have been tough to track.

Similar things happen with ML shots.......only one hole, and not a drop of blood on the ground.

 

[35WhelenAI]

I get it, I'm playing a bit of the devils advocate here. No argumentative intentions intended. You found the animals, and didn't make mention a small exit was an issue with respect to finding the animals with the copper bullets.

You do mention the 175 grain Partition above. Yes, Partitions typically finish their path through an animal and exit with more or less bullet diameter frotal area after the front of the bullet has been lost during expansion.

 

[roadrunner]

The force meter I bought has some different screw on attachments I am going to use. Probably thread some stuff for it too.

Making the contraption to hold the hide in a repeatable way is going to take the most time, I think. Gonna be simple, 2 wood frames and screw them together. But, make them in such a way that it completely traps the hide and doesn’t let anything slide. I think one larger than the other so they nest inside each other. So it is stretched like a drum.

"Back in the day", the bowhunting crowd already did this with mechanical's and fixed. The mechanical tested to "debunk" lethality was the Punchcutter and the fixed with the lowest amount of "force" required to initiate a cut was the Bear Super Razorhead.

Yeah...it was that long ago.

 

[omicron1792]

Both shots from 150yards 6.5prc stopped just under opposite hide. It is funny how they do that. I agree it’s with shorter shots, the bullet exploded early. The shot side ribcage had a much bigger hole than the offside, which was just the shank still going.

 

[Loo.wii]

Okay. I have thought about it.

Since it’s not complicated, How much does the hide have to stretch before the bullet breaks through?

Someone much smarter than me probably has a math equation that could answer this exactly.

 

[LostWapiti]

Someone much smarter than me probably has a math equation that could answer this exactly.

There’s so many variables though. The question is sort of worded backwards if you are looking for a numerical answer. The hide will stretch as much as it can depending on the strength and elasticity of the hide as well and the strength and elasticity of the fascia.

The hide does not have to stretch at all for the bullet to break through.

The question should be, “How much does a hide stretch before a bullet will penetrate?” I’m very curious how much stretch is happening with the captured bullets. Would be very cool to see on high speed camera and measure it.