Vote - MOA or MIL

[Rock-o]

I bought my first MIL scope and I have a headache from zeroing it and validating my dope out to 1000 yards. Give me MOA any day of the week. Its a tenmile 3-18x50 if anybody wants to trade me the same scope in MOA…lol . I think once everything is validated, dialing MIL is MOA shouldnt make much difference. Making adjustments on the fly however I am screwed. My head just works in MOAs apparently.

I'm not sure how mils gave you a headache. I think it's the scope not the unit of angular measurement. Maybe flawed glass - just a guess, I've never looked through that model (or even brand).

 

[PredatorSlayer]

I'm not sure how mils gave you a headache. I think it's the scope not the unit of angular measurement. Maybe flawed glass - just a guess, I've never looked through that model (or even brand).

Maybe trijicon sucks…its my first one. Although I think the glass is as good as my NX8.

 

[Rock-o]

Maybe trijicon sucks…its my first one. Although I think the glass is as good as my NX8.

Heh, I don't know about that. But, I know my mil-based NX8 has good glass and it doesn't give me a headache. <shrugs>

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Maybe trijicon sucks…its my first one. Although I think the glass is as good as my NX8.

lol I thought just maybe too busy, units of 10 or units of 4...I guess it all depends if your trying to whoop ass on steel or fill the freezer and put some bone on the wall? I'm with you on the units of 4...less likely to give headaches haha

ps it's can't be the Trijicon lol

 

[PredatorSlayer]

lol I thought just maybe too busy, units of 10 or units of 4...I guess it all depends if your trying to whoop ass on steel or fill the freezer and put some bone on the wall? I'm with you on the units of 4...less likely to give headaches haha

ps it's can't be the Trijicon lol

All my targets are made up of 1” squares. So I am 6” low and 3” to the right trying to zero. Moa - no problem. MILs - had to think a little bit. Then I am validating my drops. I am 7” low at 600…head is spinning trying to figure out how many mills I need to adjust. I just think in MOAs, so much easier for me. Once everything is validated it doesnt make a difference. Range, dial moa or mil and pull the trigger.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

All my targets are made up of 1” squares. So I am 6” low and 3” to the right trying to zero. Moa - no problem. MILs - had to think a little bit. Then I am validating my drops. I am 7” low at 600…head is spinning trying to figure out how many mills I need to adjust. I just think in MOAs, so much easier for me. Once everything is validated it doesnt make a difference. Range, dial moa or mil and pull the trigger.

totally right, start building 3.6" target squares lol...kidding, I thought that's what you meant by headache ...the stuffing of 10 units into the 4 we already know so well, we definitely know what a handful of inches is, we handle that multiple times a day, might not get any dates telling the girls it's 1.7 mils though

just try to be real about what you need for what you're doing and if shizzo goes sideways in the field what will be your instinct? are you solo hunter? etc. for hunting and solo work you need the most basic simple set up possible in units you are institutionalized in imo, anything will work for targets, and lots of it will work for hunting most of the time, but what will work best when shtf and you go on auto-pilot needing to close the deal?

 

[Mpw20]

I vote mils. Tried everything and that worked best for me and the guys I train with.

 

[Formidilosus]

All my targets are made up of 1” squares. So I am 6” low and 3” to the right trying to zero. Moa - no problem. MILs - had to think a little bit. Then I am validating my drops. I am 7” low at 600…head is spinning trying to figure out how many mills I need to adjust. I just think in MOAs, so much easier for me. Once everything is validated it doesnt make a difference. Range, dial moa or mil and pull the trigger.

You have a tape measure 3.5” in front of your eye. Why are you thinking in inches instead of using the tape measure?

 

[Ope]

I had the same problem. I've always been an MOA/inches guy. I was thinking in inches and trying to always get back to inches because it was what I was comfortable with. I couldn't see MILs because I was blinded by 3.6" if that makes sense.

Then it finally clicked for me, you could measure a 20ft log using a 4ft string without knowing how many ft it was. You would just know it was 5 string lengths, you don't actually need to know the ft.

So I do that with MILs I try to spot my hits then measure using my reticle to know I'm "x" amount of MILs off, it doesn't matter how many inches that is. Then I make my corrections. Way faster and easier then trying to guess how many inches I'm off. Now I'm trying to trade a SWFA 6xMOA for 6xMil

 

[PredatorSlayer]

You have a tape measure 3.5” in front of your eye. Why are you thinking in inches instead of using the tape measure?

Its SFP, I don’t even know what the magnification is that gives me full value

 

[Formidilosus]

Its SFP, I don’t even know what the magnification is that gives me full value

Eww. That’s the first problem.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Eww. That’s the first problem.

I have always dialed for wind so it hasn’t been a huge issue. I hate FFPs for hunting

 

[Formidilosus]

I have always dialed for wind so it hasn’t been a huge issue. I hate FFPs for hunting

How do you deal with rapidly changing wind in broken terrain?

 

[Stinky Coyote]

haha, swag method but guys can get real good at that lol

 

[PredatorSlayer]

How do you deal with rapidly changing wind in broken terrain?

I just change my dope…holding for mils or moa is no different than dialing other than holding is a little quicker. I don’t really do much for wind unless it is 500 + yards out. Once it is that far, I am never in a rush to take a shot. You and I both know wind calls over a canyon or varying terrain is an educated guess at best. You mitigate that will high BC bullets. I always take my time to set up. I use a rangefinder that also has my elevation adjustments out to 800 yards.

Recognizing that more than half my kills are sub 300 yards at dusk, SFP has always been better for me.

 

[Formidilosus]

I just change my dope…holding for mils or moa is no different than dialing other than holding is a little quicker.

It’s not a little quicker, it’s a lot. Then when you misread the wind and need to make a makeup shot, do dial the correction in then shoot again? At a possibly (probably) moving animal?

I don’t really do much for wind unless it is 500 + yards out. Once it is that far, I am never in a rush to take a shot.

I suppose we aren’t hunting the same areas then. Even at 200-300 yards it is not in common to be holding a mil plus (4+ MOA) of wind where I hunt. The lulls and gusts are good for a couple of MOA difference between shots.

You and I both know wind calls over a canyon or varying terrain is an educated guess at best. You mitigate that will high BC bullets. I always take my time to set up. I use a rangefinder that also has my elevation adjustments out to 800 yards.

It is an educated guess, one of the ways to bring success percentage up in that case, is that when you do miss call the wind, the follow up shots are extremely quick and in call.

Recognizing that more than half my kills are sub 300 yards at dusk, SFP has always been better for me.

I’m not saying it hasn’t been successful or that you should switch. I’m saying that there is a difference in speed and successful outcomes between SFP and FFP, and MOA versus Mil; and thinking in inches instead of using the reticle to measure is a very suboptimal way to go.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

It is an educated guess, one of the ways to bring success percentage up in that case, is that when you do miss call the wind, the follow up shots are extremely quick and in call.

This is exactly where dialing would be less effective for both wind and elevation.

 

[Dobermann]

My question is ... why are we even asking this question in 2022?

 

[Justin Crossley]

My question is ... why are we even asking this question in 2022?

I guess with eight pages of discussion, it's still an interesting topic to most shooters. It's also just about 50/50 as far as what people prefer to use.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

My question is ... why are we even asking this question in 2022?

1. Peoples brains work differently.
2. That’s why you can choose from 3 different units of measure on ballistics calculators (moa/mil/inches).
3. So people need to talk about things before trying themselves and seeing what makes most sense for them.

It’s a more dynamic subject than the poll suggests.