Unraveling puzzles

[Pony Soldier]

This year has been a particularly difficult year to corner an elk. I spent 31 days on horseback and foot searching drainage by drainage in an area roughly 12 miles by 30 miles. It didn't help but where we usually have snow for tracking, we would get a dusting and then it would melt off by the afternoon. Tracks would appear and then fade out on the south slopes.

When I would find tracks they were linear traveling from drainage to drainage without feeding or bedding. The next day picking them up in the next drainage following the same pattern but a day behind.

I even had a herd show up in my north field but instead of feeding through as usual, they were balled up and on alert. They went west then came back east and finally lined out and traveled north. Very odd behavior.

Migration patterns have been severly disrupted. I haven't figured if it is from lack of weather or what. However a day or so ago I was wandering around my barnyard and saw a disturbance in the snow/crust that looked similar to a cow elk track but was indistinct. I followed it around where I could find it and finally got to a spot where I could tell what it was. The track was from a mtn lion. The night before my dogs barked for hours and couldn't be quieted. The cat tracks walked right past my kennels, on my front deck, around my horse trailers and barn. Very disturbing! The cat does not appear to have fear of anything.

I started to dig in my recent memory and remembered seeing cat tracks in 5 of 7 drainages. I think I now know why the elk were so hard to corner for the entire season.

 

[Beendare]

Yep. They have to stay on the move.

 

[Marble]

I was thinking there was some odd pressure on the elk, causing them to behave a little differently. Could be predator or hunters, but after reading the entire thing, seems like p predator issue.

Any other hunters you were competing with?

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[Ucsdryder]

This year has been a particularly difficult year to corner an elk. I spent 31 days on horseback and foot searching drainage by drainage in an area roughly 12 miles by 30 miles. It didn't help but where we usually have snow for tracking, we would get a dusting and then it would melt off by the afternoon. Tracks would appear and then fade out on the south slopes.

When I would find tracks they were linear traveling from drainage to drainage without feeding or bedding. The next day picking them up in the next drainage following the same pattern but a day behind.

I even had a herd show up in my north field but instead of feeding through as usual, they were balled up and on alert. They went west then came back east and finally lined out and traveled north. Very odd behavior.

Migration patterns have been severly disrupted. I haven't figured if it is from lack of weather or what. However a day or so ago I was wandering around my barnyard and saw a disturbance in the snow/crust that looked similar to a cow elk track but was indistinct. I followed it around where I could find it and finally got to a spot where I could tell what it was. The track was from a mtn lion. The night before my dogs barked for hours and couldn't be quieted. The cat tracks walked right past my kennels, on my front deck, around my horse trailers and barn. Very disturbing! The cat does not appear to have fear of anything.

I started to dig in my recent memory and remembered seeing cat tracks in 5 of 7 drainages. I think I now know why the elk were so hard to corner for the entire season.

You spent 31 days looking for elk. Was that in the pursuit of trying to kill an elk? If so, you get the 2024 perseverance award!

 

[Pony Soldier]

Not only that but I will pick up where I left off on the muzzie season for another 10 days. Some years it takes a substantial effort to get them cornered for a shot. I have two elk tags and struggle just to fill a cow tag at a minimum.

 

[Pony Soldier]

In remote blocks I hunt, I only cut man tracks twice and in both cases they turned back after two miles where I hunted 6-8 miles from the gate or trailhead. I never saw a blood trail or drag marks and only heard two shots in 31 days yet cut elk tracks every day except for three. It has been a tough season.

 

[Beendare]

I don't know the spots you are hunting.....so just a general comment.

I do think it's possible to hunt too remote. By the I mean some of that very high steep wilderness country just doesn't have the habitat those elk need. They like those big meadows...and in many of the areas I hunt they will feed in them at night and then move out by daylight.


I see more mule deer in that really rough stuff than elk. I elk hunted the continental divide on some hunts and yeah, the elk get pushed into those high pockets...but if it has that sparse rocky habitat, they don't spend much time there.

 

[jtevanMT]

Thanks for the update Pony Soldier, and sorry to hear you have had a tough season finding elk. Good luck during the muzzeloader season. Hopefully the weather this week will move more elk into your area.

Based on your previous posts, I think we hunt the same hunt unit in MT. For us, the elk patterns seemed normal and we harvested 2 bulls mid-season and saw several other legal bulls. We were not hunting as far into the back country (day hunts from vehicle with no horses). There were wolf and lion tracks in our hunting area, but that is normal the last 10 years. I am very concerned about the deer numbers. We see very few deer over the past few years, possibly the lions and wolves are having an impact on the deer also.

 

[Pony Soldier]

In north 318 mule deer are nearly extinct. In 350 tracks indicate maybe 5. I didn't make it to 380 south since I found ten in a winter kill pile a number of years ago.

The last time I was in 322 all I found was wolf tracks. Most of the deer died in 94 and have not recovered. I see whitetails during the summer on my ranch but haven't seen a mule deer in 5 years. When I moved there I had a local herd of 30 head. Mt fwp doesn't seem to care and still gives out 50 doe tags in 350.

The stuff I am hunting is mixed parks, wet meadows, and heavy timber. The nasty downfall is a challenge to me but the elk are starting to develop trails through the crud. I fear that some of the elk numbers are being limited by the shoulder season in 215 (winter range) while my hunting is focused on summer range and the transition zones.

I heard that fwp was starting some kind of study on kitties south of Butte. There might be hope. So far my summer observations indicate that the calf crop is near 100% and many yearlings are apparent in the spring.

A limiting factor this year was due to the drought most of the springs and streams in the upper country dried up and the elk seemed focused on the mid to lower elevations that were closer to water sources. With no snow this winter the options have been limited.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Not sure the options you have but I’d find somewhere else to hunt. Killing an elk shouldn’t be that hard!

If you’re hunting a spot with little pressure elk willl be out and about. Rather than covering miles on foot or horse, I’d be going from designated glassing to designated glassing spot and finding elk. As you know, they aren’t hard to find, especially if there’s snow on the ground. If they’re out there, and aren’t being hunted hard, they’ll be in meadows every morning and late afternoon until dark. Find them and kill them!

 

[Preston]

Not sure the options you have but I’d find somewhere else to hunt. Killing an elk shouldn’t be that hard!

If you’re hunting a spot with little pressure elk willl be out and about. Rather than covering miles on foot or horse, I’d be going from designated glassing to designated glassing spot and finding elk. As you know, they aren’t hard to find, especially if there’s snow on the ground. If they’re out there, and aren’t being hunted hard, they’ll be in meadows every morning and late afternoon until dark. Find them and kill them!

My thoughts too! IF I'm not finding them/sign in 4/5 days I'm moving spots. Sounds like some great trail riding, but if I want to kill an elk I'm glassing, still hunting timber, or tracking if there is snow.

 

[cnelk]

Gotta hunt where the elk are, not where you want them to be

 

[Pony Soldier]

Thanks guys but the glassable areas are already covered by 100s of razers with miles of clear cuts. They aren't shooting either. I have focused on the remote heavy timbered jungles with few if any observable openings close enough to access with 2-3 hours. My approach is to access trails and roads to cut travel patterns of the elk. The second day I hit the next access point/ drainage to look for their travel patterns. If I don't cut them then I focus on foot through the heavy timber between the two. A big meadow in this country in this country is 1 acre. I have some extensive meadows and parks in the area but you rarely find elk in them in the daylight. I think largely due to the intense pressure from the vehicles on the edges of the blocks.

I don't hunt until around 10 and focus on hunting them in their beds. I meet all the spotters going into town for breakfast. It has worked for 75 elk so I can't really justify joining the thousand with a spotting scope and a thousand yard gun.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Thanks guys but the glassable areas are already covered by 100s of razers with miles of clear cuts. They aren't shooting either. I have focused on the remote heavy timbered jungles with few if any observable openings close enough to access with 2-3 hours. My approach is to access trails and roads to cut travel patterns of the elk. The second day I hit the next access point/ drainage to look for their travel patterns. If I don't cut them then I focus on foot through the heavy timber between the two. A big meadow in this country in this country is 1 acre. I have some extensive meadows and parks in the area but you rarely find elk in them in the daylight. I think largely due to the intense pressure from the vehicles on the edges of the blocks.

I don't hunt until around 10 and focus on hunting them in their beds. I meet all the spotters going into town for breakfast. It has worked for 75 elk so I can't really justify joining the thousand with a spotting scope and a thousand yard gun.

Fair. Just going off what you wrote, which sounds like it isn’t working anymore due to predation, competition, or something else.

I will say, sometimes the kill isn’t the fun part and it sounds like you’re loving the process!

 

[Pony Soldier]

Ucsdryder. A component of my hunting is filling the freezer with my winter meat just like getting in my winters wood and putting up my hay crop. Another component is analysing the travel patterns of the elk given the weather. Another is working my way through the habitat of varius drainages and elevations. With that comes exploration of places I haven't been before. A couple of trips and I lose interest in that spot and its time for a new view. As an engineer, I am continuously exploring and unraveling puzzles. Variety is a serious component.