thermarest Z-lite/nemo switchback pad question

[roosiebull]

i realize the shortcomings of closed cell foam sleeping pads, but i like their reliability, but have never used one... besides bulk, and some compromise in comfort, are there any real downsides?

i hate leaky pads, and i don't like the thought of cold, uncomfortable nights with a pad that leaks.... i'm considering going to a closed cell for September hunting (probably the Nemo switchback) and may get 2 of them just to have. has anyone doubled up on close cell foam pads in cold weather? the R-value of one is 2-ish, but i think doubling them up would make more than an R-value of 4, am i wrong in that thinking?

most of me just wants to get a good, lightweight inflatable pad with an R-value of 4+ and just use it for everything, but part of me likes the whisker biscuit like bomb proof nature of a closed cell foam pad.... 2 of them would be bulkier than a warm inflatable pad, but wouldn't be much different in weight (they are 14oz each)

i'm not a very picky sleeper, as long as i'm warm enough, and i'm not laying straight hard ground, i'm good to go, i would pick reliability over comfort..... any feedback from those who have used a closed cell pad? if i'm being dumb considering it, don't worry about offending me and tell me i'm dumb.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

When combining pads, you can add their r-ratings to get a "final" r-rating. So "2+2=4".

Originally I grabbed a Therma-a-Rest Z-Lite pad to sleep on. It sucked as the padding is not that effective, at least on hard rocky ground. I can only imagine how bad it would be for a larger person. My X-Therm is much more comfortable to sleep on and takes a lot less space in the pack.

I cut that Z-Lite pad into 2 pieces (3/4 and 1/4 length). The longer piece goes with me when chasing Coues. It primarily gets used only for either a rear rest or a shooting mat (something to throw over cactus laying on the ground).

Folded up the Z-Lite pads are huge; 20"x5.5"x5". Two of them would down right suck to carry especially if taking other gear. For the size of the Z-Lite I could bring two X-Therms and still have room left over (yes more weight but much easier to pack).

 

[Drenalin]

I had never used an inflatable pad before a few years ago...was always closed cell foam before that. I've had the same roll-up 1/2 or 5/8 pad since it was issued to me in 2000. Besides being bulky they're fine, but that probably depends a lot on what you're used to. I moved to inflatable to save bulk, and because I thought I needed to when I switched to a quilt. I can't seem to find an inflatable I like, so I'm considering going back.

I'm wondering about a Seek Outside Mat Face, or whatever it's called, under another 3/4 length CCF pad. I think you could fold the SO thing up and cram it just about anywhere, just not sure how much R-value it adds doubled up under another pad.

 

[Kevin_t]

The switchback is a better pad than the Zlite.

I have very rarely, ever committed to going full air pad. I've had problems with the 3 -4 times so most of the time I take a CCF pad of some sort. Sometimes, I simply double CCF pads , but usually I use a Prolite Torso with the closed cell. The Nemo Switchback IMO is the best CCF , although I wish it came in a 25 inch. That combination, for me allows a lot of flexibility .. more so backpacking than hunting. Throw the CCF pad out in the day, fold it tight and its a little chair etc ..

 

[Coopsdaddy]

What about the ridge rest in wide?

 

[justinspicher]

I just picked up a Nemo pad and I am looking forward to using it. I quit using air mats years ago because they always leak on me and I just ended up being pissed off. I fold them in half and stick them between my frame and pack and I can get it out easily for a glassing pad. Can’t do that with an airmat.

 

[swanny]

If you value sleep, comfort, and recovery you'll stick with an airmat and get a CCF to place under your foam mat for additional R-Value and protection. If you enjoy waking up stiff, sore, and beat up then go ahead and sleep on the CCF.

 

[roosiebull]

The switchback is a better pad than the Zlite.

I have very rarely, ever committed to going full air pad. I've had problems with the 3 -4 times so most of the time I take a CCF pad of some sort. Sometimes, I simply double CCF pads , but usually I use a Prolite Torso with the closed cell. The Nemo Switchback IMO is the best CCF , although I wish it came in a 25 inch. That combination, for me allows a lot of flexibility .. more so backpacking than hunting. Throw the CCF pad out in the day, fold it tight and its a little chair etc ..

Appreciate the insight/feedback. This is kind of the same mindset I’m having right now, was wondering if anyone actually preferred a system like yours

 

[roosiebull]

When combining pads, you can add their r-ratings to get a "final" r-rating. So "2+2=4".

does it actually work like that? i was wondering if double layers would go up more exponentially than just double? that was part of my question, never tried it.

i'm not heavily leaning one way or the other right now.... wish there was a place close that i could see a lot of pads in person, if there was a good quality air pad that looked easy to patch, it would be an easier choice.

i don't like leaky pads, and i think around here it's pretty hard to avoid..... lots of salmonberry and devil's club, with all of those tiny stickers laying around you can't see, and then the pinholes you do get are difficult to locate and fix.

just considering a tougher setup, realizing there is some compromise either way. i will probably buy a switchback and try it and go from there.

 

[Kevin_t]

does it actually work like that? i was wondering if double layers would go up more exponentially than just double? that was part of my question, never tried it.

i'm not heavily leaning one way or the other right now.... wish there was a place close that i could see a lot of pads in person, if there was a good quality air pad that looked easy to patch, it would be an easier choice.

i don't like leaky pads, and i think around here it's pretty hard to avoid..... lots of salmonberry and devil's club, with all of those tiny stickers laying around you can't see, and then the pinholes you do get are difficult to locate and fix.

just considering a tougher setup, realizing there is some compromise either way. i will probably buy a switchback and try it and go from there.

Well .. I come close to preferring the setup .. I try others .. and I find some super comfy .. but ultimately I can really trust this setup

 

[Trees91]

I use the full length version and cut a couple folds off. Keep the short piece as a sit pad/shooting rest strapped to my pack and the long half stays at the tent for a sleeping pad. They're not comfy, if you're a side sleeper get ready for numb hips and shoulders. If I'm not packing far or not worried about cactus needles I really like having my air pad...ends up being a much better night of sleep.

 

[schwaf]

I use a Nemo switchback and an air pad, usually the Nemo Tensor. I find it's the best of both worlds, although a little heavy and bulky. The ccf protects the pad, adds cushion, prevents the cold ground from affecting temps, and is a good back up for leaky pads. The durability and versatility of ccf pads make them worth carrying, but air pads are undeniably more comfortable. I was tired of dealing with airpads failing, so I just carry both now. Even if the airpad leaks, if it holds any air throughout the night, it's still a pretty comfortable night.

 

[roosiebull]

Well, I just kept it easy for now and got a neoair xlite, and will get the Nemo switchback to try at some point, and that will give me my answer for the future.

I know sleep systems are very individual…
I’m probably pretty far at the “not picky sleeper” end of the spectrum, as long as I’m not freezing or straight on hard bumpy ground, I sleep fine

 

[alaskabound]

I made the switch years ago after my pad went flat and I'll probably never go back.

 

[lefthandedasian]

I think I mimic most others with the ccf and it's reliability. Sucks hiking in 15 miles and having a pinhole ruin the trip. Ccf if just so reliable. Might not be the comfiest, but it's light and durable.