The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom

There's 66 books in the bible. What other 7 books are your referencing? Honestly curious, not trying to be a douche

The Catholic Church compiled and translated all the writings to create the Bible in late 300's, every Bible published until around 1885 had everyone of those 73 books in them. Around 1885 7 of those books were removed to create different versions of Bibles for varies reasons, those reasons are well documented.
Essentially for about 1500 years after the Bible was translated and compiled by the Catholic Church, it was left in its original state, and that Bible with the original 73 books is the Bible the Catholic Church still uses today.
 
The Catholic Church compiled and translated all the writings to create the Bible in late 300's, every Bible published until around 1885 had everyone of those 73 books in them. Around 1885 7 of those books were removed to create different versions of Bibles for varies reasons, those reasons are well documented.
Essentially for about 1500 years after the Bible was translated and compiled by the Catholic Church, it was left in its original state, and that Bible with the original 73 books is the Bible the Catholic Church still uses today.
1500 years we all had them, and still today HALF of all Christianity have all 73 books

Shocked me when I first learned that

You don't know what you don't know
 
Coincidence or divine intervention? I've struggled with anger a lot in my life. This morning, I was praying to God, asking him to help me with my anger. The Bible and motivational speakers both say you should be careful who your friends are. They will influence your behavior. I've worked with this one guy for almost 20 years. I would say we have been on the same 12 hr shift for probably 15 of those 20. He is the angriest guy I know. Always yelling about politics or pretty much anything else. He's not a bad guy and I consider him a true friend, but he is toxic to be around for long periods of time. I thought of him this morning while I was praying and how if I switched shifts, it might be helpful to me working on this. A few hours later, my manager told me a guy quit on the other day shift and he asked me if I would be willing to change shifts. These "coincidences" always help reinforce my faith.

I had something similar happen last year. My wife and I were hiking in a wilderness area, and my dog took off. Every other time I take her; she never goes out of sight and always listens. I hiked around for about an hour, yelling for that dog. I was really having a difficult time with depression and that dog is my best buddy. I finally sat down on a log and just begged God to bring back my dog. As soon as I was done praying, my phone rang. My wife found the dog walking back to the car. I know both of these things could just be chance, and some of you will think I'm a simpleton but I don't believe in coincidence.
 
The understanding about Jesus and God is a issue not related to cognitive ability. A perfect example was brought up today.

Our visual system can be in perfect working order, and we can explain how that process works in perfect detail to anyone, but if we do not have light coming into our eyes, we can not see. If we live in total darkness, if we have blinders on, if we are wearing a filter over our eyes that prevents light coming in, we can not see.

Likewise with God, we need to have the light of God shine into us in order for us to see Him. We can have all the cognitive understanding, we can get all the knowledge, but until God shines on us, we cant see.

I say this with full knowledge that God is not shielding Himself from us, but it is always the opposite. So many have blinders on, or their heads buried, or are just living in darkness yet they don’t realize, since they live for themselves and are perfectly content to live in that reality.



There is the question of whether God can harden someones heart, and while i did not listen to the video that was presented in this thread on that topic, i think that is a question best suited for people above my pay grade. I do know God is omniscient and omnipotent and if He knows someone will never come around to seeing Him, then there might be situations where he does harden a heart to maximize benefit for His people. However, like i said, that is above my paygrade, and beyond the scope of this post/thread.
 
A couple times I know God was active in my life.

All last week I’ve been just buried at work, coming into this weekend it was my turn to cover nights from Thursday to Sunday. It also collided with another massive project on days over the weekend and into next week. I called my boss and told him the situation, but he really didn’t seem to bother much. I turned to prayer, asking for help, strength and guidance. Out of the blue on Thursday, another supervisor calls and tells me he’ll take the weekend duty if I take his next weekend. Just like that, it’s answered prayers.

A few years ago, I was on day 7 of a hunt. It was first thing in the morning and I came across a great buck. My shot blew out his front shoulder and the tracking was on. As I followed him through the snow, tracks and blood he created a small ridge onto a southwest slope. The blood dried up and the snow melted off. I was literally on my hands and knees looking for over turned leaves and broken blades of grass. After awhile I found myself sitting on a rock asking God why. Why would you let me see such a great buck, hit him and then loose him? Why? It’s tearing me up inside. A very real sense of peace over came me and a very soft and gentle voice came into my head that said “keep going”. After I picked up my own self pity party I came to a fence, following the fence looking for blood on the opposite side, I came upon a very small bench and not 35 yards away laying down, there he was-looking directly at me. I put another in his neck and that was it. It wasn’t 5 minutes after I heard His voice, the deer was dead.

I have so many other times in my life where I know God is there. Some are incredibly private and personal, some I’ll share for all the world to hear.

Coincidence aren’t real, what your experiencing is the presence of God in your life.
 
The Catholic Church compiled and translated all the writings to create the Bible in late 300's, every Bible published until around 1885 had everyone of those 73 books in them. Around 1885 7 of those books were removed to create different versions of Bibles for varies reasons, those reasons are well documented.
Essentially for about 1500 years after the Bible was translated and compiled by the Catholic Church, it was left in its original state, and that Bible with the original 73 books is the Bible the Catholic Church still uses today.
I didn't know this. I'm going to have to look into this. I knew there was books that they left out but I didn't realize it was as late as 1885. Thank you
 
If you don't believe, just listen to this man. Sentenced to prison at 18 for 70 years. Had a near death experience. How do you explain experiences like this? Is he crazy? Had a dream? I'm just curious what you think. You have to click watch on YouTube I guess. It's a legit video and there's nothing inappropriate.

 
god sure works in wonderful ways I must say.

First, he saves @Plainsman79 from a rough work week.

Second (and more impressive I must say), he converts a pagan to a god fearing person , who will not be taken during the second coming, whereas I am dead meat.

Here's another example of god's wonderfulness after watching the Red Sox and Dodgers tonight: he helps players get base hits as evidenced by them looking to the heavens and pointing skyward with their finger.

I have to ask another question although few of mine get even one awswer: Any of you god fearing folks gonna let the enlightened pagan in when he comes knocking on your door at 10PM, or heck just about anytime?


Eddie
 
This one is my favorite.

Ezekiel 25:17

"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you."
 
god sure works in wonderful ways I must say.

First, he saves @Plainsman79 from a rough work week.

Second (and more impressive I must say), he converts a pagan to a god fearing person , who will not be taken during the second coming, whereas I am dead meat.

Here's another example of god's wonderfulness after watching the Red Sox and Dodgers tonight: he helps players get base hits as evidenced by them looking to the heavens and pointing skyward with their finger.

I have to ask another question although few of mine get even one awswer: Any of you god fearing folks gonna let the enlightened pagan in when he comes knocking on your door at 10PM, or heck just about anytime?


Eddie

Sure.
 
On the day I cried out, you answered; you strengthened my spirit.
Psalms 138:3

To many people see answered prayers as a fluke, a coincidence. In life no matter how you'd weight them on the scale of problems, big or small, every answered prayer is monumental in a person's life.
 
I believe in a book thousands of years in the making that has been shown to be accurate despite intense scrutiny, which talks of the origins of the universe and why we are here, gives a path to enlightenment and a way to live a life for others in love.

Your way says we are all here because at some point everything in the universe was in a single point in space, how this is possible no one can even fathom a guess, and it then all of the sudden blew up, cause unknown, and that explosion and the resultant reactions that happened created life as we know it with little to no understanding of how any of it actually happened other than to say “well, we are here so we must give our best guess”

Now you tell me who believes in magic and logic

Fun piece of history. At the time the big bang theory was adopted it was very scientifically controversial. Pope Pius XII pushed really hard for its acceptance as he felt it could coexist with creation from the bible while competing theories could not.

Not meant to weigh in either way, just a not so widely known little piece of history. Most people think creation and big bang are at odds but one of the significant factors on why thats the current working theory was because the church felt they were compatible.

Since the 1950s the catholic church also takes the position that evolution is factually correct and was the mechanism that god used to create. They do still work in Adam and Eve to maintain the doctrine of original sin.
 
The willingness of early Christians to suffer and die for their beliefs is powerful, but it doesn’t prove the resurrection happened.

Very good point.

I know guys who suffered and died in Iraq for the belief that Sadam had weapons of mass destruction he was about to use on us. Dosnt make it true.

Im not taking any position on the resurrection. But people believing in something sufficiently to die for it is a fairly common occurrence. If direct followers doing it was sufficient proof we should take a much closer look at what Jerry Jones was teaching as well.
 
god sure works in wonderful ways I must say.

First, he saves @Plainsman79 from a rough work week.

Second (and more impressive I must say), he converts a pagan to a god fearing person , who will not be taken during the second coming, whereas I am dead meat.

Here's another example of god's wonderfulness after watching the Red Sox and Dodgers tonight: he helps players get base hits as evidenced by them looking to the heavens and pointing skyward with their finger.

I have to ask another question although few of mine get even one awswer: Any of you god fearing folks gonna let the enlightened pagan in when he comes knocking on your door at 10PM, or heck just about anytime?


Eddie
You didn't answer my question. How do you explain that man's experience? What he saw during his near death experience. How it is like the experiences of thousands of other people. He didn't know anything about scripture and his experience lined up with it. I don't know if he actually changed his life, but assuming he did, why? There are even cases of people who were born blind who experienced sight during an NDE. They wake up from surgery and can tell the doctors what they looked like, color of clothing, what was in the room. They have no concept of vision or color but can describe everything. Even if you don't believe in God, I think it shows there is something after we die. People who grew up in India or Africa who have never heard of Jesus waking up talking about a man of light they eventually find to be Jesus. Psychedelics don't do this. There were theories about your body dumping DMT into your system at death causing these visions but how are they all so similar? I'm not trying to make you believe in anything, just how do you explain this phenomenon?

I watched that entire video. I wouldn't invite him into my house without knowing him personally. Seeing his past, I would be cautious he was running some kind of scam. I would have lunch with the guy. I would love to see if he has truly changed. When he described what happened to him when he "died", he was made to understand and personally feel the suffering he caused every person in his entire life. It sounded so awful, that I actually had some sympathy for him even though it's what we all deserve. If we all could experience that, we would be different people.

I don't know if God cares about baseball. He's created us all with certain talents that we should all use to the best of our ability. It shows glory to him, and I tell him how grateful I am for what he has given me all the time. I could have been born with severe autism or without legs. I am blessed. When players point up, I hope they are giving a nod to God that it's him, not them that gave them the ability to hit a home run. Not that they have been granted a wish from some genie in the sky. That's about the best I can explain it. I'm not trying to convince you, it's just what I believe.
 
Very good point.

I know guys who suffered and died in Iraq for the belief that Sadam had weapons of mass destruction he was about to use on us. Dosnt make it true.

Im not taking any position on the resurrection. But people believing in something sufficiently to die for it is a fairly common occurrence. If direct followers doing it was sufficient proof we should take a much closer look at what Jerry Jones was teaching as well.
I know you are talking about early Christians but the original 12 Apostles didn't just believe it. They knew if Christ was resurrected or not. They were there. They all denied Jesus and left him to be crucified. After the resurrection they were willing to be tortured and killed and never denied him once. Nobody willingly dies for a lie. Do you think a Muslim would blow themselves up for Allah if they knew their entire religion was a lie? Belief and knowing are two different things. I think the reaction of the Apostles is the best proof of the resurrection.
 
I know you are talking about early Christians but the original 12 Apostles didn't just believe it. They knew if Christ was resurrected or not. They were there. They all denied Jesus and left him to be crucified. After the resurrection they were willing to be tortured and killed and never denied him once. Nobody willingly dies for a lie. Do you think a Muslim would blow themselves up for Allah if they knew their entire religion was a lie? Belief and knowing are two different things. I think the reaction of the Apostles is the best proof of the resurrection.
“Nobody dies for a lie”. Actually they do. Heaven’s Gate cult, Jonestown, Japanese kamikaze pilots Muslim extremists being a few examples.
 
You didn't answer my question. How do you explain that man's experience? What he saw during his near death experience. How it is like the experiences of thousands of other people. He didn't know anything about scripture and his experience lined up with it. I don't know if he actually changed his life, but assuming he did, why? There are even cases of people who were born blind who experienced sight during an NDE. They wake up from surgery and can tell the doctors what they looked like, color of clothing, what was in the room. They have no concept of vision or color but can describe everything. Even if you don't believe in God, I think it shows there is something after we die. People who grew up in India or Africa who have never heard of Jesus waking up talking about a man of light they eventually find to be Jesus. Psychedelics don't do this. There were theories about your body dumping DMT into your system at death causing these visions but how are they all so similar? I'm not trying to make you believe in anything, just how do you explain this phenomenon?

I watched that entire video. I wouldn't invite him into my house without knowing him personally. Seeing his past, I would be cautious he was running some kind of scam. I would have lunch with the guy. I would love to see if he has truly changed. When he described what happened to him when he "died", he was made to understand and personally feel the suffering he caused every person in his entire life. It sounded so awful, that I actually had some sympathy for him even though it's what we all deserve. If we all could experience that, we would be different people.

I don't know if God cares about baseball. He's created us all with certain talents that we should all use to the best of our ability. It shows glory to him, and I tell him how grateful I am for what he has given me all the time. I could have been born with severe autism or without legs. I am blessed. When players point up, I hope they are giving a nod to God that it's him, not them that gave them the ability to hit a home run. Not that they have been granted a wish from some genie in the sky. That's about the best I can explain it. I'm not trying to convince you, it's just what I believe.
NDEs. Hindus often see Yama or Krishna. Buddhists experience reincarnation themes. Christians see Jesus. That’s not objective proof of an afterlife, it’s strong evidence that NDEs are brain-based experiences shaped by a person’s religion, upbringing and culture.
 
Death for a cause. This is a huge topic, but in a nutshell here's my thoughts and questions. Why would someone be willing to die say by suicide? There's no cause there, they just want to die, most have had traumatic life events happen that make them not want to deal with the pain. Most suicide bombers and kamikazes generally fall into that spectrum, or the second is to take as many enemies lives as they can that are fighting against their cause.
The disciples didn't go down in a blaze of glory taking others with them, they didn't get murdered in a day, this was a lead up to. Beatings, stoned, locked up in prison, starved, and they kept preaching and spreading the word, the only way they could be stopped spreading that word was by killing them.

I ask this simple question, that we likely can't answer, but it's a thought provoking question regardless. If I took a suicide bomber or a kamikaze and told them they had to go from town to town and spread the message of what they're going to do publicly for a few years, be beaten, stoned, and imprisoned for a few years before they could follow through, would they? History says, no. They hide in the darkness, secretly plotting, and do a surprise attack.

To me, it's a huge difference.
 
Death for a cause. This is a huge topic, but in a nutshell here's my thoughts and questions. Why would someone be willing to die say by suicide? There's no cause there, they just want to die, most have had traumatic life events happen that make them not want to deal with the pain. Most suicide bombers and kamikazes generally fall into that spectrum, or the second is to take as many enemies lives as they can that are fighting against their cause.
The disciples didn't go down in a blaze of glory taking others with them, they didn't get murdered in a day, this was a lead up to. Beatings, stoned, locked up in prison, starved, and they kept preaching and spreading the word, the only way they could be stopped spreading that word was by killing them.

I ask this simple question, that we likely can't answer, but it's a thought provoking question regardless. If I took a suicide bomber or a kamikaze and told them they had to go from town to town and spread the message of what they're going to do publicly for a few years, be beaten, stoned, and imprisoned for a few years before they could follow through, would they? History says, no. They hide in the darkness, secretly plotting, and do a surprise attack.

To me, it's a huge difference.
I think the point @go_deep is trying to convey in this topic is that yes people will die for whatever just cause they believe in BUT people do not willingly die for a lie meaning the disciples and Christians of the early church who witnessed the miracles and truth of Jesus Christ wouldn’t willingly put themselves through torture and death for a lie they witnessed first hand.
 
Back
Top