The Argali Clothing Project

[Bump79]

I dont have a price point yet. Ive never used Kutanas so cant compare to them. the fabric on the Vesper is soft, comfortable and quiet.

I just submitted my feedback and thought I'd share it here to keep the thread going. Some of it might not apply and is just my rambles.

Here's my biggest gripe.. please for the love of god, enough with the excessive pockets on every piece. I don't need a total of 30 pockets between all of my layers.

Tops:
Chest pockets are unusable IMHO as stuff gets buried layering. Almost everyone is wearing a bino harness and I don't need a chest pocket in my base layer, fleece, active insulation, puffy and shell. I can't for the life of me figure it out. It's just an added cost for no benefit. My Sitka 120 merino that I love - has a double layer on the chest for this pocket for no reason. So it's a 240 on one side of chest.

I LOVE a generous front zip on my tops. Stone Glacier is a little excessive but it sure dumps heat. Maybe a inch or two shorter.

I don't like the crazy tight hood on my Sitka tops. But I like a slightly slimmer trim on it. I like to use a hoodie year round. Outer layer early with a hood for sun, then it just turns into a base layer. I wear these almost every day through the fall/winter casually.

Pants:
Please don't put zippers on the normal front pocket (looks like you don't). Especially the weird angled zippered ones. Just make it a normal front pocket that is easy enough to get my phone out when sitting.

All I need for pockets is two normal front and two thigh pockets. Maybe a dual combo thigh pocket like a Corrugate. I do not need a rear pocket in my pants. If anything one side - non zip. I don't want to feel it sitting.

Next - All pants need hip zips (looks like you do). Regardless of season. BUT make sure they have some sort of backer - my corrugate foundry with the plastic zippers feels so odd against the skin when I shed my base layers.

Integrated gaiters are weird. Integrated removable knee pads work ok sometimes but most of the time I don't like how the feel when they are out. I think I'd just get some to strap on for antelope stalking in the future.

I hate when a pant shooshes terrible. My buddy had some Kuiu Axis (I think) with the waterproof legs and they were so loud it was stupid. I understand there is a give and take with durability. It's just got to not be in the, damn this is loud category.

Merino pants suck. Just my opinion.. lack of durability is too much for little scent gain.


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[Brad@Argali]

I just submitted my feedback and thought I'd share it here to keep the thread going. Some of it might not apply and is just my rambles.

Here's my biggest gripe.. please for the love of god, enough with the excessive pockets on every piece. I don't need a total of 30 pockets between all of my layers.

Tops:
Chest pockets are unusable IMHO as stuff gets buried layering. Almost everyone is wearing a bino harness and I don't need a chest pocket in my base layer, fleece, active insulation, puffy and shell. I can't for the life of me figure it out. It's just an added cost for no benefit. My Sitka 120 merino that I love - has a double layer on the chest for this pocket for no reason. So it's a 240 on one side of chest.
View attachment 927453
I LOVE a generous front zip on my tops. Stone Glacier is a little excessive but it sure dumps heat. Maybe a inch or two shorter.

I don't like the crazy tight hood on my Sitka tops. But I like a slightly slimmer trim on it. I like to use a hoodie year round. Outer layer early with a hood for sun, then it just turns into a base layer. I wear these almost every day through the fall/winter casually.

Pants:
Please don't put zippers on the normal front pocket (looks like you don't). Especially the weird angled zippered ones. Just make it a normal front pocket that is easy enough to get my phone out when sitting.

All I need for pockets is two normal front and two thigh pockets. Maybe a dual combo thigh pocket like a Corrugate. I do not need a rear pocket in my pants. If anything one side - non zip. I don't want to feel it sitting.

Next - All pants need hip zips (looks like you do). Regardless of season. BUT make sure they have some sort of backer - my corrugate foundry with the plastic zippers feels so odd against the skin when I shed my base layers.

Integrated gaiters are weird. Integrated removable knee pads work ok sometimes but most of the time I don't like how the feel when they are out. I think I'd just get some to strap on for antelope stalking in the future.

I hate when a pant shooshes terrible. My buddy had some Kuiu Axis (I think) with the waterproof legs and they were so loud it was stupid. I understand there is a give and take with durability. It's just got to not be in the, damn this is loud category.

Merino pants suck. Just my opinion.. lack of durability is too much for little scent gain.


.

You and I agree on a lot, and based on your comments I think you will really appreciate the subtle design choices we have made so far. I think a lot of brands add pockets just to make it look different. Drives me nuts. I also really dislike the mesh inner liner on thigh pockets, but that's just me. I don't mind a chest zip on a midlayer, but cute pockets just to create pockets is a pet peeve of mine.

I have been hyper-obsessed wtih making quiet pants with as little fabric rubbing as possible. I think you'll like both the Vesper and Torex for that reason.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Brad@Argali]

[mention]BradArgali [/mention] re Guide Air Fleece, agreed that “finding a balance between breathability, warmth and weight is tricky”.

Do you mind articulating more how the Guide Air Fleece balances those trade offs? I’m an active insulation nerd. I love the breathability of naked polartec alpha direct but it lacks durability. In my own testing, polartec power grid, while durable, is often not breathable enough. Same experience with most pieces that use primaloft active evolve.

I have always wanted a midlayer piece that feels like you’re in a running style quarter zip with the warmth of a traditional midlayer, but maybe that’s an impossible ask at this time..?


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I really appreciate this question because I'm also an active insulation nerd. I think Alpha or Evolve needs a backer like you mentioned for durability. And I also agree that powergrid is a great fabric but I can't wear it for high energy activities without sweating profusely. It has to be really cold for me to use it, or most active insulations. I am working on a piece that uses Primaloft Evolve, but I'll talk more about that piece at a later date.

I went away from a grid fleece for a long time but eventually came back to using it regularly because it is something I can wear throughout most of the year for warmth and concealement for bow hunting with a good hood. Whereas with an alpha or evolve piece, unless it is super light, I find that it's just too warm to move around in much unless it is colder outside (Mid October and later). I also like the durability and quiet nature of the face on our Guide Air fleece as compared to a backer fabric for an Alpha or Evolve, which is gong to have at least a little noise to it.

I'm including a photo I took of our Guide Air Fleece from the inside of the garment looking at the sky. As you can see, the weave and the construction of the fabric has fairly wide air channels and is porous. I spent a fair amount of time working with our fabric mill to find a fabric that had the right balance of warmth and breathability (and then testing them) to create a midlayer that had a lot of versatility and could be used throughout the season. Let me know if you have mroe questions on this one.

 

[Robinhood21]

but I started Argali as a backcountry hunting brand because that is my passion and what I have a lot of experience doing.

This is exactly why I would be more apt to buy Argali then OV. I have nothing against them and think they are doing great things but I want to buy from a hunting brand focused on exactly that.

I just submitted my feedback and thought I'd share it here to keep the thread going. Some of it might not apply and is just my rambles.

Here's my biggest gripe.. please for the love of god, enough with the excessive pockets on every piece. I don't need a total of 30 pockets between all of my layers.

Tops:
Chest pockets are unusable IMHO as stuff gets buried layering. Almost everyone is wearing a bino harness and I don't need a chest pocket in my base layer, fleece, active insulation, puffy and shell. I can't for the life of me figure it out. It's just an added cost for no benefit. My Sitka 120 merino that I love - has a double layer on the chest for this pocket for no reason. So it's a 240 on one side of chest.
View attachment 927453
I LOVE a generous front zip on my tops. Stone Glacier is a little excessive but it sure dumps heat. Maybe a inch or two shorter.

I don't like the crazy tight hood on my Sitka tops. But I like a slightly slimmer trim on it. I like to use a hoodie year round. Outer layer early with a hood for sun, then it just turns into a base layer. I wear these almost every day through the fall/winter casually.

Pants:
Please don't put zippers on the normal front pocket (looks like you don't). Especially the weird angled zippered ones. Just make it a normal front pocket that is easy enough to get my phone out when sitting.

All I need for pockets is two normal front and two thigh pockets. Maybe a dual combo thigh pocket like a Corrugate. I do not need a rear pocket in my pants. If anything one side - non zip. I don't want to feel it sitting.

Next - All pants need hip zips (looks like you do). Regardless of season. BUT make sure they have some sort of backer - my corrugate foundry with the plastic zippers feels so odd against the skin when I shed my base layers.

Integrated gaiters are weird. Integrated removable knee pads work ok sometimes but most of the time I don't like how the feel when they are out. I think I'd just get some to strap on for antelope stalking in the future.

I hate when a pant shooshes terrible. My buddy had some Kuiu Axis (I think) with the waterproof legs and they were so loud it was stupid. I understand there is a give and take with durability. It's just got to not be in the, damn this is loud category.

Merino pants suck. Just my opinion.. lack of durability is too much for little scent gain.

Nailed it... all of it.


*** One big turnoff for me is "influencer based marketing". I get it but I hate it. It has completely steered me away from PEAX, Sitka & FL. SG is getting there also...

 

[Bojangles21]

What is your take on fleece over merino? I have both and use both extensively, just curious on why you chose fleece only?


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[Texasbuckeye]

@Brad@Argali do you have a y idea when the pants will be released for general consumption?

The quest for durable, quiet, comfortable pants is one many of us have been on for a long time….

Also, i appreciate the solid color scheme. I like being able to wear things (like expensive pants) for multiple roles

 

[Brad@Argali]

What is your take on fleece over merino? I have both and use both extensively, just curious on why you chose fleece only?


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I love merino for certain uses. I probably own a small sheep farm's worth of wool products. I use merino for my baselayers most of the time. BUT merino, particularly for warmer garments is heavy. Broadly speaking, you can get better warmth for the weight out of synthetics than you can with merino for midlayers and outerlayers. I have some midlayer merino pieces that I love wearing, but they are so much heavier than comparable midlayer synthetic pieces I own that give me the same warmth benefit. Merino also wets out faster and dries slowly compared to synthetics and typically isn't as durable for outerwear. Doesn't mean I don't like merino, it just has it drawbacks.

I will be making some merino products down the line for baselayers, but my focus is on creating an efficient clothing line that maximizes warmth while minimizing weight. And for that, it's pretty difficult to justify doing merino midlayers.

 

[Brad@Argali]

@Brad@Argali do you have a y idea when the pants will be released for general consumption?

The quest for durable, quiet, comfortable pants is one many of us have been on for a long time….

Also, i appreciate the solid color scheme. I like being able to wear things (like expensive pants) for multiple roles

Yes, will be available to purchase January '26, with product shipping around March.

 

[Jake Larsen]

The pants have my attention. From the photos and descriptions, they’re headed in the right direction. Two questions. Are you going built in belts?? (Please say yes!) Also, have you looked at a hook/elastic cuff to keep the leg opening secure around the boot? I’ve got a couple pairs of pants built for alpine climbing with that feature. I’ve used them for hunting a lot, and it’s awesome. Keeps a lot of debris out of the boots when crawling around on stalks and off trailing in steep/loose terrain.


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[Robinhood21]

I will be making some merino products down the line for baselayers, but my focus is on creating an efficient clothing line that maximizes warmth while minimizing weight. And for that, it's pretty difficult to justify doing merino midlayers.

I absolutely love merino & I wear nothing but Merino for baselayers. 2 weeks in Alaska with no shower and not smell like a restaurant dumpster in the middle of the summer... synthetic bases cant do that.

Mids are synthetic for the reasons you stated though.

 

[Brad@Argali]

I absolutely love merino & I wear nothing but Merino for baselayers. 2 weeks in Alaska with no shower and not smell like a restaurant dumpster in the middle of the summer... synthetic bases cant do that.

Mids are synthetic for the reasons you stated though.

I'm with ya. I love merino for baselayers.

 

[Brad@Argali]

The pants have my attention. From the photos and descriptions, they’re headed in the right direction. Two questions. Are you going built in belts?? (Please say yes!) Also, have you looked at a hook/elastic cuff to keep the leg opening secure around the boot? I’ve got a couple pairs of pants built for alpine climbing with that feature. I’ve used them for hunting a lot, and it’s awesome. Keeps a lot of debris out of the boots when crawling around on stalks and off trailing in steep/loose terrain.


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No plans for a built in belt. I have pants with and without them, and I can't say I like the built in belt personally, but I'm open to hearing what you think. I don't like the way the platic buckle feels under my hip belt. And I know what you mean on the hook connection to the boots as I have some pants with that as well. No plans as of now to do that. I'd be curious what others think on that, but I have not found it to be a feature I personally use if my pants are long enough.

 

[deserthunter2016]

@Brad@Argali is there a puffy in the works as well? Rain jacket?


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[Brad@Argali]

@Brad@Argali is there a puffy in the works as well? Rain jacket?


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Oh yeah. I have some killer jackets in the works now that I'm really excited about that I'll talk more about in a month or so. I want each piece we make to be intentional and well thought out, so rather than just dump a bunch of products at once where it might not be clear when and how they can be used or how they fit with other pieces we are making. We will roll out new products over time to make sure it's clear what each product is intended to do. Rain gear is a couple years out at this point, but puffy products are not far out.

 

[deserthunter2016]

Oh yeah. I have some killer jackets in the works now that I'm really excited about that I'll talk more about in a month or so. I want each piece we make to be intentional and well thought out, so rather than just dump a bunch of products at once where it might not be clear when and how they can be used or how they fit with other pieces we are making. We will roll out new products over time to make sure it's clear what each product is intended to do. Rain gear is a couple years out at this point, but puffy products are not far out.

Awesome. Sounds promising. For me I pack a SG Grumman and it’s pretty solid for a puffy, but am always looking for something better.

Rain gear is tough for me as well as others I’m sure. I’m not going to drop $200+ on a lightweight but not durable rain jacket for early season storms, but I also don’t want to pack a 24oz plus full blown rain jacket when I don’t need it. Something in the middle would be what I am looking for.

I don’t own one, but the Kuiu Kutana is what fits that need based off of my research. Don’t like the goofy ass zip vents that FL has put on their new rain gear, and for the most part FL gear is heavier than I like it to be as well. I don’t need pockets on rain pants just to look cool and add weight, then again I don’t hunt Alaska or coastal areas where I needed heavy duty rain pants anyhow.


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[Jake Larsen]

No plans for a built in belt. I have pants with and without them, and I can't say I like the built in belt personally, but I'm open to hearing what you think. I don't like the way the platic buckle feels under my hip belt. And I know what you mean on the hook connection to the boots as I have some pants with that as well. No plans as of now to do that. I'd be curious what others think on that, but I have not found it to be a feature I personally use if my pants are long enough.

I’ll be honest, I won’t even consider pants without a built in belt anymore. Check out the way Arcteryx does theirs on the Beta pant. Stone glacier also has a pretty good one on their pants. I never feel a properly designed built in, and it solves the problem of the waist stretching/changing over the course of a longer backpack hunt. Funny enough, the feeling of the buckle is the exact reason I can’t do a pant without a built in belt. I’ve never found a belt that will stay comfortable under my pack waist belt, and I’ve spent a bunch of money on some of the best out there, including yours.

I like the hook on the bottom of the pants, but it works out way better if it’s combined with an elastic band/cuff around the heel of the leg opening.


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[lil' bear]

Hopefully no thigh pockets

 

[Robinhood21]

Not a built in belt guy. I think the Marsupial Gear belt is as good as it gets.

 

[Brad@Argali]

Hopefully no thigh pockets

You'll have to sell me on that on! Where do you put your cell phone?

 

[Jaden Bales]

I've got use the Vesper pants on a few backcountry fishing trips this summer. The fabric is relatively light, but thus far they seem pretty durable (I had a few tumbles getting into two trailless lakes ).

Weight on my 34" is 15 oz, my Sitka Ascents weigh 12.5 oz, but have no zip zips or rear pockets—the fabric weight and breathability seems pretty similar.

One day the temps were pushing 80° , that feels about the upper limit for me (that's with the side zips fully open)—any warmer I'd prefer shorts or a really light pair of pants. I experienced a couple of days with light rain and appeared there is some dwr, as the water beaded up—heavier rain I'm sure I would have been soaked.

I'm normally a 33 if it's offered, so opted for 34—I'm 99% sure 32 would have been too tight.

Like @Jaden Bales I found the inseam to be a little long; in visiting with Brad he doesn't plan at this time a tall length so would rather have them a little long vs a little short. I'm 5'11 185 for reference.

The zippered pockets are roomy and easy to get to. The side vents are easy to open/close. The rear pockets don't have zippers but instead a fabric overhang which still keeps stuff in your pockets.

So far so good

Awesome man! Yeah, totally agree. Rather have em a little long every day of the week. Great to hear your experience so far.